Joey Crawford (Video)
 

VIDEO: Joey Crawford ices Kevin Durant on key free throw

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He corrected something...okay...and?

What's this "icing" nonsense? KD goes through the same routine every time he shoots a free throw. He got to start over from scratch.

This is a complete non-story.

At least Joey didn't have to go block Durant while he was shooting as another NBA ref did a few years ago. Imagine the posters...

But he did jump right in front of Steph Curry the other night on a three point attempt.

What did he correct? Just curious. Also anyone know if the correctable error time frame is the same in the NBA and NFHS?

Seems as though he was correcting a situation with the team fouls on the scoreboard.

And the correctable error timeframe is a lot longer than NFHS/NCAA. Most errors can be corrected if discovered prior to the beginning of the next period. Only a few errors (wrong team starting with possession of the ball to start a quarter or going or both teams going the wrong way for example) have to be corrected prior to 24 seconds going off to begin the quarter.

I'd fix this, too. It's important -- knowing the team fouls could dictate the strategy on a rebound / subsequent possession.

I'm alright with the correction. More alarmed by the offensive rebounder who ended up with the ball running past durant as he's shooting on the way the to rim and coming up the ball.

Under NBA rules, restrictions end for everyone upon the release except for the FT shooter.

yelling at the table
 

Did you hear how he yelled at the table and scolded them? Would any of you ever use that tone with the table?
I know I would not allow myself to act that way.

NBA vs NFHS, not the same for sure, but I was surprised.

Obviously, his play-calling and focus are of a high level, but what baffles me is that he seems to struggle with people skills. Most officials who make it to the upper levels are top-notch in that area.
He certainly was disrespectful to the table crew.
If the foul count was so important to him (and I agree that it matters to the teams for game strategy), then either he should have looked prior to administering the FT or his partner who is standing in front of the table should have handled it. That guy is an NBA official as well.

Joey Crawford is from the era of many that people love to talk about the antics of Earl Strom or others that were colorful and acted in ways that were totally different than they are today. Just listen to old NBA tapes of interactions with Referees and these guys said all kinds of things.

Crawford entered the league in 1977. If the NBA did not like his antics, they would stop giving him games or they would not put him in the playoffs and Finals. He is no different than many that started at a similar time or well over 25 years that did not completely change with the times or standards that officials even when I started were not asked to do. And I also think Crawford knows his place and what he can do. I actually see very little wrong with his actions and think this entire idea that he cannot stop KD from shooting is stupid and silly when there is a mistake about to be made. And I bet JC was dealing with a constant problem. His body language was not perfect, but we do not know what was said either way. And most of all, this was the home team's people, so shame on them if they got something wrong that hurt their team.

Peace

I did not see the game, but heard about this incident this morning on a local sports talk radio show.

They said that the Scorers table and Crew in OKC is one of the worst in the league and several NBA officials have complained to their superiors regarding the table and crew. Common themes are that the table is slow to respond and becomes too engaged in the game as fans instead of officials.

From what I understand the foul that KD was shooting free throws for put OKC in the bonus. The table side official was telling the table several times during the first free throw to correct the scoreboard to indicate that OKC was in the bonus. He was basically ignored. This is when Crawford stepped in and laid down the law. Unfortuneately, he had already given the ball to Durant for the second free throw and had to get it back.

That's what stood out to me. Why not approach the table if there was confusion rather than screaming at them in such a manner?

Then what's the benefit of an opposing coach calling a timeout after the first of two free throws or a football coach calling a timeout before a field goal attempt?

By your theory, there's no point..... But coaches do it on a regular basis, so there must be something to it.

Because - according to reports - one of the officials had already asked/directed them to correct the error repeatedly. At that point, stop being polite and tell them to fix it and fix it right now - which is what Crawford did.

Yeah, urban myths that it somehow affects the shooter or FG kicker.

A lot of people do stuff that has no intellectual basis.

Yes Virginia, Free Throw Shooters Can Be Iced ...
 

Add me to the list. I have no empirical data, but I have a lifetime of personal anecdotal data. I've shot a lot of free throws over the years. The second is always easier, and more accurate. Miss the first, adjust the second. Make the first, do the same thing for the second. Timing, and routine, are always important in free throw shooting.

Let's Go To The Videotape ...
 

At least in the NFL, kickers actually make it at a higher clip after an opposing head coach tries to "ice" him. Still doesn't stop coaches from the practice. Fans and coaches always remember the one time that it concidently "works."

