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-   -   Video request Dayton/Syracuse (Video) (https://forum.officiating.com/basketball/97582-video-request-dayton-syracuse-video.html)

Raymond Sun Mar 23, 2014 08:15pm
On the first video, I have less of a problem with that no-call on the first play then I do the with the Trail calling a fall on the second play while he is straight-lined. He had no business putting a whistle on that play.

On the travel call, the official may have thought he lifted his pivot foot after gaining possession, prior to starting his dribble (which was not the case). I don't think he called it b/c of the fumble.

ballgame99 Mon Mar 24, 2014 08:35am
What is the justification for a no-call on the first block? The defender is not vertical, makes body contact prior to, or simultaneous to, the block. That has got to be a foul.

And then to come down the floor and call a foul on red with what looks like good D?

Fumble, no travel.

zm1283 Mon Mar 24, 2014 10:50am
I'm all for letting the defense play and not penalizing them, but that first block was a foul.

rockyroad Mon Mar 24, 2014 11:11am
This first play is a great example of why new L's are told to get to the endline and get set up to receive the play. This L actually slows down and is shuffling the last 10 feet or so instead of busting his butt to get down there. As a result, I honestly don't think he even sees the defender coming from the inside to try to block the shot. Had he hustled and got down there and been in position, he might have had a better look at it.

And yes, I know we all get beat at times. This guy didn't get beat, he eased up.

So...could the C have come in with a whistle on that play? You NCAA-M guys can answer that...in an NCAA-W game, I would expect the C to have secondary whistle on that play.

Rooster Mon Mar 24, 2014 12:32pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by rockyroad (Post 928568)
This first play is a great example of why new L's are told to get to the endline and get set up to receive the play. This L actually slows down and is shuffling the last 10 feet or so instead of busting his butt to get down there. As a result, I honestly don't think he even sees the defender coming from the inside to try to block the shot. Had he hustled and got down there and been in position, he might have had a better look at it.

And yes, I know we all get beat at times. This guy didn't get beat, he eased up.

So...could the C have come in with a whistle on that play? You NCAA-M guys can answer that...in an NCAA-W game, I would expect the C to have secondary whistle on that play.
To me it looks like both the L and the C are straight-lined, thus the no call. What if the T comes and gets this? Too much of a reach? Bad blood after the game?

Raymond Mon Mar 24, 2014 01:07pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rooster (Post 928602)
To me it looks like both the L and the C are straight-lined, thus the no call. What if the T comes and gets this? Too much of a reach? Bad blood after the game?
The Trail is looking for goaltending, a hit to the head, or contact to the forearm and wrist on this play. He's going to let the Lead determine body contact.

Rooster Mon Mar 24, 2014 01:13pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by BadNewsRef (Post 928614)
The Trail is looking for goaltending, a hit to the head, or contact to the forearm and wrist on this play. He's going to let the Lead determine body contact.
Yes, of course. Duh me...

RefCT Mon Mar 24, 2014 01:44pm
Driving my wife nuts...
 
It's these types of sequences that drive me nuts when watching college games (and my verbal spewage leads to my wife being driven nuts too), and also give me an appreciation of why inconsistency in calls drives coaches bananas.

I saw this live and was explaining to my wife about how that sequence of the non-foul and then foul was bad officiating, if for nothing else it was not consistent rulings on back-to-back similar plays.

FWIW - I agree with the "should have been a foul" on the Syracuse defender and "should have been a no call" on the Dayton player.

ballgame99 Mon Mar 24, 2014 03:23pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by RefCT (Post 928632)
It's these types of sequences that drive me nuts when watching college games (and my verbal spewage leads to my wife being driven nuts too), and also give me an appreciation of why inconsistency in calls drives coaches bananas.

I saw this live and was explaining to my wife about how that sequence of the non-foul and then foul was bad officiating, if for nothing else it was not consistent rulings on back-to-back similar plays.

FWIW - I agree with the "should have been a foul" on the Syracuse defender and "should have been a no call" on the Dayton player.
Exactly. And it was the same guy who no called the Syracuse foul, and then called a block on Dayton when he had a L looking right at it that no called it. I would get reemed on an evaluation for that sequence at the HS level. That is the kind of call that makes a coach lose his mind if the game is big enough, then we have to deal with all of that.

Adam Mon Mar 24, 2014 05:19pm
I quit watching after the first foul (the one that wasn't called). I get letting a bit of body contact go when it doesn't create an advantage, but that's not this play.

Rooster Mon Mar 24, 2014 05:44pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by BadNewsRef (Post 928614)
The Trail is looking for goaltending, a hit to the head, or contact to the forearm and wrist on this play. He's going to let the Lead determine body contact.
What if he saw the body contact? Is this crew-saver territory? Especially considering the double whammy Syracuse gets on the next play on the other end? Not trying to be argumentative and all, just curious, having most of my experience in two whistles... (For the record my guess: it's not CS territory.)

Camron Rust Mon Mar 24, 2014 06:30pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by BadNewsRef (Post 928614)
The Trail is looking for goaltending, a hit to the head, or contact to the forearm and wrist on this play. He's going to let the Lead determine body contact.
I don't think the lead had a good angle on that play...in fact it was a poor angle. The trail had the best view through the players here and should come get that if the lead doesn't.

OKREF Mon Mar 24, 2014 09:29pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rooster (Post 928602)
To me it looks like both the L and the C are straight-lined, thus the no call. What if the T comes and gets this? Too much of a reach? Bad blood after the game?
I think this is the right answer. Someone has to get this. Especially since they go to the other end and really, really reach for one there.

Raymond Mon Mar 24, 2014 09:43pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by OKREF (Post 928746)
I think this is the right answer. Someone has to get this. Especially since they go to the other end and really, really reach for one there.
The travesty is the foul call on the other end. The first play was clearly seen by the Lead and he passed on it. The Trail is trusting his partners' judgment and ref'n his portion of the play, which is the stuff going on at or above the rim. The first play was not a crew-saving call that needed to be made.

Rooster Mon Mar 24, 2014 10:22pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by BadNewsRef (Post 928747)
The travesty is the foul call on the other end. The first play was clearly seen by the Lead and he passed on it. The Trail is trusting his partners' judgment and ref'n his portion of the play, which is the stuff going on at or above the rim. The first play was not a crew-saving call that needed to be made.
Sounds good to me, except this. I do think he passed because he would have been guessing. Everything else is good stuff for me.


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