Batter Runner proceeds to second with R1 on first.

Robert E. Harrison

Fed Rules. Runner at first no outs. Batter hits a fly ball to CF (can of corn). Runner stays at 1st and the batter runner proceeds to 2nd. The 2nd baseman getting the throw from the center fielder turns and sees this runner and throws the ball toward 2nd. It is an overthrow to the right of home plate. Runner from first goes to 2nd.
Is this interference from a retired runner? Do I have to judge intent on this play or is it handled the same way whether intentional or not?

scarolinablue

Can of corn on this one for me, since I've got that T-shirt. I don't have the reference, but the FED interp is essentially this: It's up to the defense to know what is going on, and the situation you've described is NOT interference on the offense.

We have a local HS team that routinely does this under the guise of "hustle" - we're convinced as umpires here that they do it to try to draw a throw, but there is nothing illegal about the B/R running, even passing another runner. I issued the coach a friendly warning (it was a preseason tournament game - a glorified scrimmage) when I first saw them do it about three years ago, but after looking it up afterwards, found that it was not illegal.

It certainly doesn't look good, and usually looks intentional. Intent, as I recall, does not matter, and is especially hard to prove in this case.

mbyron

scarolinablue wrote
We have a local HS team that routinely does this under the guise of "hustle" - we're convinced as umpires here that they do it to try to draw a throw, but there is nothing illegal about the B/R running, even passing another runner.

I'm sure you mean nothing illegal about a retired runner passing a teammate. Otherwise, the BR would be out.

I can't find it in the book, but if FED follows OBR on this point, it is explicitly legal to continue to run the bases after being put out.

scarolinablue

Yep, meant a retired runner passing a teammate. Thanks for clarifying!

I know I've read a case play in FED on this very topic, but don't have my books with me. I assume it is still in there.

mbyron

scarolinablue wrote
I know I've read a case play in FED on this very topic, but don't have my books with me. I assume it is still in there.

I looked and didn't see it. Of course it might be there nonetheless...

Steven Tyler

Defense should be telling F4 "no runner", but trying to deke a throw as a retired batter should come under the heading of "unsportsmanlike like conduct". This is especially true if BU in B gives a clear and vocal declaration of that's a catch. The goofy basstard should be pulling up by then.

UmpJM

Fed case play 8.3.3I explicitly says it's legal.

kylejt

Left hand point, right hand hammer, "He's out!"

Whatever the defense does after that is on them.

scarolinablue

Huh...I actually forgot I had this team tonight, after discussing this today. And yes, they still do it...basically, they are coached to run everything out to (or at least past halfway) to second base on all balls, no matter how routine.

Didn't confuse the defense in tonight's game.

MrUmpire

Steven Tyler wrote
Defense should be telling F4 "no runner", but trying to deke a throw as a retired batter should come under the heading of "unsportsmanlike like conduct". This is especially true if BU in A gives a clear and vocal declaration of that's a catch. The goofy basstard should be pulling up by then.

So, what is the penalty for your make believe rule?

ozzy6900

MrUmpire wrote
So, what is the penalty for your make believe rule?

Mr. Tyler umpires in Fantasy Land where anything is possible if you just believe and click your red base shoes 3 times.

Steven Tyler

MrUmpire wrote
So, what is the penalty for your make believe rule?

I said *should* not *would*.

Are you trying to make a point, or trying to pick nits?

Steven Tyler

ozzy6900 wrote
Mr. Tyler umpires in Fantasy Land where anything is possible if you just believe and click your red base shoes 3 times.

Your posts usually read like this to me: BLAH, BLAH, BLAH, BLAH, BLAH, BLAH, BLAH, BLAH, etc.

Steven Tyler

scarolinablue wrote
Huh...I actually forgot I had this team tonight, after discussing this today. And yes, they still do it...basically, they are coached to run everything out to (or at least past halfway) to second base on all balls, no matter how routine.

Didn't confuse the defense in tonight's game.

This is more along the lines of what is common at the HS level. Just don't pass the runner if the ball isn't caught.

Matt

ozzy6900 wrote
Mr. Tyler umpires in Fantasy Land where anything is possible if you just believe and click your red base shoes 3 times.

I've actually seen red base shoes.

Before people get too much in a tizzy, it was a youth game with a high-school age umpire using his game cleats for his umpire shoes.

dileonardoja

Steven Tyler wrote
...This is especially true if BU in A gives a clear and vocal declaration of that's a catch.

On a can of corn????? Really???

Steven Tyler

MrUmpire wrote
So, what is the penalty for your make believe rule?

You're slipping there. I accidently used A instead of B for the position of the BU in my post, also.

Steven Tyler

dileonardoja wrote
On a can of corn????? Really???

And this wrong because...................?

Try this link. RID

SanDiegoSteve

Steven Tyler wrote
And this wrong because...................?

Try this link. RID

That link is wrong on so many levels.

The statement that you would give a clear and vocal declaration of catch on a can of corn, i.e. an obvious catch situation, is only wrong on one level.

Steven Tyler

SanDiegoSteve wrote
That link is wrong on so many levels.

The statement that you would give a clear and vocal declaration of catch on a can of corn, i.e. an obvious catch situation, is only wrong on one level.

Pardon moi for not being anally retentively challenged. Is it just tooooo much trouble to give a clenched fist, with a simple, "That's a catch"?