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-   -   Michigan/Syracuse (https://forum.officiating.com/basketball/94712-michigan-syracuse.html)

OKREF Sat Apr 06, 2013 08:40pm

Michigan/Syracuse
 
Block/Charge. 10:47 first half.

Multiple Sports Sat Apr 06, 2013 09:37pm

Overule on OTB - 2nd half
 
Thought this overrule was splitting hairs......maybe lead passed on push and was giving ball to Mich and not calling a foul...

JeffM Sat Apr 06, 2013 10:25pm

Foul on Hardaway at 1:40
 
I'd like to see this play again.

OKREF Sat Apr 06, 2013 10:33pm

Block/Charge :19.2
 
Oh this is going to be fun.

JeffM Sat Apr 06, 2013 10:35pm

Block/Charge at 19.2
 
It was called a charge, but it looked like a block to me...he seemed to be moving laterally into contact after player was airborne.

KMBReferee Sat Apr 06, 2013 10:41pm

Between that charge at the end of the game and the held ball call, this wasn't the best night for college basketball officiating. Expect the morons at ESPN and sports radio to have a field day for the next 2-3 days.

bainsey Sat Apr 06, 2013 10:46pm

15:58, second half. I never thought of this before, but does the NCAA have the same plane violation rule (or something similar) as NFHS? I would say a defender's foot out of bounds, let alone the extended arm, is a hell of an advantage.

big jake Sat Apr 06, 2013 10:49pm

Charles Barkley does not know how to ref
 
Said McCalls call was a block not a charge. I thought it was right on and Barkley is an idiot?:)

MathReferee Sat Apr 06, 2013 10:55pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by KMBReferee (Post 889513)
Between that charge at the end of the game and the held ball call, this wasn't the best night for college basketball officiating. Expect the morons at ESPN and sports radio to have a field day for the next 2-3 days.

Yes, in replay it was probably a block, but it was close enough that people are going to argue both sides of it. The foul call on Carter-Williams when it appeared Hardaway pushed off was a bigger one to discuss. In hindsight, I would bet the trail wished he was a step deeper to get a better look at it.

As far as the held ball goes, it was consistent with the rest of the game.

Nevadaref Sat Apr 06, 2013 10:55pm

From the end line camera view, it looked like a block in slo-mo.
Perhaps Charles is right. Would that make you the idiot?

APG Sat Apr 06, 2013 10:57pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by big jake (Post 889516)
Said McCalls call was a block not a charge. I thought it was right on and Barkley is an idiot?:)

Two things...Charles Barkley watches and commentates on 95 percent NBA games...meaning NBA rules and philosophies. As such, this would be an easy block in an NBA game. 2nd, I had a blocking foul watching it myself under NCAA rules.

KMBReferee Sat Apr 06, 2013 11:01pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by AustinRef (Post 889517)
Yes, in replay it was probably a block, but it was close enough that people are going to argue both sides of it.

I've been on Twitter most of the night. Trust me; they already have the message out that the refs screwed up both games.

Camron Rust Sat Apr 06, 2013 11:13pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by APG (Post 889519)
Two things...Charles Barkley watches and commentates on 95 percent NBA games...meaning NBA rules and philosophies. As such, this would be an easy block in an NBA game. 2nd, I had a blocking foul watching it myself under NCAA rules.

I thought that, even though he was still shifting laterally after the shooter left the floor, he had made it into the path and the shift only changed where he got hit. I thought he got it right.

Camron Rust Sat Apr 06, 2013 11:15pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Multiple Sports (Post 889499)
Thought this overrule was splitting hairs......maybe lead passed on push and was giving ball to Mich and not calling a foul...

Still, it was correct according to the replays (if I'm thinking of the right play). They got it right.

Camron Rust Sat Apr 06, 2013 11:22pm

I was wondering about that McGary save attempt that hit the board.

It appeared to me that it hit something in the lower back of the board then went UP slightly hitting some other support before coming back down to the floor where the SU player grabbed it.

The right team got the ball on that one so it didn't really have any effect if that was the case but I'd wonder if it was just my eyes or if it did what I thought it did.

OKREF Sat Apr 06, 2013 11:22pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Camron Rust (Post 889526)
Still, it was correct according to the replays (if I'm thinking of the right play). They got it right.

There were two of them, and the overrules were correct.

MathReferee Sat Apr 06, 2013 11:26pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Camron Rust (Post 889529)
I was wondering about that McGary save attempt that hit the board.

It appeared to me that it hit something in the lower back of the board then went UP slightly hitting some other support before coming back down to the floor where the SU player grabbed it.

The right team got the ball on that one so it didn't really have any effect if that was the case but I'd wonder if it was just my eyes or if it did what I thought it did.

I thought the same thing. It was inconsequential to the outcome of the play, but worth a look. Did C bail a little early since he would have had the best look?

AremRed Sun Apr 07, 2013 12:15am

Quote:

Originally Posted by JeffM (Post 889507)
I'd like to see this play again.

Your title mentions the foul was on Hardaway. The foul was on Syracuse's Carter-Williams. I want to see it too! 1:40 second half.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Camron Rust (Post 889529)
I was wondering about that McGary save attempt that hit the board.

It appeared to me that it hit something in the lower back of the board then went UP slightly hitting some other support before coming back down to the floor where the SU player grabbed it.

The right team got the ball on that one so it didn't really have any effect if that was the case but I'd wonder if it was just my eyes or if it did what I thought it did.

The play is at 8:03, second half. Camron, I did a frame-by-frame, and the ball hits the bottom padding of the backboard, and deflects down. I didn't see it go up at all.

Brad Sun Apr 07, 2013 06:19am

At 19.2 — real-time it is super obvious charge to me.

Slow motion I still had a charge. Player has two feet down and facing dribbler. Moves laterally, but really does not look like he slid under him — takes the contact right in the chest.

http://brad.me/17lUj2X

If this isn't a charge, shouldn't we just take the charge out of the rule book and only call blocks??? Have we adopted the commentator mindset of "he wasn't set"???

dinoian Sun Apr 07, 2013 09:06am

It seemed a lot of times Michigan was inbounding that Syracuse was over the baseline, cutting off an angle (around 12:25 in the second half was one IIRC). Is there a difference in college rules/enforcement from high school that allows this?

APG Sun Apr 07, 2013 11:40am

Brad, that's not going to be the angle that's going to be decisive...the baseline view...which they do show on replay, is the best view on this play.

fullor30 Sun Apr 07, 2013 12:03pm

Preface this with fanboy alert........That held ball call reminded me of sophomore girls games. My only comment on game.


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