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-   -   FT flopping, then Flagrant Foul. (https://forum.officiating.com/basketball/97518-ft-flopping-then-flagrant-foul.html)

JRutledge Sat Mar 15, 2014 02:11pm

FT flopping, then Flagrant Foul.
 
FT flooping?

Did anyone see this play?

It was funny but how would you handle this?

Oh, feel free to embed this if possible. I cannot seem to do it on my IPad.

Peace

walt Sat Mar 15, 2014 03:39pm

I believe the ended up giving the player who did the pushing a FF1. I agree with that. I would have liked the C to be a little more active there either telling him to knock it off or giving information about what he saw immediately. A little acting but that is not anything close to a basketball play.

bainsey Sat Mar 15, 2014 06:48pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by walt (Post 927176)
I believe the ended up giving the player who did the pushing a FF1. I agree with that.

I'd only agree with that if they'd give the flopper a T, making it a double foul.

JugglingReferee Sat Mar 15, 2014 06:52pm

T the B player. That will stop all the nonsense that goes on. Then tell the A coach that acting isn't appreciated.

Sharpshooternes Sun Mar 16, 2014 12:17am

Quote:

Originally Posted by bainsey (Post 927181)
I'd only agree with that if they'd give the flopper a T, making it a double foul.

Wouldn't you have a FF1 then a technical foul?

AremRed Sun Mar 16, 2014 12:48am

There is a difference between flopping and exaggeration. This is exaggeration by the white jersey player. If the black jersey player does not want to be called for a flagrant foul then he should not be sticking his hand there.

just another ref Sun Mar 16, 2014 12:51am

It's been stated here before but I don't recall. What determines what they can and can't review? I have a lane violation, before and after the review.

bballref3966 Sun Mar 16, 2014 06:59am

Quote:

Originally Posted by JugglingReferee (Post 927182)
T the B player. That will stop all the nonsense that goes on. Then tell the A coach that acting isn't appreciated.

Ball was live, couldn't have a T for that.

Raymond Sun Mar 16, 2014 08:48am

Quote:

Originally Posted by bainsey (Post 927181)
I'd only agree with that if they'd give the flopper a T, making it a double foul.

If the offensive player had not exaggerated, the defensive player would have gotten away with foul. The exaggeration is what led to the video review.

But the offensive player most definitely got fouled, so he wasn't faking..

bainsey Sun Mar 16, 2014 09:31am

Quote:

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef (Post 927209)
If the offensive player had not exaggerated, the defensive player would have gotten away with foul.

With this mentality, you're only encouraging exaggeration/flopping.

Let's say A-1 stealthily gives B-2 at shot in the groin, and B-2 loudly cries out, "Aaah! Motherf***er!!!" The loud profanity brings attention to the egregious act, which you may not have noticed without it, but it still doesn't justify the reaction.

One illegal act does not allow permission for another. And yes, he most certainly was faking. If you go down strictly from the opponent's contact, that's fine. If the intent is to make the contact seem worse than it really is, that's faking.

Raymond Sun Mar 16, 2014 09:49am

Faking being fouled means he didn't get fouled. Since they called a FF1 upon review, by definition he was not faking.

bainsey Sun Mar 16, 2014 10:27am

Quote:

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef (Post 927215)
Faking being fouled means he didn't get fouled. Since they called a FF1 upon review, by definition he was not faking.

That's not exclusively the rule. Don't forget, it's prefaced with those key words, "is not limited to."

Rich Sun Mar 16, 2014 11:09am

What the B player did was not a basketball play. It was BS. The right outcome prevailed, IMO.

Raymond Sun Mar 16, 2014 03:51pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by bainsey (Post 927217)
That's not exclusively the rule. Don't forget, it's prefaced with those key words, "is not limited to."

I'm more interested in the defender committing an intentional, non-basketball play than I am in whether target embellished the contact. Big picture vs. small picture.

bainsey Sun Mar 16, 2014 05:10pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef (Post 927272)
I'm more interested in the defender committing an intentional, non-basketball play than I am in whether target embellished the contact. Big picture vs. small picture.

This is where our pictures differ. I believe flopping/embellishing to be a problem that needs to be addressed, period.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sharpshooternes
Wouldn't you have a FF1 then a technical foul?

Didn't mean to gloss over this, Sharp. Good question. Can you even double up a flagrant/intentional foul with a technical (in any rule set)?


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