How much do you talk to coaches?
 

I'm a first year ref. In my first batch of games I have been hesitant to talk to the coaches much, but I have now realized that I could probably make things smoother for myself if I would give them an ear once in a while. What is the appropriate time and tone to talk to a coach who is whining about calls? What do you do when you feel you may have missed a call and coach is telling you about it? Admit your mistake?

I almost exclusively only speak when spoken to. And only then when it's in the form of a question. And only then when it's asked in a respectful way.

Situations when I will speak to a coach when not spoken to is when a coach is violating a rule, such as being out of the coaching box.

The ability to be approachable and talk to coaches is something that takes new officials time to develop. If they're experienced and you're just learning the ropes, they'll eat you alive. They know what to say, you don't.

As a few guidelines:
#1, first and foremost, answer questions but do NOT address comments.

Only talk to the coach when the opportunity presents itself.
Don't get caught up in a convo when you should be officiating.
Don't throw your partner under the bus.
Don't argue with him. If you disagree, walk away when it's obvious nothing is going to change his mind or yours.
Admitting a mistake is okay but once a game is enough.

I'm sure others will offer their thoughts as well.

Silence can't be misquoted. If you can't think of an appropriate response, don't say anything.

Answer questions only.

Ignore comments (unless they rise to the level of a Technical Foul, then take care of business).

Only talk to the coach during a dead ball.

Keep your voice calm. Use a normal conversational tone.

Body language is important. When taking to the coach, have your arms at your sides or behind your back. Never fold your arms in front of you, this makes you look unapproachable.

You get a maximum of one "you're right coach, I kicked that call" per game. Use it wisely.

If they're questioning a charge/block call/no-call, I've found that it can help to include the phrase "legal guarding position" into your response. "Coach, the defender established legal guarding position and your player initiated the contact"

You can initiate conversation, but only to give factual information (Coach, you have 3 timeouts remaining), or to request their help with a situation (Coach, please stay in your coaching box).

The coach is not supposed to be your friend. So, do not expect to win one over. Respond to questions asked with civility. If I have made a call off ball or where a coach may have been straightlined, I will answer a "What happened?" type of question. Good coaches will use that information to help coach their players. Too many new officials are told to "not talk to coaches" rather than given instruction as to when and how. I am still learning, and will be still learning on the day I hang up the whistle.

Pretty much covered all the basics right here. I agree with all of this.

I just had this conversation last night with a JV official who was talking about how to respond to a comment by a coach and talking with coaches in general.

I told her don't respond too comments, only questions. If you do get engaged with a coach during their commentary simply state something along the lines of "coach, if you have a specific question, I'd be happy to address it."

Veteran coaches know how to get a lot of commentary into their "questions." Sometimes a good, "Coach, we hear you" with a variation of the stop sign technique works well for me in those situations.

Technically, I believe we are only "suppose" to discuss rules questions. But the more experience you get the more you will learn how to verbally interact with coaches. And learning how to do so efficiently and effectively will go along way toward advancing your career as an official.

As a young official it's tough but I would suggest limiting what you say until you feel more comfortable in your responses. A lot of time coaches just want to be heard. As long as they are respectful, let them know you hear them (use body language) and as you gain experience you will gain confidence in what responses work for you.

Here is what I've done
 

I'm in my 2nd varsity year, so I'm a newer official.

I would say try things. Especially in the off season. During season like we are right now, I didn't say much my first year. I acknowledged a lot of comments at first with a nod but very rarely said anything.

In the off season, I tried conversing more and sometimes I found I overstepped and said far too much. Sometimes I found that I didn't say enough.

I saw my mentor, yesterday, in a game and he did something I never even thought about doing. Three man mechanics, we rotate opposite table as the calling official, but he simply said to his partner "I'm staying" and he had a brief discussion with the coach. I couldn't hear what he was saying, but it didn't matter, he acknowledged the coach and then addressed it. I did hear what the coach said, he nodded and said "I understand that" and then walked away.