In fact, you don't even see NBA coaches try this silly practice. Timeouts are too valuable, in being able to advance the ball, for them to waste one of their at maximum 3 timeouts at the end of the game.

I'd guess that coaches do it when time is running out since it is the only hope they thing they have and that there is no use going to the locker room with timeouts remaining. Of course, the stats you show seem to suggest that it is actually counterproductive. I'd be interested to see such stats with respect to basketball where there are two shots and the 2nd one is iced. It may have a different result than the case where there is only one attempt to be taken as in football.

He should have, and could have waited until the free throw was over, especially considering Durant already had the ball. Crawford just tries to put on a show and always seems to have to make a scene about everything.

And if teams think the foul situation is different, then what? What if a foul took place with a team thinking they were not in the bonus?

Peace

What if the scoreboard is wrong about the score and a team thinks it is behind when the game is actually tied and commits a foul?

That would be a protest in the making...that would have a high chance of being upheld. ;)

Is it wrong that I am now rooting for a protest?

Wow...just...wow.

What if Memphis wanted to run a quick throw-in and rush the ball up the court after the made free throw to catch OKC off-guard on defense? So it's alright to interrupt that opportunity?

All calling the ball back from the FT shooter does is make him start his routine over again, a routine he's done thousands of times in his career. This "icing" whining is so freaking funny.

What happens if there's a miss? Are you going to stop play right away to fix the board? What happens if the FT is made but Memphis is leaking a guy down the court hoping to catch OKC off guard and for an easy two...yet you blew your whistle and stopped play because you didn't take care of business before hand? If you stop the play on a made FT, you allow the defense to set up the defense rather than the offense being able to get the ball in quick and push the pace and in doing so, set up a potential mismatch because the defense didn't get back quickly. What if a team carries out a strategy due to the misinformation on the board (commits a foul/plays out a possession)?

So many scenarios that can be affected by not taking care of this right away...and yet people are concerned about the league MVP and excellent FT shooter at 87 percent being "iced."

Yabut...you know that Joey Crawford. Always wanting to make a scene and be the "star" when he is on the court.:rolleyes:

SMDH.

I'm not saying Durant got iced. He shoild have been able to make the free throw. He is a 90% shooter from the line. I'm saying the way it was handled and the actions of Crawford could have been different. Not even saying it shouldn't have been fixed then. He didn't have to go to the table and scream loud enough to hear it on tv? Screaming "Listen to me, listen to me". If Durant makes the free throw, Memphis calls a timeout to advance the ball, and it could have been fixed then. If he misses, OKC has to foul anyway, it can be fixed then.

The issue to me isn't the potential icing. I think that's a weak excuse. They aren't running a quick inbounds play, they are going to call time out and advance it up. To me the issue is Crawfords antics.

Memphis may have called a timeout...may not have...there was 27.5 seconds left on the clock...time didn't dictate that they would normally call one. In the same light, OKC also didn't have to foul on a miss. Force a shot clock violation and they have 3.5 seconds on the clock. Force a miss and secure the rebound could mean a chance to call timeout, advance...and have time for a good shot. Point is, you can't assume what a team is going to do in the future. You have to fix issues as presented in front of you when present.

And it's already been indicated that the table is a known issue even before the game, and didn't heed the direction of the officials via normal communication.

I thought I had heard that the NBA uses neutral table officials for the playoffs. Is that possible?

I still can't figure out why an NBA official standing right next to the table couldn't handle this business. If a guy can't take care of that, why the heck is he working at the professional level?--Let alone a postseason contest.
If the table crew isn't listening to him, he should have been the one to stop the game. He should have sounded his whistle and held up the administration of the FT. At this time other partners could even have come over to the table and done whatever was necessary.
The fault lies with the tableside official not taking care of business and making Crawford feel that he had to come do it for him. Everyone knows that once Joey gets involved civility normally goes out the window.

From Steve Javie

Why Crawford Interrupted Durant - ESPN Video - ESPN

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Nothing that we haven't already discussed.

Give That Man A Cigar ...
 

Amen.

I just spit up on my IPad; thanks. :D

That might be in the laters rounds...maybe even just the NBA Finals

New table officials
 

After reading through everyone's comments, it sounds like the ones to blame for KD's interrupted FT would be the scorer & timer as their full focus was not on their duties & responsibilities.

Since it's reported that OKC has one of the worse table crews in the league, how about the NBA League Office request a new table crew be in place for future games, especially if these errors are happening on a regular basis.

