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BatteryPowered Fri Jun 28, 2013 11:54am

A true Newbie development
 
What are your thoughts? I had a guy who is going to start officiating this coming season ask for my opinion about camps for him. You probably need a little info. First, he never played a sport but loves basketball, wants to officiate a sport and basketball fits into his schedule best. In Texas officials belong to chapters which cover schools in a specific geographic area. The chapters have an Assignment Secretary and Evaluation Committee responsible for getting officials into games and determining what they are capable of handling. Most of the chapters in this area have “schools” that start about 10 weeks before the seasons and cover the rules, areas of responsibilities, mechanics, etc.

With that understanding, my advice was for him to not pay to attend a camp this summer. Primarily because there are none that are free remaining and only one that will include two-man work. But even if that was not true, I think a truly green newbie should go through one of those schools and spend his/her first season working the freshman and junior high games. Letting the evaluation committee watch them work, getting feedback on the basics and finding out if this is something they really want to do. Then, their first off-season they can attend a two-man camp or two that will put them on the floor with some of the bigger and better local program summer teams. After their second season they should be ready for some three-man exposure in one of the many camps in this area. One in particular is great for that as they focus on official with no three-man experience.

I would welcome your ideas on a “development program” so to speak.

Camron Rust Fri Jun 28, 2013 01:07pm

I agree with your recommendations. Going to camp, having never worked a game, is just going to be too much too fast. Most camps are not run with the purpose of teaching an official who has not yet called at least a few games.

Camp can be good after the first year for those that are among the better half of rookies but for the rest, it might still be too much. After the 2nd year is a good time to start the camping path for many.

JRutledge Fri Jun 28, 2013 01:26pm

The only way you learn is by working. I have no problem with going to a camp as those situations are not going to necessarily going to be any more laid back then a real game when no one is instructing.

There is no one way that works for everyone. This is the one thing they think we should be perfect from day one and get better after that fact. I guess is just depends on the other support systems in place and working a camp might be a great start as they will have instruction. But they cannot assume that is how they learn or know how to be an official. They have to put in the work doing all other stuff as well that includes meetings, trainings, classes or anything else that will acclimate themselves to this profession.

Peace

Bad Zebra Fri Jun 28, 2013 02:04pm

Definitely work a few games before even considering a camp.

In doing so, he will either find that:
A) He loves it, he's hooked, and wants to learn more and get better or
B) It's not at all what he expected. It's way more complicated and difficult than he imagined and opts to move on.

In my experience, there's not much middle ground. Going to camp before he really knows what to expect will be a big waste of money. The analogy of "Trying to sip water with a fire hose" comes to mind.

Encourage him to try to work as many youth games, middle and jr. high games as he can. A decent mentor will probably benefit him a lot more his first year than a formal camp.

BktBallRef Fri Jun 28, 2013 09:54pm

A couple of associations here run camps for HS and below officials. That type of camp might be appropriate for him but a camp for college level officials? No way.

AremRed Sat Jun 29, 2013 12:01am

Quote:

Originally Posted by JRutledge (Post 898773)
The only way you learn is by working. I have no problem with going to a camp as those situations are not going to necessarily going to be any more laid back then a real game when no one is instructing.

True, but having a few games under your belt and going through the process of teaching yourself the rulebook and mechanics manual will help a lot with understanding what the clinicians have to say. Plus, other campers want their clinician to focus on them as well instead of having to teach a new guy the most basic stuff.

JRutledge Sat Jun 29, 2013 12:17am

Quote:

Originally Posted by AremRed (Post 898807)
True, but having a few games under your belt and going through the process of teaching yourself the rulebook and mechanics manual will help a lot with understanding what the clinicians have to say. Plus, other campers want their clinician to focus on them as well instead of having to teach a new guy the most basic stuff.

This really depends on the kind of camp that you are attending. Around here we do what we can to get people in the system and working and learning. We have two person camps and we rotate people in and out. At least when we run camps the participants realize what we are doing. In a real game they really do not care or act a fool at the officials. So I do not see this as a one way or the other way situation. Because if someone is brand new I treat them as such and teach them what they need to know and not overwelm them with information they cannot use at that point. A few games under your belt does not guarantee anything as I have seen guys with 5 years experience not understand basic stuff. You have to do it sometime, why not do it with instruction and not some guy that is only concerned about making money and will not do anything to teach you anything?

Peace

AremRed Sat Jun 29, 2013 12:45am

Quote:

Originally Posted by JRutledge (Post 898808)
You have to do it sometime, why not do it with instruction and not some guy that is only concerned about making money and will not do anything to teach you anything?

