I also posted this on the "other" forum, so it may be a repeat for some of you....

4th and 5 from the 50. K1 legally punts the ball. The ball hits the ground at the R-15 and then bounces just over R1's shoulder (i.e. the ball never touched him). K2 and R2, thinking R1 has touched the ball, dive for it. After the ball comes to rest K2 is the first to touch the ball as he muffs it at the R-10 towards R's goal line. The ball comes to rest again at the R-5 where R2 then muffs it into and through R's end zone. Primarily looking for the NF ruling, but feel free to add NCAA if you like (just specify which).

Touchback.

Wait a minute...
 

Please read rule 4-2-2-f. Federation rules.

R's ball 1st and 10 at R's 10 yard line.

Remember R did not touch the scrimmage kick beyond the neutral zone. The kick came to rest and K was the first to touch the ball beyond the neutral zone.

At least this is the best answer according to how PSU's case play is worded.

[Edited by Mike Simonds on Sep 26th, 2003 at 02:13 PM]

Technically, Mike, your right...
 

but I would have to see how "long the ball was at rest" without any player attempting to possess it before blowing my whistle! The ball hits at the R15 and comes to "rest" at the R10 and in between time two players are going for the ball - sounds like play on - Touchback.

Re: Technically, Mike, your right...
 

That's not what I was describing. The ball is untouched by R. It has come to rest beyond the NZ. As soon as K touches it, this is a dead ball at that spot, no matter how long it has been at rest. It also does not matter if anyone is trying to secure possession. Read the rule the Mike cited.

Touchback?
 

I am going to change this a little....

4th and 5 from the 50. K1 legally punts the ball. The ball hits the ground at the R-15 and then bounces just over R1's shoulder (i.e. the ball never touched him). K2 and R2, thinking R1 has touched the ball, dive for it. The ball is still rolling K2 is the first to touch the ball as he muffs it at the R-10 towards R's goal line where The ball comes to rest again at the R-5 where R2 then muffs it into and through R's end zone.

PSU is correct on a ball at rest first touched by K, but what if the ball never came to rest? The way I see it is that R has two choices, the spot of first touching or they would be subject to a safety. Didn't they supply the force into the end zone?

Re: Touchback?
 

Their 2 choices are the spot of first touching or a touchback (if the spot of first touching is inside the 20 we will probably not even ask them where they want it--we will just put the ball at the 20). A kick is kick until a player possesses it or it otherwise becomes dead. Neither happened here, so it's still a kick. Force is never a factor on kicks entering R's EZ, even if the ball has come to rest--such kicks are always touchbacks.

[Edited by PSU213 on Sep 28th, 2003 at 11:33 PM]

Dumb me...
 

I was laying in bed, about to go to sleep when I realized what I posted was wrong. Kicks into the endzones are always touchbacks no matter who supplies force. What was I thinking??

I also have a touchback.