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-   -   Backcourt or not (https://forum.officiating.com/basketball/98485-backcourt-not.html)

Rich1 Mon Oct 06, 2014 11:19pm

Backcourt or not
 
Trying to clarify a "ball has front court status" situation as we have been hotly debating it during training with new refs.

Player is dribbling from back court to front court and has both feet in the front court but is still bouncing the ball in the back court (it has not broken the plane of the mid-court line).

Player is dribbling from back court to front court and has both feet in the front court but is holding the ball extended into the back court (it has not broken the plane of the mid-court line).

What are your opinions on this?

AremRed Mon Oct 06, 2014 11:52pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rich1 (Post 941191)
Trying to clarify a "ball has front court status" situation as we have been hotly debating it during training with new refs.

Player is dribbling from back court to front court and has both feet in the front court but is still bouncing the ball in the back court (it has not broken the plane of the mid-court line).

Player is dribbling from back court to front court and has both feet in the front court but is holding the ball extended into the back court (it has not broken the plane of the mid-court line).

What are your opinions on this?

Play 1: No front court status. Three points (two feet plus ball) must be established in the front court while dribbling.

Play 2: Front court status. The three points rule does not apply when not dribbling the ball. When the ball is being held only the feet location matters.

just another ref Mon Oct 06, 2014 11:55pm

Unless I'm forgetting something, the plane of the division line has no significance in any play.

AremRed Mon Oct 06, 2014 11:57pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by just another ref (Post 941195)
Unless I'm forgetting something, the plane of the division line has no significance in any play.

It matters on the 10 second back court count, doesn't it?

Mark T. DeNucci, Sr. Tue Oct 07, 2014 12:23am

Quote:

Originally Posted by just another ref (Post 941195)
Unless I'm forgetting something, the plane of the division line has no significance in any play.


+10

MTD, Sr.

JetMetFan Tue Oct 07, 2014 01:06am

Quote:

Originally Posted by AremRed (Post 941196)
It matters on the 10 second back court count, doesn't it?

No. The ball has to touch something in the frontcourt to gain frontcourt status. If it's in the air from backcourt to frontcourt it retains the same status as when it was last in contact with a player or the court. (NFHS 4-4-3, NCAA 7-5-1.1).

Raymond Tue Oct 07, 2014 07:18am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rich1 (Post 941191)
...

Player is dribbling from back court to front court and has both feet in the front court but is holding the ball extended into the back court (it has not broken the plane of the mid-court line).

What are your opinions on this?

"Make up your mind, dude, is he gonna sh*t or is he gonna kill us?"

(Jeff Spicoli)

BatteryPowered Tue Oct 07, 2014 08:20am

Quote:

Originally Posted by AremRed (Post 941196)
It matters on the 10 second back court count, doesn't it?

I was told early on in my training "The ball and players are where they were until they get where they are going."

Seems to work fine...at least in my simple mind. :D

Adam Tue Oct 07, 2014 08:30am

Quote:

Originally Posted by AremRed (Post 941196)
It matters on the 10 second back court count, doesn't it?

The plane of the division line never has any significance.

letemplay Tue Oct 07, 2014 01:48pm

Officials aid?
 
Visualize that plane to make a straight toss on opening (and/or OT) tip?:D

BktBallRef Tue Oct 07, 2014 08:21pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rich1 (Post 941191)
Trying to clarify a "ball has front court status" situation as we have been hotly debating it during training with new refs.

Player is dribbling from back court to front court and has both feet in the front court but is still bouncing the ball in the back court (it has not broken the plane of the mid-court line).

When the dribbler is moving from BC to FC, the ball does not have FC status until both feet are in the FC and the ball is dribbled in the FC. If either foot is in the BC or the ball is still being dribbled in the BC, BC status still exists.

Quote:

Player is dribbling from back court to front court and has both feet in the front court but is holding the ball extended into the back court (it has not broken the plane of the mid-court line).
As someone else posted, you can't be dribbling the ball and holding it at the same time. If a player is holding the ball and neither foot is in the BC, the ball and player now have FC status.

Quote:

What are your opinions on this?
No opinion, these are facts.

And as others have said, the plane is of no consequence.

Camron Rust Wed Oct 08, 2014 02:20am

Quote:

Originally Posted by BktBallRef (Post 941284)
When the dribbler is moving from BC to FC, the ball does not have FC status until both feet are in the FC and the ball is dribbled in the FC. If either foot is in the BC or the ball is still being dribbled in the BC, BC status still exists.

And such a player may step back into the backcourt with one or both feet.

SamIAm Wed Oct 08, 2014 07:52am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adam (Post 941216)
The plane of the division line never has any significance.

I seem to recall re-tosses in jump ball situations where the ball was tossed poorly. (This is not the original topic, and not a big issue, but never and always, are highly suspect.)

What is used to determine a jump ball was thrown correctly by the official?

Adam Wed Oct 08, 2014 09:42am

Quote:

Originally Posted by SamIAm (Post 941298)
I seem to recall re-tosses in jump ball situations where the ball was tossed poorly. (This is not the original topic, and not a big issue, but never and always, are highly suspect.)

What is used to determine a jump ball was thrown correctly by the official?

That would be a straight line, not a plane. :) The toss could be completely within the plane and still horrible.

BryanV21 Wed Oct 08, 2014 10:00am

Quote:

Originally Posted by SamIAm (Post 941298)
I seem to recall re-tosses in jump ball situations where the ball was tossed poorly. (This is not the original topic, and not a big issue, but never and always, are highly suspect.)

What is used to determine a jump ball was thrown correctly by the official?

It's like pornography. I can't define it very well, but I know it when I see it.

I guess, basically, if one or both of the jumpers is at a disadvantage due to a bad toss it should be re-done.


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