Instruction is great. And many associations host classes for beginners where they can receive some of that instruction. However, I think you missed my main point: a clinician having to teach a newbie is going to do so at the expense of the other campers on that court. I think all campers should be observed and instructed equally and when you have a total new guy they are going to get the majority of both. There is a place for new officials -- beginner officials class.

JRutledge Sat Jun 29, 2013 01:29am

Quote:

Originally Posted by AremRed (Post 898814)
Instruction is great. And many associations host classes for beginners where they can receive some of that instruction. However, I think you missed my main point: a clinician having to teach a newbie is going to do so at the expense of the other campers on that court. I think all campers should be observed and instructed equally and when you have a total new guy they are going to get the majority of both. There is a place for new officials -- beginner officials class.

Well I am a registered clinician with my state. Meaning that I am trained to teach officials at all levels and the clinicians are the only ones authorized to run camps for camp clinic (basically oversee the camps as well as teach individuals). There is nothing I cannot teach (and others in my similar position) that cannot teach a newer official with a veteran around. Actually when we have camps even with 3 person, we tend to have guys that have little experience in 3 person to guys with a lot of experience in 3 person. It is not anything special as you seem to suggest or unusual. And when you have guys that have almost never worked 3 person and not being able to rotate or know when to switch. Trust me is is not the newbies we often have to worry about.

Also not all of use learn the same way. I have been working 3 person every year I have been an official. I used camps to fill in the blanks with things that I did already knew. Many have done the same if they watch veterans work, stay for varsity games, go to watch when not working or have a mentor show them the ropes. Others have a difficult time picking up simple things. Either way none of this is going to ruin most people if they use every opportunity as a learning experience.

Peace

Moosie74 Tue Jul 02, 2013 09:04am

I don't think that going to a camp without having called a game is a good idea.

I've been with my association for 2 years and just went to my first camp this weekend.

I work primarily middle school and junior varsity and those are decent training grounds for the basics but I work with a few "paycheck" officials or lesser talented veterans and that stunts my development.

I learned more in 3 days at camp than I have in 2 seasons but it was not the basics but the next things up.

Some of the instruction we got was a repeat of the cadet classes but in those classes it was all chalk and talk and no court time. We did the lecture in camp and then called games.

As a group of 2nd and 3rd year officials mostly we all started calling those things we either let go or weren't sure of mostly because we had a clinician in the area giving us feedback and validating what we did.

In a weekend I started calling throw-in and lane violations, block/charge (2), and my first technical for unsporting behavior on a coach.

The rest of the campers expect their partner to be in the proper place or at least near it, they expect their partner to cover his/her own PCA and get those shared areas in 2 person.

A green rookie without calling any games is not going to be comfortable doing it. Rookies go looking for traveling and pushing fouls because those are fairly easy to see.

A camp throws a lot of concepts at a person in a short time. To me it's better to do the classroom work, call games for a couple of years and then go to a camp and get the next level stuff on the belt instead of the basics.

JRutledge Tue Jul 02, 2013 09:38am

What are some of you going to do during the season when you work with guys that have no game experience? And having game experience does not mean you are so much more competent and understanding of mechanics or rules. I know if someone works lower level games will often work with very new or sometimes brand new officials.

I still do not get the idea that somehow at camp that is going to change drastically from the regular season except for you have instructors. As I have said before, I have seen 2 or 3 year officials not know as much as younger officials in many situations. It really comes down to what you are willing to do to get better and I still see no problem with someone being exposed to a camp setting as their first officiating experience. Where else are you going to get someone to walk you through what you are supposed to do?

Peace

jeschmit Tue Jul 02, 2013 12:07pm

Here's the way I see it... You get out of camp what you expect to get out of it. If a guy is going having never blown a whistle before, he should probably be expecting to understand how to blow the whistle properly and basic court coverage. I was a teacher at a camp last summer where a kid came in having never refereed a game in his life. We went over where to stand, how to properly blow his whistle, and to get his hand or fist in the air when he has a call. That's it. I didn't worry about judgement or mechanics... just the extreme basics.

However, if he's thrown into a middle school game without any of that experience at a camp setting (with someone right behind him telling him where to go and what to do), he'll look like even more of a doofus...

My advice to your friend would be, if you have the time and money to go to a camp, go to it! Be up front with the clinicians, and tell them that you've never blown a whistle before and you might like some help with the basics. Most clinicians will be more than willing to help in that way, and some will even run the court with them.

Camp is the best place to try new things, whether it be learning how to referee, or a more advanced philosophy that you're trying out. Either way, it's camp. It's a lot better to figure it out then, than try and figure it out when you have players and coaches trying to win in the regular season.

