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-   -   Marq/Syracuse Video please (Video Added) (https://forum.officiating.com/basketball/94596-marq-syracuse-video-please-video-added.html)

justacoach Sat Mar 30, 2013 05:08pm

Marq/Syracuse Video please (Video Added)
 
11:25 2nd half

block/charge on layup

JetMetFan Sun Mar 31, 2013 08:39am

Syracuse-Marquette clip(s)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by justacoach (Post 887756)
11:25 2nd half

block/charge on layup

<iframe width="853" height="480" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/rka2Smf4UOM?rel=0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

JeffM Sun Mar 31, 2013 12:23pm

I have a block - defender was not in LGP soon enough

JRutledge Sun Mar 31, 2013 12:25pm

It looks to me he gets both feet on the floor before the shooter goes airborne. I have a charge. I even thought this was a charge when I saw this play live.

Peace

OKREF Sun Mar 31, 2013 12:48pm

PC. I also thought PC live.

Rich Sun Mar 31, 2013 12:53pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by JeffM (Post 887897)
I have a block - defender was not in LGP soon enough

What does soon enough mean to you?

Camron Rust Sun Mar 31, 2013 01:37pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by JRutledge (Post 887899)
It looks to me he gets both feet on the floor before the shooter goes airborne. I have a charge. I even thought this was a charge when I saw this play live.

Peace

Agree.

JeffM Sun Mar 31, 2013 01:50pm

I suppose I'm wrong, but to me, the Marquette player's momentum moves towards the baseline once the Syracuse player is airborne because the Marquette player wasn't there soon enough.

I don't think the Marquette player got there soon enough for the Syracuse player to avoid contact. I also don't think the Marquette player got there soon enough to defend the shot had he actually jumped. Since time and distance aren't required to establish LGP against an opponent with the ball, I suppose these considerations don't matter.

JRutledge Sun Mar 31, 2013 02:15pm

The rule only requires that the defender have feet on the floor before the player goes airborne. I can see what you are saying, but momentum has nothing to do with the actual rule. Now if you are suggesting the defender "leaned over" then that case is a different factor, but it appears he got his feet there first. I will say it was close, but I tend to give the benefit of the doubt to the defender when he is trying to make an effort to get in the way.

Peace

justacoach Sun Mar 31, 2013 03:53pm

Appears the L, in transition, didn't pick up the secondary defender. Watch his eyes....seems surprised to see 2nd defender.

PC, but close

twocentsworth Sun Mar 31, 2013 04:29pm

I'm not surprised Randy McCall got this call wrong.....I was SHOCKED to see him working on the second weekend of the tourney. His performance in the UL v Colorado St game was poor, imho......

justacoach Sun Mar 31, 2013 05:27pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by JRutledge (Post 887918)
The rule only requires that the defender have feet on the floor before the player goes airborne.

Rule citation, please....

JRutledge Sun Mar 31, 2013 05:36pm

Here you go.
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by justacoach (Post 887972)
Rule citation, please....

4-35-4

Art. 4. To establish an initial legal guarding position on the player with the ball:
a. The guard shall have both feet touching the playing court. When the guard jumps into position initially, both feet must return to the playing court after the jump, for the guard to attain a legal guarding position.
b. The guard’s torso shall face the opponent.
c. No time and distance shall be required.
d. When the opponent with the ball is airborne, the guard shall have attained legal guarding position before the opponent left the playing court. (Exception: Rule 4-35.7)

Peace

just another ref Sun Mar 31, 2013 05:38pm

PC foul

Camron Rust Sun Mar 31, 2013 06:04pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by JRutledge (Post 887918)
The rule only requires that the defender have feet on the floor before the player goes airborne. I can see what you are saying, but momentum has nothing to do with the actual rule. Now if you are suggesting the defender "leaned over" then that case is a different factor, but it appears he got his feet there first. I will say it was close, but I tend to give the benefit of the doubt to the defender when he is trying to make an effort to get in the way.

Peace

Quote:

Originally Posted by justacoach (Post 887972)
Rule citation, please....

It does also require they they have their torso in their path with the feet down from the basic definition of guarding. If they're jumping into position and their body comes into the path after the feet land (which is often the case), they don't have LGP until the body is in the path.

In this case, I think the body was in the path in time, even if it was still shifting.

ballgame99 Sun Mar 31, 2013 06:54pm

The defender gets feet there in time, but then momentum carries his torso so he is leaning and way off balance. Does that lean not negate his lgp? I don't mind the block here.

zakman2005000 Sun Mar 31, 2013 07:18pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by justacoach (Post 887972)
Rule citation, please....

Quote:

Originally Posted by JRutledge (Post 887975)
4-35-4

Art. 4. To establish an initial legal guarding position on the player with the ball:
a. The guard shall have both feet touching the playing court. When the guard jumps into position initially, both feet must return to the playing court after the jump, for the guard to attain a legal guarding position.
b. The guard’s torso shall face the opponent.
c. No time and distance shall be required.
d. When the opponent with the ball is airborne, the guard shall have attained legal guarding position before the opponent left the playing court. (Exception: Rule 4-35.7)

Peace

Your bolded text says only that the guard shall attain LGP and nothing about feet on the floor.

JRutledge Sun Mar 31, 2013 07:23pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by zakman2005000 (Post 888023)
Your bolded text says only that the guard shall attain LGP and nothing about feet on the floor.

You just have feet on the floor to establish LGP and if you have not done so you cannot be in LGP before the player leaves the floor. Nothing says that he must be still before the player goes airborne, which is what was suggested.

Peace

#olderthanilook Sun Mar 31, 2013 07:33pm

PC foul. Defender est LPG before A1 leaves the floor. Close, but I've seen much closer play vids posted on this forum.

Kelvin green Sun Mar 31, 2013 08:50pm

I actually like the block call. Contact was with shoulder.. Looks like leaning at time of contact.


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