Actionless Contest

Fed2You

Utah 5A boys semi-finals. 1st qtr is going along fine till about half way through, after a timeout. Team A inbounds the ball and passes to the PG standing just inside his frontcourt.....and he proceeds to stand there for the next 3 1/2 minutes. Team B is in a 2-3 zone and won't come out. Crowd was booing to beat all heck. Team A finally tries for the last shot of the quarter and misses. 😕

2nd quarter, Team A's ball on AP. SAME EXACT THING. The entire 2nd quarter was squandered until Team A tried for the final shot of the half and missed. 😠 Score: 14-7, Team B up. Thankfully, 3rd and 4th quarters were normal and Team B beat the wheels off of Team A. 🙂

Hopefully Utah will have a shot clock next year, at least for Regionals and beyond because of this. I've never seen anything like it. 😕 As a fan i was pissed. As a ref, I would have been incredibly frustrated. Seems like there should be something we can do, but which team has the onus to force action? Bring in the shot clock!

johnny d

Be careful what you wish for. Nothing can screw up a game like a bad shot clock operator. Based on the lack of competence that some of the score keepers and regular timers we have working around here, I hope we dont ever get a shot clock.

APG

As an official, I'd prefer not to work a game like that...but hey, if you're going to pay me X amount of dollars to stand and watch y'all not play basketball, then whatever.

If I had to drop money to watch that though? I'd be pissed. That **** ain't basketball to me.

And there's no way a state would force the shot clock during the playoffs...the shot clock dramatically alters style of play...not something you can spring on teams toward the end of the season.

grunewar

APG wrote
As an official, I'd prefer not to work a game like that...but hey, if you're going to pay me X amount of dollars to stand and watch y'all not play basketball, then whatever.

Had it happen to me once for a VG game. As the T I was where the girl was holding the ball. I just kept thinking - cha-ching, cha-ching, cha-ching!

Bad Zebra

For the relatively few times this occurs, I wouldn't alter the rule book. Yes it stinks as a fan. Yes, it's frustrating as an official. But it's hardly become common enough to warrant a rule change.

Everybody comes across these games occasionally. I've seen it where there's a big disparity between size or speed for a team. The lesser team will try it to either slow the game down to their level or frustrate the other team into commiting dumb fouls. That being said, I've NEVER seen it work successfully for an entire game. I'd love to hear if anyone else has ever seen it used successfully.

stiffler3492

APG wrote
And there's no way a state would force the shot clock during the playoffs...the shot clock dramatically alters style of play...not something you can spring on teams toward the end of the season.

Agree. Wouldn't be fair to coaches/players/officials. Full season or not at all.

JetMetFan

stiffler3492 wrote
Agree. Wouldn't be fair to coaches/players/officials. Full season or not at all.

From our standpoint, it's tough enough for some to switch from two-person to three-person when the playoffs roll around. Adding in the worries of a shot-clock at the most important time of the season would be ugly waiting to happen.

bob jenkins

Bad Zebra wrote
I've seen it where there's a big disparity between size or speed for a team.

Since a team can't recruit (at least most teams; and at least not to the level of college), and since the game isn't (all) about "entertainment", a team should be able to emply this strategy to give them the best chance of winning.

Add that to the cost, and the errors we find with the shot-clock operators, and put me down as a strong NO vote on the shot clock for HS ball.

Now, when it does happen, I think that one of the referees should get with the coaches to see how long theyplan to use this strategy and just shorten the period. 😉

SCalScoreKeeper

I work in a shot clock state and the operators I have seen do a really good job.Rarely does an official have to stop the clock and correct a shot clock issue.Usually if they do it is a difference between the operator and official about team control in a loose ball situation.

Adam

bob jenkins wrote
Since a team can't recruit (at least most teams; and at least not to the level of college), and since the game isn't (all) about "entertainment", a team should be able to emply this strategy to give them the best chance of winning.

Add that to the cost, and the errors we find with the shot-clock operators, and put me down as a strong NO vote on the shot clock for HS ball.

Now, when it does happen, I think that one of the referees should get with the coaches to see how long theyplan to use this strategy and just shorten the period. 😉

This.

It's the classic case of a solution in search of a problem.

BillyMac

bob jenkins wrote
I think that one of the referees should get with the coaches to see how long they plan to use this strategy and just shorten the period.

Do any of you veterans assume that "stall ball" is unskilled, and is very easy for coaches to teach, and equally as easy for the kids to play? I know that it doesn't seem very exciting to fans, but as a former player, a retired middle school coach, and a veteran official, I can tell you, it ain't easy. High school kids, and they're just kids, want to run up, and down, the court and shoot the ball as many times as possible. For them to be coached to do it any other way, and to be even moderately successful at it, is a great achievement, and I appreciate the effort involved when I come across one of these games every couple of years.

JugglingReferee

bob jenkins wrote
and just shorten the period. 😉

Hopefully the second game of a double-header. 🙂

LeeBallanfant

johnny d wrote
Be careful what you wish for. Nothing can screw up a game like a bad shot clock operator. Based on the lack of competence that some of the score keepers and regular timers we have working around here, I hope we dont ever get a shot clock.

Worse they might bring back the "Lack of Sufficient Action" Rule

26 Year Gap

johnny d wrote
Be careful what you wish for. Nothing can screw up a game like a bad shot clock operator. Based on the lack of competence that some of the score keepers and regular timers we have working around here, I hope we dont ever get a shot clock.

Especially one who thinks that he knows all of the rules.😃

HawkeyeCubP

SCalScoreKeeper wrote
I work in a shot clock state and the operators I have seen do a really good job.Rarely does an official have to stop the clock and correct a shot clock issue.Usually if they do it is a difference between the operator and official about team control in a loose ball situation.

+1 for when I did for 5 years.

BktBallRef

bob jenkins wrote
....put me down as a strong NO vote on the shot clock for HS ball.

Hear! Hear!

Scooby

I've had a game like this once in over ten yeas of varsity ball. I Loved It! A nice break. Now if it was 2-3 times a season, that would be a whole different story.

By the way my partner missed a travel in the game. With A1 holding the ball he lifts his right foot and wiped the dust off it and then about a minute latter he did the same with his left foot.

Nevadaref

Bad Zebra wrote
For the relatively few times this occurs, I wouldn't alter the rule book. Yes it stinks as a fan. Yes, it's frustrating as an official. But it's hardly become common enough to warrant a rule change.

Everybody comes across these games occasionally. I've seen it where there's a big disparity between size or speed for a team. The lesser team will try it to either slow the game down to their level or frustrate the other team into commiting dumb fouls. That being said, I've NEVER seen it work successfully for an entire game. I'd love to hear if anyone else has ever seen it used successfully.

Milan vs Muncie Central, 1954 Indiana State Championship Game is a famous example.

Rich

Tennessee 11, Temple 6 in 1973. My HS supervisor (since deceased) worked that game.

It's credited with playing a role towards implementing a shot clock in the NCAA, even though it took another decade to do it.

Bad Zebra

Nevadaref wrote
Milan vs Muncie Central, 1954 Indiana State Championship Game is a famous example.

I'm skeptical, video clip? 😀