BatteryPowered Tue Jul 02, 2013 02:30pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by jeschmit (Post 899151)
Here's the way I see it... You get out of camp what you expect to get out of it. If a guy is going having never blown a whistle before, he should probably be expecting to understand how to blow the whistle properly and basic court coverage. I was a teacher at a camp last summer where a kid came in having never refereed a game in his life. We went over where to stand, how to properly blow his whistle, and to get his hand or fist in the air when he has a call. That's it. I didn't worry about judgement or mechanics... just the extreme basics.

However, if he's thrown into a middle school game without any of that experience at a camp setting (with someone right behind him telling him where to go and what to do), he'll look like even more of a doofus...

My advice to your friend would be, if you have the time and money to go to a camp, go to it! Be up front with the clinicians, and tell them that you've never blown a whistle before and you might like some help with the basics. Most clinicians will be more than willing to help in that way, and some will even run the court with them.

Camp is the best place to try new things, whether it be learning how to referee, or a more advanced philosophy that you're trying out. Either way, it's camp. It's a lot better to figure it out then, than try and figure it out when you have players and coaches trying to win in the regular season.

That is exactly what is covered in the "school" put on by most of the chapters in this area.

MD Longhorn Tue Jul 02, 2013 02:54pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by JRutledge (Post 899139)
What are some of you going to do during the season when you work with guys that have no game experience?

Teach them. Just like the other 1000 times I've worked with guys that have no game experience.

JRutledge Tue Jul 02, 2013 03:10pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by MD Longhorn (Post 899158)
Teach them. Just like the other 1000 times I've worked with guys that have no game experience.

I agree. But some suggest as if they only work with people that know what they are doing.

Peace

BillyMac Tue Jul 02, 2013 03:27pm

Deer In The Headlights ...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by BatteryPowered (Post 898747)
He never played a sport but loves basketball, wants to officiate a sport and basketball fits into his schedule best.

I found this part (above) of the post to be very interesting. Not only did the guy not play basketball, he never played any sports. In my opinion, this will make the learning curve a lot steeper than if he had played any sport, and even steeper because he hadn't played basketball. I know that good players do not necessarily make good officials, and I also know that it's possible for a non-player to become a good official. I know volleyball, and lacrosse, officials who never played the game, and who have gone on to become good officials in those sports, making it all the way to the state tournament level.

No previous experience playing sports. No previous experience playing basketball. No previous experience officiating any other sport. This guy is more than just a newbie, he's an infant newbie, and he'll need a lot of help, classes, clinics, camps, mentoring, etc., and have to work really hard, harder than other newbies with more experience, to became a good basketball official. He can do it, but it will be a tough row to hoe.

Also, my opinion: Get certified, work a year of subvarsity basketball, recreation games, etc., get a mentor, take advantage of any education that his association offers, learn the rulebook, casebook, and mechanics manual, like the back of his hand, and then go to a camp after that first season.

BatteryPowered Tue Jul 02, 2013 04:11pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by BillyMac (Post 899162)
I found this part (above) of the post to be very interesting. Not only did the guy not play basketball, he never played any sports. In my opinion, this will make the learning curve a lot steeper than if he had played any sport, and even steeper because he hadn't played basketball. I know that good players do not necessarily make good officials, and I also know that it's possible for a non-player to become a good official. I know volleyball, and lacrosse, officials who never played the game, and who have gone on to become good officials in those sports, making it all the way to the state tournament level.

No previous experience playing sports. No previous experience playing basketball. No previous experience officiating any other sport. This guy is more than just a newbie, he's an infant newbie, and he'll need a lot of help, classes, clinics, camps, mentoring, etc., and have to work really hard, harder than other newbies with more experience, to became a good basketball official. He can do it, but it will be a tough row to hoe.

Also, my opinion: Get certified, work a year of subvarsity basketball, recreation games, etc., get a mentor, take advantage of any education that his association offers, learn the rulebook, casebook, and mechanics manual, like the back of his hand, and then go to a camp after that first season.

Well there are no "certified" officials in this state. I was almost in the same boat as him...I only played Little League baseball. Learning the rulebook, casebook and mechanics was not that difficult. What I had to work on the most was knowing how to move on the floor given the position of the defenders and place on the floor so I wasn't constantly out of position or straight-lined at critical times.

Someone who played the game would certianly have an advantage in that area.

BillyMac Tue Jul 02, 2013 05:53pm

Inquiring Minds Want To Know ...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by BatteryPowered (Post 899168)
Well there are no "certified" officials in this state.

Do basketball officials in your area belong to any organizations, associations, boards, etc., or can anyone just put on a Footlocker jersey, strap on a shiny metal whistle, buckle on a black belt, and officiate a high school basketball game?

jeschmit Tue Jul 02, 2013 10:40pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by BatteryPowered (Post 899156)
That is exactly what is covered in the "school" put on by most of the chapters in this area.

