Would you call a T here?
 

H1 dives to the basket from the left wing. I am L opposite of where he drove from. H1 lays the ball in with minimal body contact that I ruled incidental. After the ball goes in H1's momentum carries him towards me. When he is about 5 or 6 feet from me he looks at me with an intense angry look and says "and 1" in a lounge intense tone. It wasn't quits a yell but louder than normal speech. Loud enough for that corner of the gym to hear. Is this a T in your game?

At the very least, it's a "not again" from me, but partially depending upon the atmosphere, that could likely be a T.

3 options.....
1. Ignore it ( not the best choice)
2. A warning that EVERYONE in the gym hears. (My preference)
3. "You got it". WHACK.

Whack. Every time in my corner of FED land.

Definitely a technical foul.

Now since you have a player who is clearly unhappy with the amount of contact which you are deeming incidental, you may wish to reconsider your thinking on that point.

When players are airborne, they are at risk of injury and cannot control their balance when contacted. Thus officials are instructed to "protect the shooter." Basically, what this means is that we have to diligently scrutinize any contact on an airborne player attempting to shoot, pass, or even rebound. The amount of contact may be far less than when players are in contact with the floor, but may have much more impact upon a player's body movement, ability to make the desired play, or under how great of a risk of injury it places the player. Such factors form the difference between marginal and illegal contact.

Key points to help us determine the legality of any such contact are the positioning of the players prior to becoming airborne, verticality, and who is the initiator.

So rather than simply discount the player's expression of displeasure as an example of poor sportsmanship which one should penalize and then move on from, I would advise considering it an opportunity to re-evaluate how much physical contact you are allowing on drives to the basket and subsequent airborne players. What kind of feedback are you getting from the players, coaches, and your partners? Is this the only incident of an unhappy participant which you've experienced or are you getting a few complaints a game?

probably not a T, but it would depend on what else had happened.

Players want an "and one" on almost any drive to the basket.

At the least, "and one" gets a quick talk. If it's said in anger, and it sounds like this was, there's a good chance it's a T.

That's right. When a player is unhappy, you should change how you call the game so that he will be happy.

Players will "and one" every drive to the basket. It doesn't even get on my radar. Technical foul for this? How about looking at the kid and saying, "Knock it off." There, you addressed it and didn't interrupt the game.

Adrenaline can sometimes mess with a players sense of how much much contact they received..sometimes its exaggerated(or invented) and sometimes its completely negated.

To me this was more of how it was said and not what was said. I hear "and one" a lot but not in the way it was directed at me.

As far as protecting a shorter, almost all contact was initiated by the offense jumping into a stationary vertical defender. The dribbler was definitely responsible for the contact.

Then it most likely wasn't a foul and you correctly held your whistle.
I also agree with you about the manner in which the comment was made. You wrote that it was directed right at you and with anger. That's a T without a doubt. I'm not taking that lack of respect from a player.

I can ignore a kid saying "and 1" to no one in particular after scoring, but not getting in my face.

Automatic Response ...
 

Even when the ball doesn't go in, and a foul is called. Stupid player monkeys.

That's what you got from my post? :rolleyes:

Perhaps I should change my posting style so that you will be happy. ;)

Either a "knock it off," as Rich suggests. Or, "Hey, 24, you don't have to agree with me, but you can't do that."

If he's a hot head, find a team leader and have him talk to him

Ok, that's funny.

"No, it's and 2 - for the other team." :p

I agree.

Rich:

I couldn't have said it better myself.

MTD, Sr.

Are you saying it is open season on tall players? :D

Must have been a Freudian slip. I am about 5'8 and after I called it I heard a fan say "he has short man syndrome." :D

Not the exact same scenario, but if it makes you feel any better, Jeremy, last week I had a player yell, "And one, ref! And one!" after a layup with similarly little (or no) contact.

Even easier T there, of course, but ... it's not just you :)

The start of your post is "Definitely a Technical," but then you immediately change to reconsider and reevalute the amount of contact. One or the other!!

I agree with the stance of not quite enough for a T for me. That is assuming that the statement wasn't accompanied by some theatrics, such as throwing his arms up in the air, or some stare-down. However, I also wouldn't let it go without a "that's enough" comment, or something similar.

Why do you think it has to be one or the other? Can't we penalize the poor behavior of the player for his non-contact expression of displeasure, but then also evaluate whether his claim about illegal contact during the attempt had any merit despite its improper delivery?

And now the rest of the story.

This took place towards the end of the first half with H up 20+

Coach asked me what he said. I told him and he give me a grin like I was a moron and said "well he did get fouled."

When the player returned later in the game. He did apologize.

Exactly.

It's not WHAT he said...it's HOW he said it.

Earlier in the season I called a player for a traveling violation. I was the T and turned to become the L. The player looked directly at me and "bounced" the ball should height OOB, neither in my direction or my partner's direction. I T'd him. Coach asks me what he did. I said "coach, he looked at me and bounced the ball OOB, out of spite because he didn't like the call." He says, "yeah, but how high did the ball go?" I said "shoulder height." He says, "you're gonna T him for that?" Yup. As mentioned previously, it's not necessarily the action to me, it's the way the action is delivered.

My answer would have been, "it doesn't matter", followed by him looking at the back of my head.

No offense intended here, but imho, this conversation went on FAR longer than it should have.

Right. I gave the coach 15 seconds of my time. Interpersonal skills go a long way in this avocation.

Right on the money RookieDude, I had to fill out our online form for "loss of coaching box", AKA Technical. As I was putting in the details, it sounded like the guy didn't deserve it. However, it's HOW he said it.

15 seconds is a very long time... but that said, if he's discussing something, 15 seconds can be fine. If he's kvetching, cut him off.

Exactly. And my portion of he 15 seconds will consist of more than 10 words. But I also have a cut-off point where if the coach asks a question, and I answer it, he doesn't get to debate my answer or repeat the question.

This past weekend I had to tell a coach, "I already answered your question". The first time nicely, the 2nd very tersely and was the last interaction I had with the coach the rest of the game. Of course, earlier in the game, this coach complained about a offensive push-off after I called a defensive foul on his player. When my response was "I'll look out for it", his response was "it's too late now". So this jack-wagon had already run out of rope by the second interaction.