Flop ??? (Video)
 

http://wp.me/p3LRnW-1zRO

I don't know what is worse, the flop or the actual call

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The worst part of the video is the parent cheering the flop.

At that level of basketball I'm sure the officials are very inexperienced, so I won't criticize them. I give them credit for looking off-ball.

This video is disturbing on multiple levels…I'm talking about the actions of the players involved, their age, the fans reaction…a LOT wrong with this picture.

I dunno if they were cheering the flop, I think they were just reacting to the absurdity of it all.

It was the correct call. There was no flop.

MTD, Sr.

Here is what I think I would do with that play in real time. If I was watching that match up, I would see what really happened. If I saw that out of the corner of my eye, I would call a push. The black player was pushing him at least a little bit because his arms follow the yellow player as he falls. If you pause the video at about 8 seconds, and just look at that picture, it sure looks like he got pushed. My question is, what do we do with it? Is that a T for faking being fouled? A play on?

Call a foul on the defender for a trip.

Edit: Went back and saw the offensive player wasn't tripped. I'd just no call it.

True, but you can't call a pushing foul, because the pushing happened when the ball wasn't live. You either call a technical foul, wait for the ball to become live and call the push, or tell the pusher "hands off" while the ball is still dead.

At this level, I'm going with "hands off." The kids are still learning.

The ball was in the thrower's hands...

That's my take, too.

But, the green player also seems like a troublemaker, and I'd keep an eye on him for the next several minutes.

I'm with Bob and Mark, I've got no problem with the call. Gold allowed himself to be pushed to the ground, IMO, but green put himself into a bad position by pushing his opponent.

The pushing started long before the ball was in the thrower's hands. You can make a case for a T for dead ball contact, but I prefer to talk with the kid first.

I like the call.....Next! :D

I am wondering if there was some gamesmanship her. It appears that the dark jersey player was pulled or grabbed in some way. I would like to see the other angle. But it does appear the dark jersey player's arms do go forward. I am just wondering if this why the kid in yellow fell?

Peace

Easy solution. Call the foul and then whack the kid for the overenthusiastic clapping after the foul.

I'd have a word with A2 as the ball was still in the administering official's hands. Failing that, I have a TC foul on A2 just as was called. If A HC comments, I respond with, "coach, the contact started during the dead ball. By the book, that's a technical foul."

1) I'm ok with the foul as called.

2)THere is some incedental contact before the ball is at the throwers disposal but unless it gets to more than that its pretty standard fare.

3) THe offensive player pushed off.

4) Was there a sell job at the time? I couldn't really tell from the angle but the green players reaction after the fact tells me he was probably doing some acting too.

5) I like the call in the moment but watching the after effects feel like the green kid might have sold one so I'll be vigilant on him after this.

6) There is a comment made by a parent in the background about tackling in basketball which leads me to believe this incident isn't existing in a bubble which may mean less contact is being required at this point to earn a foul.

7) Some of these games kids play might be better if they were played in empty gyms.

Kid was going to push off, defender pulled the chair out and embellished as the offense pushed. I like the foul because if the offense doesn't push then the defenders embellishment wouldn't have worked.

Kid was leaning on him, yes. Was going to push off? Maybe so, but I can't penalize him for what he was going to do. I agree that the defender pulled the chair out. (fell voluntarily) So did the contact by the offense gain him an advantage? I say no.

I believe this was a poor call. The offense did not push the defender. He was touching the defender, but that reaction didn't not match the action. The defender flopped.

If the offense "pushed off" wouldn't his momentum go the opposite direction of the defender? If I push you with any force at all, you are going to go backwards and I am going to go in the direction I am pushing toward. The offensive player was leaning on the defense, which then flopped, and you see the offensive player's momentum continue toward the defense. I don't like this call at all, and the defenses clapping afterward could easily be seen as taunting.

There were probably some instances of pushes earlier in the game that could have resulted in warnings or even fouls, so the defense wanted to make sure and get this call.

He spent the 5 seconds prior to the throw in pushing the defender away by walking him down away from the thrower. His momentum was going to take him into the defender.

The defender finally had enough and ceased the resistance. Push on a wall, and let the wall fall down, you'll go down with it.

Same concept, IMO.

He did a lot more than cease the resistance. Appears to me he dove backward and let out a yell to draw attention to himself.

If I would have had my eyes on them the entire time, I would have had a flop and no call, but if I would have just seen it out of the corner of my eye, I would probably have bought it and called a foul.

How much resistance is the defender supposed to put up as the offense uses two hands to shove him? Offense was pushing up the defense just embellished the contact. Unless the defense grabs his arms which you can not see in the video, it seem that the offense's arms extended tells the story. The reason the offense fell towards the defense is because the defense didn't hold the resistance the offense expected.

He fell backwards, and he did so with minimal contact, but I don't see where he's required to resist. As for the yell, it's irrelevant, IMO. I watched it without sound, and I still like the call (although I would have been fine with a no-call as well.)

It's relevant only in that it supports the idea that the whole thing was staged.

Maybe, and I don't disagree that it was staged. The thing is, the offense opens himself up to this by shoving the defender down court. We tell players all the time to stop giving ground. He stops, and just allows himself to be pushed down. I'm ok with that.

Was the offense putting some amount of pressure on him, sure. But that isn't a foul. The question that needs to be asked is whether the contact displaced the defender? To that question, the answer is no. There was no where near enough force in the contact that was there to displace the defender like that.

The sequence of actions/reactions was all wrong for the offensive player to have caused that result. He was applying just as much force (only slight) as the defender was applying in the opposite direction up to the time the defender chose to throw himself to the floor. The arms only extended because the defender removed the resistance, not because of a shove.

And for those that look at the action before the "shove", that is no different than a defender in the post giving ground to another player as the other player works for the shot...he willingly stepped backwards. It is a red herring, at best.

Nice flop that got rewarded. Good opportunity for the administering official to do a little preventative officiating to get those two separated and within their own vertical space prior putting the ball in play.

If you pause the video, right around the 8 second mark you can see the defender starting to jerk backwards and the offensive player's arms are still at a 90 degree angle. It also looks possible that the offensive player's arms jerk forward because the defender temporarily grabbed his hands as he threw himself to the ground. It all happens pretty quickly, but looks possible.

And the way the defender pops up clapping was almost his way of saying "I just got one over on you".

Could be. Also could be "I knew they'd get you for that eventually."

If you see what I see at the 8 second mark, it couldn't be that.....

At the present time, the video is no longer available. The original article has an animated gif though.

My point was simply that the look on his face, by itself, means nothing.