I'm guessing this is a regional thing, cause I've never heard of school for officials. There's clinics or camps and that's about it in my area.

If there's an option for that instead of an outright camp, I'd agree with you there. In my area, I'd have to suggest a camp or clinic to learn these things.

JRutledge Tue Jul 02, 2013 10:58pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by jeschmit (Post 899186)
I'm guessing this is a regional thing, cause I've never heard of school for officials. There's clinics or camps and that's about it in my area.

If there's an option for that instead of an outright camp, I'd agree with you there. In my area, I'd have to suggest a camp or clinic to learn these things.

The problem with this discussion honestly. Most of these things about when and how guys work games or get training is so very regional. Even in Illinois it is different how you get games in different parts of the state.

Peace

AremRed Tue Jul 02, 2013 11:01pm

My friend and I were discussing camps we had gone to and he mentioned that he had worked a game at camp with a guy who had never blown a whistle. The guy just paid and showed up, had never worked 2-man, and was immediately thrown into a 3-man game. I asked my friend how it went, and asked if he felt he received enough attention even with the new guy on the court. He said it was a great experience to practice leadership and to help the new guy learn the right way. He also said that the clinicians paid as much attention to him as the new guy, which was one of my concerns.

Quote:

Originally Posted by jeschmit (Post 899186)
I'm guessing this is a regional thing, cause I've never heard of school for officials. There's clinics or camps and that's about it in my area.

If there's an option for that instead of an outright camp, I'd agree with you there. In my area, I'd have to suggest a camp or clinic to learn these things.

The thing I suggest for a new guy is attending association meetings. I went to two or three meetings, met the leadership, and heard what they talked about. The leaders suggested a kids league where I could start, told me where I could buy gear locally, and explained how the five-second count replaces the shot clock. My association does have a class for new guys, but it was a few weeks before I started attending meetings. I still think that going to a camp right off the bat is not the best, because you can learn so much by attending a few association meetings.

BatteryPowered Wed Jul 03, 2013 08:09am

Officials in Texas belong to Chapters...and they are affiliated with either the UIL or TASO (Texas Association of Sports Officials)...last time I asked there is still a spitting contest between the two organizations for control.

I used the term "school" as it best describes the set-up. The chapter I belonged to called it New Official Training. It starts the Wednesday after labor day and ends during the week of scrimmages. These officials work a couple of sets of scrimmages as a group. They rotate off the floor after each quarter so one of the many experienced officials observing can go over a few things with them before they get back on the floor. All of this is at no charge for the new officials.

Once the Chapter Meetings start, the new officials have a break-out session to discuss rules questions and situations that have come up during the games.

jeschmit Wed Jul 03, 2013 09:07am

Quote:

Originally Posted by BatteryPowered (Post 899201)
Officials in Texas belong to Chapters...and they are affiliated with either the UIL or TASO (Texas Association of Sports Officials)...last time I asked there is still a spitting contest between the two organizations for control.

I used the term "school" as it best describes the set-up. The chapter I belonged to called it New Official Training. It starts the Wednesday after labor day and ends during the week of scrimmages. These officials work a couple of sets of scrimmages as a group. They rotate off the floor after each quarter so one of the many experienced officials observing can go over a few things with them before they get back on the floor. All of this is at no charge for the new officials.

Once the Chapter Meetings start, the new officials have a break-out session to discuss rules questions and situations that have come up during the games.

That sounds like a great experience for newer officials! I wish we had something like that set up for newer officials in our area...

grunewar Wed Jul 03, 2013 09:49am

We have a rigorous process for "new officials" with less than one full season of high school officiating experience (they are considered "applicants)

Our applicant program is a combination of classroom and game-based learning that lasts approximately ten weeks and is intended to get them ready for the season.

Our course intends to prepare them to referee HS basketball, whether they have previous experience or not.

During our classroom meetings, we discuss the fundamentals of officiating: rules, floor coverage, positioning, game administration, and game management.

The hands-on portion consists of participation as a referee-in-training in 'live' games. These games are mandatory, where applicants are partnered with experienced officials and evaluators, who provide guidance, help correct mistakes, and generally hope to get them off to a good start as they rotate in and out of the games.

This system seems to serve us well over the yrs and our trainers are good guys (IMO) who want new officials to succeed. Like many other Associations, many of our officials are getting a little "long in the tooth" (me included) and we need some good, younger blood in the ranks.

justacoach Thu Jul 04, 2013 09:21am

Quote:

Originally Posted by grunewar (Post 899208)
and we need some good, younger blood in the ranks.

I'm doing my part X 3:)

Lcubed48 Thu Jul 04, 2013 12:44pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by justacoach (Post 899265)
I'm doing my part X 3:)

I had the privilege of watching all 3 of them work at camp - the triple threat crew.


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