Generally for me I would just talk to coaches when I was on their sideline and they had a question. But now if there's ever a dicey play that needs immediate intervention from preventing a blow up, I think I will try this tactic.

I only talk to them when they ask questions or when the ball is clearly dead like during or after a timeout. Otherwise I do not seek them out or try to say much to them. They have a job to do and there is not much reason to talk to them. I also do not answer statements or address them when they are yelling.

Peace

One lesson that you (the OP, not the person I'm using here for a reply) should get out of the way (here, rather than on the court) is that coaches are not your friends. No matter how friendly and nice they are at any point during the game, they can and will turn on you in a heartbeat.

And even when calls go their way, they relate to the coach that "got screwed" more than they relate to you. Players are the exact same way.

Use this knowledge, though, when you talk with coaches. I'm friendly (until I have a reason not to be), approachable (until I have a reason not to be) and will answer any question that a coach has (within reason). Don't think for one minute that a coach's friendly nature and handshake means that it's an invitation for you to initiate a dialogue about calls that go against him to try to "explain" them away.

As a first year official, I'd worry less about this and worry more about some other things that you can control more. Be confident with your calls -- be able to look the scorer in the eye when you report and don't appear to be in a hurry to "get away". If a coach asks a question, answer it with as few words as possible and move on. Make it look like you're willing to listen to comments, even if the comments are worthless. Use strong signals and portray confidence when making calls.

It took me a long time to get comfortable with talking with coaches because when I started we (as a group)talked a lot less than we do now. I think.

Also, a large number of coaches don't know the rules. So if you have a firm grasp of the rules, you can explain a call to them verbatim according to the rule and you may be able to confuse them enough to keep them quiet for the remainder of the game.:D

I hate that coaches can say some pretty stupid things at times, but there's wisdom in the saying that "You can't misquote silence." I've learned to ignore a lot of meaningless comments that are said during the heat of the game.

The hardest thing officials need to learn is to not care what coaches think about them during a game. Sure, an official wants to be known as professional, approachable, hard-working, etc., but the nature of the job is that there are a lot of close decisions that will annoy or anger one of the two coaches. It's part of the gig.

My biggest growth on the football field has been to let my wings (I'm a referee) handle 100% of the communication with the coaches unless someone specifically requests my presence as the crew chief). My biggest growth on the basketball court has been to learn that sometimes the best response to a comment (or even a loaded question) is to show the coach the back of my shirt.

And even when you know the rule and explain the rule in detail, they will still argue with you. I have explained verticality only to have coaches tell me there is such thing as "over the back." I had a coach try to tell me the other day that I should call a "moving screen" when his player literally ran around the guy. It never ceases to amaze me how dumb and stupid coaches can be when you try to talk to them even in the most calm and logic voice.

Peace

You can add to that list ... "This isn't the NBA. There's no continuation (continuous motion) in high school.

One of your challenges...
 

... is that you don't get to hear the conversations/communications of more veteran partners with coaches, in order to learn both positives and negatives. Soldier on. It gets better/easier.

One of the things that really helped me the last couple of years is going to some games -- not just the games that followed my JV games, but really going to games on nights when you don't have an assignment -- and watching the veteran guys and how they interact with the coaches. Go into the locker room at halftime and after the game and find the appropriate time to talk to them about what you saw.

ie, "Hey, I saw you talking to the coach after that PC foul you called. Can you tell me how that conversation went?" or "You really seemed to defuse that situation with that coach...what did you say to calm him down" or stuff like that.

No, we can't be immediately privy to those kinds of conversations, but going out of your way to learn from veteran guys not only shows that you want to learn, but there's a lot of value if you'll ask questions and listen.

Because for every Official there is on this forum that knows better, there is another Official out there running to the table saying "foul's on #23 over the back". :o

And maybe an announcer or 2 on TV....:(

There might be, but that is so rare that is not where the coaches get that from the majority of the time. I run a class of newer officials and it is the former players and coaches I have to get out of that habit language. And announcers do not help as they constantly repeat this fraud.

