Who makes the call?
 

Girls varsity -- 2 man.
Ball at A1 top of the key.
Lead is under basket left side, trail is opposite table side.
Ball swings to table side wing, then down to A2 for a spot up 3.

Ball goes in, trail signals 3, (and I don't know why but also verbals "3" to table).

Lead sees the score changed by 3 points and blows whistle as B team is dribbling in the backcourt. Changes trails call to a two. No discussion between officials.

CoachP alomost got his first T since 1999. Did I have a legit beef?

Pass on This One
 

Better bitter battles to bite off. As described, this was lead's call. And if my trail in that instance came up with a signal and I knew it was incorrect, I'd overrule him, too. Followed by having speaks with him at halftime regarding why he's guessing at something like that.

In most (but not all) areas, a 2-to-a-3 or a 3-to-a-2 is changed without discussion.

If the shot was from below the FT line extended on L's side, it was L's call.

Lead's call all the way. Good job by L to catch the error.

What would your beef have been? What would you have argued?

My beef was lead changed the call from behind left side lane and the three was from the right side corner. That was the side the trail was on, in front of home team bench. I saw a "3" from visitors bench and the trail saw "3". We had the best view. ;)

Really? That is leads call in the far corner? Seems better look from where trail was...oh well.

Plus, we were 8-0 until that night and we were getting our you-know-what's handed to us...

Coach, did you have a good view? Are you 100% sure the L was wrong? Or were you just arguing because the call was changed?

A lot of guys (and gals) pregame this, and will explicitly discuss having it handled exactly this way.

"If you see me get a 3 pt shot wrong, just blow the whistle and fix it. No need to discuss."

Ah, I see, the shot was from T's side, not L's. The only guy I know who's sneaking a peak at this shot from L is tref. :D

Both!

I am 100% sure, trail solidified it with signal AND verbal to the table as he passed by, so I assuming HE was 100%....

Yes. (Maybe my OP wasn't all that clear?)

Any film available, tape dont lie.

It was clear, but for some reason I got confused when reading it. After you repeated it, I re-read and it seemed clear.

As tref notes, too, I'd check the tape. It's possible the L was right and the T (and you) were some how obstructed. Either way, I'll bet they had a nice little chat in the locker room.

The bolded part is confusing me then. Was the trail "opposite the table"? That's how I read it.

Ah, there it is...!

Trail is tableside (right side). Lead is underbasket. (leftside)

Less confusing this way.

The Lead should also have seen that the T signalled a successful 3-point field goal. As soon as that happens, whistle the play dead and change the call to a 2-pointer.

Try not to give a subsequent Team B throw-in on the end line without the ability to run the end line. (This can be done one of two ways.)

Trail is table side is all that needs stating. We know where the L is going to be.

Not necessarily.

Yep, L could slide over; especially if the ball is in that corner. Although if he does, he's likely got his back to the 3 pt line.

If they want the L strongside, pay for the 3rd!

Disagree, but we've had this discussion before. :D

All 10 on that side, you still standing weakside? I don't work much 2 person, but that's a bunch for your trail to deal with solo.

Not true as this is a mechanic, not about who pays for the officials which in at least my case have nothing to do with each other.

Peace

Aren't you the one that always preaches the crew needs to get the call right? :)

True :D

Where did I say that I stayed weakside?? Neither do I.

Its optional here, well, at least in the 2 person games I work it is.

I dont "preach" anything & I dont work many 2 person games either.
Pinching the paint provides a great look AND you are that much closer to your sideline responsibilities.

If you disagree with the option in general, that's one thing. But to refuse to cross simply because you want a third official (which is what your statement implies) is purposefully giving them less effort than is required. And some games just don't need 3, which further goes against your point.

I don't cross as quickly as in 3, but if the action is all over there, I'm moving to get a better angle; especially if the T has to have eyes on the ball outside the paint.

Well that's the world I'm in and I'm not giving less than my best effort. They want us flexing strong side here when we can.

You more certainly implied it.

I think I gave more than one reason, sometimes we read/hear what we want.

- Pinching the paint provides a good look
- That method gives you a closer route back to your sideline responsibilities

Perhaps my thoughts differ because I didnt start officiating in that era. When I came in it was 3 & that is what todays game deserves.

So, in college & pro games how do they decide which games "need" 3 & which ones dont? Ohhhhh they dont, every game is officiated with a crew of 3 for consistencies sake!

I only started three years ago so I'm most certainly of this era. There are far too many subvarsity and small classification varsity games here with two officials to insist that it is three or nothing. We'd never play any games if that were the case.

I did not say it was mandatory or you would lose all games if you did not use it. And considering that 2 Person is only really worked at the lower level, then this is mostly a non-issue when it really counts.

Well I am in a training capacity so we teach this as an option. If someone chooses not to do it, no one is going to be upset about it. It is used and usually very rare.

Peace

I don't think there is an "era" as far as 2-man/3-man unless you were dropped directly into college and pro officiating.

You did say if they want a 2nd official strongside then pay for a 3rd. Well that's not going to happen. And pinching the paint does not give you as good a look as actually coming all the way over. Pinching the paint is still going to leave you stacked to the post play that is happening on the other side paint.

I hear ya! I guess it boils down to, you doing whats best for you to improve & advance in the area that you're in.

And me doing the same where I am.

I didn't state that you did, I believe it was more in the form of a question based on an obvious scenario in which you should be strongside.

No doubt. :)

I do not disagree, but you made the point that this was based on not hiring a 3rd in replacement of what is being taught. That was really the only reason I commented. I do not hardly see a 2 Person game outside of the summer, so this hardly comes into my thinking other than when I am observing or working games myself. The point is that who teaches this has nothing to do with who hires officials.

Peace

A Picture Is Worth A Thousand Words ...
 

Better Than Three-Person?
 

According to your illustration your state must be assigning four-person crews out there, eh? Or is that an IAABO thing? ;)

Maybe in a small corner?

And No Switching, Ever ...
 

This is the four person game that we only use with the old guys. No running. Just stay out of the way of the players when you're at one of the trail positions. It's not just in my little corner of Connecticut, it's statewide. We've got a lot of elderly officials in Connecticut. When we say, "Stay in your primary", we really mean it.

"Tonight's officials are ___, ___, ___, and ___. Together, they have over 220 years of experience!"

What is "the lower level"?

We have some 3A and 4A VB games two man.

Anything that is not varsity is "lower level."

Peace

That picture is exactly my OP Billy!

So in my OP I did have a legit beef?

My girl nailed a 3 from the orange corner in front of the visitors bench, trail signalled "3", also, per my bookkeeper, he turned to them and announced "3" before going up the floor. Lead stopped play with ball in B's backcourt when he noticed the score and told them to change it to a "2".

Geriatric Crew ...
 

Fixed it for you.

Beef?

The right to take your team's performance out on the officials? No.

The right to belittle them and start coaching them like kids? No.

The right to start acting like a Koach? No.

The right to complain. Sure.

Have you looked at the tape?

It happened in the first half when it was still a game. At that point in time, changing the call had some significance. All I wanted was to know why he (Lead) was changing the Trails call. Hence my OP about who covers what area for corner three's.

As far as the other questions, no. That is not coachp. ;)

And have yet to view the tape...

Perhaps once you do this ^^^ it will lead you to understand why he did the following.