It sounds as if the scorer & timer were not in continual communication with one another about team foul counts & verifying that the information is correct.

Maybe they have done that already. And either way it hurt their team, not anyone else if you believe all the crap being said about this issue.

Peace

If it hadn't been Joe Crawford involved, nobody would give a crap.

The guy's worked more seventh games in the NBA finals than any other active official. Willing to bet he was crew chief in 4/5 of them.

He's not above reproach, but I don't get the fascination some people have with bashing him over every little thing. :confused:

Maybe if Crawford hadn't been on this game, perhaps this particular scenario never plays out the way it did.

Perhaps if Crawford isn't on the SA/DAL game years ago, Duncan doesn't get T'd while on the bench.

Perhaps if Crawford isn't on the LAC/GS game, Stephen Curry might of had an open look at a 3 from the corner instead of having Crawford run right in front of him during the shot.

Depends on your definition of 'every little thing', but Crawford does a lot of 'attention getting' things that rarely are done by other officials.........

And, still, the NBA *keeps* assigning Crawford. He worked a Game 7 last night, come to think of it. Imagine that...

If Mark Davis did the exact same thing then maybe we do not even know this happened. Most people even the media has no idea who most officials are in the NBA by name. They mostly know their name if you are a long time official that has been around for years. And there are not many that have been officiating longer than Crawford. I still do not remember the name of the official that tried to block the FT shooter a couple of years ago and I could not tell you if and what games that person has worked. And I would guess that I probably do not know if and when that official has worked since. And that is not because of Crawford's antics, that is because Crawford is on a lot of big games a lot over a season.

Peace

I'm not a Crawford basher... but it definitely does seem that he is involved more frequently than just about anyone else in these sort of oddball one-of-a-kind situations.

Maybe that is because people point out things about him they ignore or do not notice with other officials. I have seen other situations where that were unusual take place in the NBA and no one goes around trying to put it on the specific official. I have seen Crawford give a T and people want to make more out of who gave the T, even if the situation was obvious.

Peace

Is there video from this play, because I have not seen this play? Was Crawford doing it to get attention?

And how is that about being on TV? He seemed to get caught in a bad position and tried to not get in the way of the shooter. We have all been there.

Peace

Yes, it happens. But of all of the possible avenues for him to take, going in front of a shooter, especially as he is shooting, shouldn't be one of them.

I am not saying it is ideal or that he could not have come another route, but we also do not know how much room was on the court. There are not always that much room even in NBA arenas on the sideline and not with people that are standing up too.

Peace

That's great. I can probably think of at least 10 officials that could have done at just as well, if not better. However, like at all levels, official assignments aren't always based 100% on performance.

I believe that was Courtney Kirkland.

How often has a corny play been discussed here involving Dick Bavetta? I can't think of any. A lot of it is on-court demeanor. I think Bavetta has him beat......

Many times. I remember discussions about his mechanics or situations (and if you look on YouTube you can probably find some videos too). But keep in mind we are in a YouTube, social media era. And Bavetta has not worked as many big games in the past few years. I know I had to look up to see if Bavetta was still working, because I almost never see him anymore and certainly do not see him on the TNT or ESPN broadcasts many times.

For the record, Bavetta has not worked any playoff games for the last couple of years. And he has not worked a NBA Finals since 2008. So we do not talk about him because he is not working when Joey is or when the playoffs are going on. Perspective.

Peace

I know there have been plenty of times as the new Lead that I've had to decide which way to go because a much faster player is taking a path down the court. Fortunately, none of my games have millionaires sitting directly on top of the court, so I have options outside the boundary line.

If this play is being used as some sort of indictment against Crawford, then it must be a really weak case. :rolleyes:

And they are never based on fans' evaluations of performance.

I don't think anyone is indicting anyone, rather just pointing out yet another corny situation that Crawford found himself in.

To me, running in front of a shooter isn't even an option. Either hold up short and mark the 3 or find room behind, along the sideline. I'm not sure if Joe even realized where he was at on the court! The angle given doesn't show the amount of room available on the sideline, and I'm not assuming that there wasn't room. It appears though, that some have seen a different angle that shows otherwise....

Amen, thank goodness for that!

I'm sure Curry has made shots under tougher pressure :P

Eventhough YouTube was rolled out in 2005, it doesn't mean that games from there forward are only on YouTube. There are a ton of game/play clips from games in the 70's, 80's, 90's, etc. So to be honest, the correlation to YouTube and the timeframe to when Bavetta worked a lot really doesn't exist.

