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-   -   Wrong way lineup at tip (https://forum.officiating.com/basketball/86326-wrong-way-lineup-tip.html)

Shades of Gray Fri Jan 20, 2012 10:46pm

Wrong way lineup at tip
 
Varsity girls game tonite. At opening tip teams are lined up facing the wrong way. Visitors get tip and go down and miss layup. Home team rebounds and visitors retreat to other end. At that point, home fans start screaming at their team they were lined up the wrong way and encourage them to shoot at the basket the visitors missed at. After about 4-5 seconds ( while standing in the lane), the home team player shoots and makes a layup at that basket totally uncontested. The refs then realize what happened and blow the whistle and stop the game.

They confer and allow the basket to count for the home team and give the visitors the ball under that basket and correct which goal they are shooting at. My thought was the goal should have counted for the visitors since this was the basket they were positioned to shoot at on the tip. Can some of you experts advise as to the correct ruling?

By the way, the boys game later went into overtime and the officials lined the teams up the wrong way for the overtime period. Wow.

Welpe Fri Jan 20, 2012 11:22pm

Here are some relevant casebook plays:

5.2.1E

During the pregame practice period, the visiting team properly uses the east goal and the home team the west goal. The officials, by mistake, allow the jumpers to face the wrong direction to start the game. A1 controls the tap by tapping the ball back to A2. A2, realizing that he/she had warmed up at the basket behind A1, dribbles to that basket and scores an uncontested basket.

RULING: Score the basket for Team A. The officials should stop the game and emphasize to both teams the proper direction. The mistake is an official's error by allowing A1 and B1 to face the wrong direction; not a correctable error.

5.2.1F

During the pregame practice period, the visiting team properly uses the east goal and the home team the west goal. The officials, by mistake, allow the jumpers to face the wrong direction to start the game. Several baskets are scored before it is recognized that both teams are throwing the ball into the opponent's basket.

RULING: All points scored count as if the teams had gone the right direction and scored in their own basket. Once the mistake is recognized, play shall continue with each team attempting to score in its own basket. (4-5-4)



Since this was the first basket of the game, I'd say the officials treated the situation properly by awarding the points to A (home team).

just another ref Sat Jan 21, 2012 12:06am

Since the OP is not directly covered by either of the case plays, it seems to be it would fall under 2-3. I would wave off the basket, straighten out the directions, and give the home team the ball on the endline opposite their basket.

I also am not a fan of the first case play. (E) Is it written somewhere that the basket where the team warms up is that team's basket? It is written that the jumper is in the half of the center circle farthest from his basket.

BillyMac Sat Jan 21, 2012 08:01am

4-5-2:
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by just another ref (Post 815322)
Is it written somewhere that the basket where the team warms up is that team's basket?

It is written: Each team’s basket for practice before the game and for the first half shall be the one farther from its team bench.

Shades of Gray Sat Jan 21, 2012 09:41am

Wrong way Lineup at Tip
 
I'm not sure what you guys mean by "it is written". Are you referring to the Federation rulebook?

If so, then doesn't the fact that if it is written that the team's basket is the one farthest from their bench directly conflict with the casebook play quoted as 5.2.1F?

By the way, the final score of the game was 48-47, so you could say this had a significant impact.

bob jenkins Sat Jan 21, 2012 09:54am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shades of Gray (Post 815412)
I'm not sure what you guys mean by "it is written". Are you referring to the Federation rulebook?

If so, then doesn't the fact that if it is written that the team's basket is the one farthest from their bench directly conflict with the casebook play quoted as 5.2.1F?

Yes.

No.

mbyron Sat Jan 21, 2012 10:09am

Varsity? Lah me.

At least they fixed it correctly.

just another ref Sat Jan 21, 2012 10:56am

Quote:

Originally Posted by BillyMac (Post 815391)
It is written: Each team’s basket for practice before the game and for the first half shall be the one farther from its team bench.

Okay, shoulda known that. But, 4-5-4 goes on to say: ".......if .....officials permit a team to go the wrong direction, when discovered all points scored.........count....."

In the OP, no points were scored with teams allowed to go the wrong direction. If visitors tried to score at the wrong basket and home tried to defend that basket, it should take a stoppage of play to correct the situation before home is allowed to score.

Adam Sat Jan 21, 2012 10:29pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shades of Gray (Post 815412)
By the way, the final score of the game was 48-47, so you could say this had a significant impact.

Not really.

BktBallRef Sat Jan 21, 2012 10:38pm

Team A realized which basket they were supposed to shoot at, shot, and made the basket. No way I'm taking that basket off the board.

bob jenkins Sat Jan 21, 2012 10:53pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by BktBallRef (Post 815517)
Team A realized which basket they were supposed to shoot at, shot, and made the basket. No way I'm taking that basket off the board.

+1

That said, if someone waits "about 4-5 seconds ( while standing in the lane), " and the fans are screaming, I'm figuring out what is going on and (I hope) not letting it get that far.

BktBallRef Sat Jan 21, 2012 10:56pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by bob jenkins (Post 815523)
That said, if someone waits "about 4-5 seconds ( while standing in the lane), " and the fans are screaming, I'm figuring out what is going on and (I hope) not letting it get that far.

Exactly.

But if you don't get it stopped before they score,...oh well.

WhistlesAndStripes Sat Jan 21, 2012 11:54pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shades of Gray (Post 815305)
Varsity girls game tonite. At opening tip teams are lined up facing the wrong way. Visitors get tip and go down and miss layup. Home team rebounds and visitors retreat to other end. At that point, home fans start screaming at their team they were lined up the wrong way and encourage them to shoot at the basket the visitors missed at. After about 4-5 seconds ( while standing in the lane), the home team player shoots and makes a layup at that basket totally uncontested. The refs then realize what happened and blow the whistle and stop the game.

They confer and allow the basket to count for the home team and give the visitors the ball under that basket and correct which goal they are shooting at. My thought was the goal should have counted for the visitors since this was the basket they were positioned to shoot at on the tip. Can some of you experts advise as to the correct ruling?

By the way, the boys game later went into overtime and the officials lined the teams up the wrong way for the overtime period. Wow.

They shoulda made the damn 3 second call!!!


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