Fan distracting players

jodibuck

In a high school game, a parent sitting behind the backstop is calling out to each batter where the catcher is setting up for each pitch. Fans from the opposing team start yelling at this person to stop. Should the umpire stop the game and address this situation?

CecilOne

jodibuck wrote
In a high school game, a parent sitting behind the backstop is calling out to each batter where the catcher is setting up for each pitch. Fans from the opposing team start yelling at this person to stop. Should the umpire stop the game and address this situation?

If you consider it coaching from out of dugout, yes.
If it is affecting the players/game, probably.
If it is inflammatory, yes.

Andy

CecilOne wrote
If you consider it coaching from out of dugout, yes.

Go to the head coach of the offensive team and tell him his "coach" needs to be in the dugout or stop.

CecilOne wrote
If it is affecting the players/game, probably.
If it is inflammatory, yes.

Handle these by involving game management to intervene with the fans.

Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

jodibuck wrote
In a high school game, a parent sitting behind the backstop is calling out to each batter where the catcher is setting up for each pitch. Fans from the opposing team start yelling at this person to stop. Should the umpire stop the game and address this situation?

I do not care! Is the fan threatening you, your partner, or any participant in the game with violence? No. Forget it and keep the game moving.

MTD, Sr.

MD Longhorn

Mark T. DeNucci, Sr. wrote
I do not care! Is the fan threatening you, your partner, or any participant in the game with violence? No. Forget it and keep the game moving.

MTD, Sr.

Except that it's illegal for a coach to be coaching from there.

CecilOne

Mark T. DeNucci, Sr. wrote
I do not care! Is the fan threatening you, your partner, or any participant in the game with violence? No. Forget it and keep the game moving.

MTD, Sr.

" Fans from the opposing team start yelling at this person to stop"
Do you really want to umpire and think the game will keep moving properly with that going on? 😮

youngump

CecilOne wrote
If you consider it coaching from out of dugout, yes.

What rule do you use to support this? They aren't team personnel. Only team personnel have to stay in the dugout no?

Tru_in_Blu

I'll preface my remarks by saying that I do a lot more ASA games than I do NFHS games.

That said, I think it would be easier to address on the HS level because of the game managers that are typically on site. My first conversation would be with the coach of the offending team.

The rules don't allow for players or coaches to be behind the backstop. If a parent/fan is being obnoxious, I'd ask the coach to address the behavior.

I understand that there's likely to be a split of opinion about what umpires should or should not do in these instances.

A well coached team could find ways around this. Of course all of this assumes that a pitcher can actually hit the target that the catcher is calling for. I know you've all done games where the pitcher isn't in the same zip code. In any case, a few faux outside targets that result in a bit of chin music will quickly put the parent's calls of pitch location in question. Again, assuming the pitcher actually has that kind of control.

I'll say I've had more issues w/ ASA games than HS games. I've only tried addressing issues on the other side of the fence a few times. One time my partner and I were discussing potential strategies between innings. The catcher must have overheard part of the conversation because on the next close pitch, our heckler started in again only to have the catcher turn toward the fence and yell out "Dad! Shut UP!" Now there's a catcher that knows how to call a game! 😉

CecilOne

youngump wrote
What rule do you use to support this? They aren't team personnel. Only team personnel have to stay in the dugout no?

If you consider it coaching

Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

MD Longhorn wrote
Except that it's illegal for a coach to be coaching from there.

Since when is a fan (in this case a parent) a coach. Do not go looking for problems that do not exist.

MTD, Sr.

bigsig

Had this exact issue in a HS game last year. I just turned to the parent and asked them to stop. They did. No issue.

AtlUmpSteve

CecilOne wrote
If you consider it coaching

If your State Association does not recognize that person as a coach, you don't have the authority to make their comments "coaching".

In my state, that person is not allowed in the team area, nor on the field. That makes him a fan, not a coach, and not subject to coaching restrictions. 🙁

CecilOne

AtlUmpSteve wrote
If your State Association does not recognize that person as a coach, you don't have the authority to make their comments "coaching".

In my state, that person is not allowed in the team area, nor on the field. That makes him a fan, not a coach, and not subject to coaching restrictions. 🙁

Gotcha.