Since there were 'many times' Bavetta has been discussed for corny situations, I wonder if you can point to one or two, or at least describe/reference them? Also, would love for you to 'link in' just one YouTube clip of a corny play involving Bavetta. I searched quite a bit and couldn't find anything. Every search I did though, trying to find something on Bavetta, seemed to bring up Joey Crawford clips, which was odd..... :D

Well good for you. And I doubt you have worked in many situations (I know I haven't) where there are that many people in an arena or near the sideline. So I guess you might have different options with that alone, like the rest of us do. As BNR has stated, if this is the best you can do you really lose credibility with your position. You have a better position with other situations.

Peace

I realize this, but my comment was not about just YouTube, it was an example just to highlight the influence of social media and video sites that show things the public finds interesting. Most things are not shown in earlier eras the way they are today.

I do not think I have to prove anything about what was said about Bavetta. You referenced Bavetta while not even having the two on the same level for years based on their assignments. And yes Bavetta is often talked about with his age and things he missed. He just has not been in any high profile situations relative to J. Crawford. You would have been better talking about Danny Crawford than Bavetta if you ask me. But that just shows you were searching for a criticism rather than being honest about these situations. I do not disagree that Crawford is in the spotlight a lot, but I contend that is because of social media and those doing the lazy thing and pointing out someone they recognize as much as anything. Heck you should know how lazy the media is about other officiating things and almost never ask expects or review material that would highlight what was done by officials.

Peace

His momentum wasn't going to allow for him to stop, only to change directions. If he had tried to stop, he would have run into Curry.

And I can say this from my limited exposure to NBA officials, Dick Bavetta is not seen as close to the level of a Joey Crawford or Scott Foster or Tony Brothers.

I've worked a handful of games requiring recognition of a TV camera cord when transitioning on the endline as L. I've had a handful of games that had tight sidelines due to team benches, fan bleachers, cheerleaders, etc. Each game you make mental notes of your court surroundings and adjust. I don't think that's anything out of the norm???

Crawford probably deals with these court scenarios night in and night out, year in and year out, which would suggest that this goof up is even more of a head-scratcher, than say if it happened to you or I, since we seldom have to deal with this, JMO.

I don't think I've tried to compare Dick Bavetta (2014) to Joey Crawford (2014). Some would say Crawford is at his peak now, or has been the past 3-5 years?? Bavetta's career peak was what, in the mid-90's??

Joey Crawford has been in the NBA 37 season now, Bavetta 39. I don't think there has ever been a time Bavetta was rated ahead of Crawford.

And Bavetta was on Earl Strom's enemies list, which I'm sure wasn't the best thing for his career.

For information purposes, Joe Crawford has worked at least one NBA Finals game, except for the 2007 NBA Finals, since 1986.

I had a player run into me one time when he took an unusual angle I was not expecting a few years ago. I have on video of a play where I came out onto the floor as the Trail and the ball was stolen and I was on the inside part of the court and let players pass me. These things happen and it is not a felony or major professional faux pas. Heck there was an official that got involved in the play and got knocked out of bounds in the NBA this season. I bet you were not going around telling everyone here how this was unacceptable or why this official was involved in that situation.

Peace

How dare you mention Crawdord before the annointed one !!!! Don't roll up into DC without giving #48, (that's Mr. Foster to you ), his proper due !!!!!

:D:D:D. See you next weekend brother !!!!

Golden Whistle Award

Yeah, the man must really suck. ;)

Peace

More fuel for those who don't care for the officiating of Joey Crawford.
He mishandled the final play of the 2nd quarter in Game 2 of the Eastern Conference Finals.

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I see nothing wrong with the play much less anything Joe Crawford did

OK, what did I miss? Did they eventually count the basket? I do not see anyone waving off the basket.

Peace

I was at the game. They counted it. They didn't review it on the monitor, they just grabbed their jackets and took off. Not sure how Nevedaref means this was mishandled.

How so. Looks fine to me.

I was listening on the radio. The announcer said that the crew initially called it good, then huddled and Joey Crawford waved it off. There was then a commercial break and upon the broadcast resuming the announcer stated that the crew looked at the video and decided to reverse Crawford's decision and count the basket. This was ESPN Radio.

Unless the crew thought the clock malfunctioned, they would not be allowed to review this play. And from the sounds of it, they didn't.

I was watching on TV and that's what the announcers said. They were not looking at it.