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-   -   Illegal Use of Hands (https://forum.officiating.com/basketball/94030-illegal-use-hands.html)

HawkeyeCubP Thu Feb 14, 2013 01:46pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by cmckenna (Post 879443)
NOTHING.

Why are you saying anything that you do not have to. The mechanics manual does not state anything about speaking the nature of the foul. Just the approved signals.

Speaking just opens yourself up for more trouble. COLOR, NUMBER, SIGNAL.

True, the majority of the time, but it can serve to help sell and/or explain the call sometimes - especially in states that do not want HS officials using supplementary signals that aren't currently in the manual.

scrounge Thu Feb 14, 2013 01:48pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by cmckenna (Post 879443)
NOTHING.

Why are you saying anything that you do not have to. The mechanics manual does not state anything about speaking the nature of the foul. Just the approved signals.

Speaking just opens yourself up for more trouble. COLOR, NUMBER, SIGNAL.

How much trouble can you really get just by saying "arm", "push", "handcheck", etc?

APG Thu Feb 14, 2013 01:57pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by cmckenna (Post 879443)
NOTHING.

Why are you saying anything that you do not have to. The mechanics manual does not state anything about speaking the nature of the foul. Just the approved signals.

Speaking just opens yourself up for more trouble. COLOR, NUMBER, SIGNAL.

What trouble or you opening yourself up to? If anything, I've stopped a coach from potentially arguing a call by verbalizing what happened on the play.

rockyroad Thu Feb 14, 2013 02:15pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by APG (Post 879462)
What trouble or you opening yourself up to? If anything, I've stopped a coach from potentially arguing a call by verbalizing what happened on the play.

Maybe it's one of those old wives tales of officiating...I was always told the same thing - the less you say, the less trouble you will get into. Never have figured that out as it applies to this, but I still only verbalize when it's something that needs some kind of clarification - like an illegal screen, or a hit to the head or something like that.

Raymond Thu Feb 14, 2013 02:34pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by cmckenna (Post 879443)
NOTHING.

Why are you saying anything that you do not have to. The mechanics manual does not state anything about speaking the nature of the foul. Just the approved signals.

Speaking just opens yourself up for more trouble. COLOR, NUMBER, SIGNAL.

How does it open you up to more trouble? It eliminates my troubles b/c after I verbalize I don't have to spend any time explaining to the coach what happened. I just told him when I reported the foul.

Rich Thu Feb 14, 2013 02:38pm

I'm not saying I'll never do it. Just not routinely.

JRutledge Thu Feb 14, 2013 02:42pm

I always say exactly what they did. If they hit the right arm, I say just that or "Hit him in the head" since we cannot use that signal. That tends to stop a lot of conversation about "What did they do.....?"

Peace

BillyMac Thu Feb 14, 2013 06:13pm

Hit Man ...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by cmckenna (Post 879443)
The mechanics manual does not state anything about speaking the nature of the foul.

Also true for the IAABO Manual, but I still say, "Hit".

VaTerp Fri Feb 15, 2013 12:28am

Depending on what kind of play it is I may say nothing, "hit", or "on the head."

IMO any offical who says "reach" or even has that word in their vocabulary should suffer physical punishment.

rekent Fri Feb 15, 2013 12:36am

Quote:

Originally Posted by VaTerp (Post 879590)
IMO any offical who says "reach" or even has that word in their vocabulary should suffer physical punishment.

But then what do you call when the defender reaches in and tries to steal the ball from the dribbler??? That isn't fair, it has to be a foul! :sarcasm:

AremRed Fri Feb 15, 2013 02:14am

Quote:

Originally Posted by HawkeyeCubP (Post 879451)
True, the majority of the time, but it can serve to help sell and/or explain the call sometimes - especially in states that do not want HS officials using supplementary signals that aren't currently in the manual.

I don't usually verbalize calls, but I do when I call a handcheck. I do the signal and loudly say "two hands!". The players hear that and adjust.

I am thinking a lot about when to verbalize a call. I agree that a coach's question can be answered before it is asked by verbalizing the call. I am unsure about these "potential problems" that others speak of. For me though, sticking to the book is never a bad idea.

Quote:

Originally Posted by VaTerp (Post 879590)
IMO any offical who says "reach" or even has that word in their vocabulary should suffer physical punishment.

That seems harsh, doesn't it?

Welpe Fri Feb 15, 2013 03:43am

Not really. A reach implies a foul with no or minimal contact. As officials, I think we should avoid giving any credence to the notion that reaching is a foul.

BillyMac Fri Feb 15, 2013 07:32am

Verboten ...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Welpe (Post 879606)
As officials, I think we should avoid giving any credence to the notion that reaching is a foul.

"On the floor."

"Over the back."

"Moving screen."

"Let it hit the rim."

Others?

bob jenkins Fri Feb 15, 2013 08:51am

Quote:

Originally Posted by seanwestref (Post 879599)
I don't usually verbalize calls, but I do when I call a handcheck. I do the signal and loudly say "two hands!". The players hear that and adjust.

What if the handcheck wasn't with two hands?

I give additional information if needed after the reporting -- an extra signal (tug on the shirt if the "hold" was for pulling the uniform for example), or a "5 words or fewer" explanation to the coach). Usually happens about 2x per game.


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