Not notified of 5th foul

3pointer9

What happens if a player commits 5th foul (and has fouled out) whereby the scorekeeper does not notify refs and then same player commits another foul and the scorekeeper then lets refs know that the player has fouled out. Is it marked as player's 6th foul (and team foul) and everything continues as normally would when a player fouls out? I know that , in that scenario, if that player had scored any points after 5th foul they would count.

JugglingReferee

3pointer9 wrote
What happens if a player commits 5th foul (and has fouled out) whereby the scorekeeper does not notify refs and then same player commits another foul and the scorekeeper then lets refs know that the player has fouled out. Is it marked as player's 6th foul (and team foul) and everything continues as normally would when a player fouls out? I know that , in that scenario, if that player had scored any points after 5th foul they would count.

Yes, it is marked as the 6th foul on that player. Points scored, time consumed, etc, all count.

And technically speaking, the player wasn't DQ'd at 5 foul because the coach wasn't notified by a referee.

JRutledge

Everything counts and when it is brought to the official's attention that the player had a 5th foul, then that player is removed.

Otherwise the scorekeeper might get fired from future games, but in that game not much you can do. And there are rules in place that allow for both teams to have a check and balance way to not let that happen.

Peace

tjones1

2-11-11 Note 2

3pointer9

Great. Thanks for the speedy replies!

3pointer9

tjones
I am brand new to forum. Can you tell me what you are referring to?

JRutledge

3pointer9 wrote
tjones
I am brand new to forum. Can you tell me what you are referring to?

Rulebook reference.

Are you an official, fan or coach?

Peace

3pointer9

Fairly new official. Youth basketball (3rd through 8 grade) girls. We use NCAA with some modifications. So, I am not sure where tjones is referring to.

3pointer9

Ok-- I found it. tjones is referring to NFHS.

APG

3pointer9 wrote
Fairly new official. Youth basketball (3rd through 8 grade) girls. We use NCAA with some modifications. So, I am not sure where tjones is referring to.

Tjones is referring to the NFHS (National Federation of High School) rule book (which is the rule set used by the overwhelming majority of leagues in the US, high school and below). Specifically, he's referring to Rule 2, Section 11, Article 11, Note 2:

2. The procedure if a player who has committed his/her fifth foul continues to play because the scorer has failed to notify the official is as follows: As soon as the scorer discovers the irregularity, the game horn should be sounded after, or as soon as, the ball is in control of the offending team or is dead. The disqualified player must be removed immediately. Any points which may have been scored while such player was illegally in the game are counted. If other aspects of the error are correctable, the procedure to be followed is included among the duties of the officials.

tjones1

3pointer9 wrote
Fairly new official. Youth basketball (3rd through 8 grade) girls. We use NCAA with some modifications. So, I am not sure where tjones is referring to.

I was refering to the Rule-Section-Article in the NFHS (high school) rule book.

Since you using NCAA, I believe that reference is 2-9-13.

3pointer9

tjones1 wrote
I was refering to the Rule-Section-Article in the NFHS (high school) rule book.

Since you using NCAA, I believe that reference is 2-9-13.

Funny, I had did some word searches on the online NCAA rule book prior to joining forum. I now see that in this particular case, the NFHS book spells it out in much greater detail.

Thanks everyone! I am sure I will have other questions!

MD Longhorn

3pointer9 wrote
Fairly new official. Youth basketball (3rd through 8 grade) girls. We use NCAA with some modifications. So, I am not sure where tjones is referring to.

Word of advice going forward. If you don't specify a ruleset, the assumption is that you're talking about NFHS rules. Since you aren't working that, you will get some bad advice at times if you don't specify your ruleset in your question.

Welcome to the forum!

letemplay

Just curious, but it seems a bit strange to hear youth leagues, especially down to third grade, sort of bypassing high school rules, and using NCAA. I'd bet the majority of rec youth leagues, most AAU or travel (competitive) games go by NFHS standards. Heck, round here even the Adult Open Leagues use high school rules (with a few exceptions like 20 minute halfs). This I believe is because a great majority of the pool of officials that can be used in a given area are going to be high school sanctioned and thus more familiar with that level than college. I doubt many college officials are at the local rec center on Sat mornings running with some 4th graders🙂

3pointer9

The league that I officiate in uses NCAA rules for the girls and NFHS for the boys. I am currently only certified for the girls. Now, on top of the NCAA rules, there is a layer of NYS modifications and then there are further modifications for the particular league that I officiate in. So, our base is NCAA, but with the modifications that I mentioned.

I will definitely reference NCAA rule book in any of my future posts where I am asking about rules and situations.