ASA/NYSSOBLUE

Does your area have any kind of 'game management' present? Around here, schools are supposed to have some kind of personnel present to help out in situations like this. Here, I would go to the coach and them to get that person(s), and have them that those people need to follow the NYS Sportsmanship Rule - which includes spectators as well as players and coaches. If they persist, we then can have the game management to remove those people.

I actually had something like that twice this last volleyball season. Was working junior high level ball, when the visiting coaches came to me during the warm ups, and said a group of boys were making remarks to her players. Since we were in warm ups, I went right to the local game management - one an asst. principal, one an AD, and things got settled REAL quick. 😛

The point is that it is not your job to enforce things like that, but the host school. If they do NOT provide that proper and sporting setting, then as an official have the ultimate option of not playing if you think it is not conducive for fair play. But it will never go that far - hopefully, especially not in this game.

MD Longhorn

AtlUmpSteve wrote
If your State Association does not recognize that person as a coach, you don't have the authority to make their comments "coaching".

In my state, that person is not allowed in the team area, nor on the field. That makes him a fan, not a coach, and not subject to coaching restrictions. 🙁

And in mine they don't want any coaching going on from behind the catcher - from either team.

Moosie74

Mark T. DeNucci, Sr. wrote
Since when is a fan (in this case a parent) a coach. Do not go looking for problems that do not exist.

MTD, Sr.

Restrict them to the top row of the bleachers behind the crying child, this is the best penalty!

To the original poster though, quietly say to him, sir, I need you to return to your bench Oh sorry, I'm not a coach. Ok, well, then do me a favor just enjoy the game and let the coaches coach.

Quick, easy and no one is heated up

Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

Ladies and gentlemen! Why do so many of you want to go picking boogers and looking for problems where non exist.

I have officiated H.S. and college basketball for 44 years and H.S. soccer for 13 years, and umpired H.S. baseball and fast pitch softball umpire for 22 years.

I have been a basketball interpreter and instruction chairman and I have always taught new officials that are to ignore fans 99.999,999% of the time. The only time officials need to concern themselves with a fan's conduct is when a fan comes out onto the court or playing field, the fan physically attacks a participant, coach, or game official, or the fan threatens a participant, coach, or game official with physical violence.

I do not care that the parent (who is only a fan) is telling his child (or his child's teammates) what the catcher is doing. It is not the official's concern. That parent/fan paid his money and if he wants to shout instructions to his child or his child's teammates, that is his right.

An official who attempts to quiet a parent/fan will find no rules support. Game officials have more important things to concern himself with that parents/fans that are yelling instructions to their children.

With apologies to Nike: JUST DON'T DO IT!!

MTD, Sr.

EsqUmp

• Each umpire has authority to order a player, coach or team member or associate to do or refrain from doing anything that affects the administering of the rules and enforcing the prescribed penalties.
• Each umpire has authority to rule on any point not specifically covered in the rules. Each umpire will use common sense, good judgment and thoughtful reasoning based on the spirit of fair play when making rulings.

The short answer is this: Do what you think is right for the particular situation. There are a million scenarios and thousands of umpires. Don't let things escalate, but don't stick your nose in where it doesn't belong either.

"Never" and "Always" umpires are afraid to use common sense, good judgment and thoughtful reasoning; so, they either always do something or never do something. Evaluate the situation and address is in a manner you find appropriate for your particular case.

topper

MD Longhorn wrote
And in mine they don't want any coaching going on from behind the catcher - from either team.

I work some HS in your state. Would that be TASO or UIL that is saying this? Please cite where fans are considered coaches.

MD Longhorn

topper wrote
I work some HS in your state. Would that be TASO or UIL that is saying this? Please cite where fans are considered coaches.

I don't know that I've ever attended (or even heard of) a UIL clinic...

It's come up at more than one TASO meeting - not really calling fans coaches per se, but more along the lines of not allowing coaching to occur from directly behind the catcher, and keeping that area (where possible) as a kind of "neutral zone" if you will.

I think one example given was a Yates - Stafford game - visiting JV coach camped right behind the catcher dressed out of uniform and was coaching the kids on where the catcher set up. Home fans then decided they would do the same, and it came to pushing and shoving.

You have to admit that the ability to give players instruction from right there behind the plate is an advantage - I completely understand the desire to prevent that.