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Old Mon Mar 02, 2015, 02:32pm
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LeBron and Harden (Video)

Im not sure if this is the right forum for this but the Wrestling forum was no help. One minute left in OT, that no call. I don't know how to find the video sorry. If the NBA started releasing those reports already I would be curious to see the explanation.

If you didn't see it H13 crossed V23, V23 reached in and possibly fouled H13, H13 hooked V23 and dragged him about 8 feet, V23 grabbed H13 after dribble was terminated and caused him to travel, both players looked at the nearest official and asked for a call that wasn't going to be made so resumed fouling each other followed by one final foul by V23 on the desperation heave but was released after the Shot clock violation.

The play begins at 2:48 of this clip.

http://www.nbahooptroop.com/videos/cavaliers-vs-rockets
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Old Mon Mar 02, 2015, 02:41pm
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Old Mon Mar 02, 2015, 03:01pm
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Plays like that and the ensuing "no call" are one of the many reasons I don't watch the NBA anymore...all the while BOTH players are looking at the official begging for a call. Yuck.
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Old Mon Mar 02, 2015, 03:36pm
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Hold on LeBron. I'm not sure why this is that hard, really.
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Old Mon Mar 02, 2015, 03:41pm
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I was watching this live and couldn't believe no call was made on blue 23. It seems like a very clear foul.
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Old Mon Mar 02, 2015, 03:45pm
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Offensive foul on Harden if a foul is to be had. Harden hooks the defender's arm and tries to fool the official into thinking his arm was hooked.

Harden is especially adept at performing this maneuver and probably something the trail has seen on tape before.
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Old Mon Mar 02, 2015, 03:51pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by APG View Post
Offensive foul on Harden if a foul is to be had. Harden hooks the defender's arm and tries to fool the official into thinking his arm was hooked.

Harden is especially adept at performing this maneuver and probably something something he's seen on tape before.
He may have clamped down on the arm, but the fact that the defender's arm is there on an active ball handler is foul isn't it?
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Old Mon Mar 02, 2015, 04:07pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by APG View Post
Offensive foul on Harden if a foul is to be had. Harden hooks the defender's arm and tries to fool the official into thinking his arm was hooked.

Harden is especially adept at performing this maneuver and probably something something he's seen on tape before.
LeBron's arm didn't get there on its own. Stick a hand in the cookie jar, and...
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Old Mon Mar 02, 2015, 04:33pm
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Originally Posted by ballgame99 View Post
He may have clamped down on the arm, but the fact that the defender's arm is there on an active ball handler is foul isn't it?
Sure the arm may have been out there, but that doesn't give the opponent carte blanche to clamp that arm. If they showed a baseline camera, I wouldn't be surprised if the clamp occurred before there was contact by the defender. And if there was contact by the defender, it was marginal at best.

The tell tell sign that me that the offensive player is attempting to clamp in order to draw a foul is after the two initially separated...and he searches out the defender again clamps his arm and pull him in again in an attempt to draw a foul again.

I actually would have liked a travel call on the play.

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Originally Posted by Rich View Post
LeBron's arm didn't get there on its own. Stick a hand in the cookie jar, and...
I'll have to look for exactly where I read/heard this, but one of the things mentioned as a "fool the referee" action at this level is when a player pretends to be held when he is the actual one doing the holding.

Was the defender's arm out there? Sure...and if offensive player does a rip through move, then the defender is probably going to foul. But it would be a foul on the defender because the offensive player did a legal move. Clamping an arm is not a legal move.
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Old Mon Mar 02, 2015, 04:59pm
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I like the travel idea also. I don't have a foul on Lebron here either way.
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Old Mon Mar 02, 2015, 05:20pm
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League agrees...should have been an offensive foul first...then a defensive foul to cause a travel absent a call for the contact by the offensive player.

Comment: As Harden (HOU) starts his drive to the basket, he clamps the arm of James (CLE) and an offensive foul should have been called.


http://official.nba.com/wp-content/u...3/L2M-Mar1.pdf
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Chaos isn't a pit. Chaos is a ladder. Many who try to climb it fail and never get to try again. The fall breaks them. And some, given a chance to climb, they refuse. They cling to the realm, or the gods, or love. Illusions.

Only the ladder is real. The climb is all there is.

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Old Mon Mar 02, 2015, 06:17pm
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Eh, not the first time I've been wrong. Won't be the last, either.
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Old Tue Mar 03, 2015, 12:04pm
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Announcers nailed it!

For once, I agree with the announcers. That's got to be something ...

Offensive foul, double foul, or travel ... but no call there looks ridiculous and creates the impression that the official is afraid to make a call with the clock winding down.
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