Peace

Who are 90% of the announcers? Former coaches and players....

It's not a majority, but it isn't rare either; not in my experience anyway.

I cannot think of a single official in years that has used that term that I have worked with.

Peace

I have heard a few of them. "White 24 with a reach" is also used by said officials. I try to not let my winces become visible in those situations.

I did work with a guy that said "reach" a while ago, but then again he never got to the point in his career as others. Of course it was not because of this, but if you do this what other things are you not paying attention to.

Peace

+1

Agreed

I heard "24 white, contact" the other day.

I thought involved parties might be led to think that all contact is a foul :(

Getting off the subject a little
 

I did the IAABO camp this summer and learned that apparently on the East Coast it's predominantly the case to say "Illegal Use" and in Colorado it's common to say "Hit". I found that kind of interesting. I have tried both and "Illegal Use" never rolls off my tongue.

Back on the subject, I heard a 4th year varsity official the other night say "over the back" and he actually did a made up mechanic to demonstrate this to the coach. It was two man and I don't think I kept my poker face at all.

I believe that we sometimes feel too obligated to respond to the coaches everytime, we all have a responsibility to the players on the floor and our area when the ball is live including free throws, throw ins etc. Although we pause they should know the ball is still inplay

One of the coaches in our area feels that every time a shooting foul is called that is his opportunity to talk to the officials; as an official we all have a responsibilty on players and areas not to talk with the coach. He was shocked that I didn't come from the far free throw line to talk to him during the free throws.

I want to be approachable and considerate to their needs; I'm just not sure who will do my job while I talk to the coach...and then what about the coach for the other team. Shouldn't we explain to him what we said to caoch A?

I assume you mean when reporting a foul to the table. Why do you feel the need to embellish the hand signal with anything verbal?

Yikes!!!!!:confused::confused::confused: Why would you do that? Unsolicited to boot. That's what ACs are for. It can only hurt you, should your info be wrong. When he's out,yes, as preventative medicine, I'll tell AC.

I check with the official scorebook during the timeout, and tell the HC after the timeout has ended. That way I know I'm not wrong. If the coach asks me when at some other point (during a FT, for example), I'll say "Coach, you need to ask the scorekeeper".

I also will let my partner know how many TOs each team has as the game's winding down.

That's correct, when reporting to the table "Blue 24, Hit" with the signal. On the East Coast, "Blue 24, Illegal Use" with the proper signal.

According to the IAABO mechanics book it is an Illegal use of hands mechanic, so it makes sense the way they do it there.

Many areas don't do this. I agree with those who don't. There's no need to volunteer this information, and sometimes the scorekeeper gives the incorrect information, and soemtimes the official reports it wrong and sometimes the coach hears it incorrectly.

Many (most?) areas just "Blue, 24" signal (no voice), "two shots" (or whatever).

I know what you were talking about, but what I was asking is why do you feel the need to SAY anything at all about the type of foul. Why not just use the hand signal and say nothing?

I signal the type of foul with no voice. Most people I work with do the same.

This is one of those areas where I'm sure you're right (about it being best practice), but I do it anyway. For the most part, I keep track of the timeouts used in my head (I want to remember if a team is out of 30s or 60s cause it makes TO administration easier, IMO) and if I ask the scorer, it's just to verify that I'm right.

We have discussed this before and have had a great debate about it. I do not seek out any timeout information. If the table tells me they are out and the nature of our mechanic to go to the bench and stay there, I might tell them they are out. But I do not want to go out of my way just to give them this information. If the table never tells me I am OK with that. These teams have people that keep track of that, I would rather they do their job and communicate to their team, not have officials do it for them. Half the time when I ask a coach what kind of time out they want, they already know what they have left.

Peace

Oh, I agree officials should know this. I just don't volunteer the information to the coach (until it gets to zero).

I am more descriptive. I say the foul they actually committed while giving the proper signal. I learned this at a camp and it works like a charm. I cannot think of the last time I had a single coach question what they did. They might claim something happened first.

Peace

That is actually how I was originally taught as well. But we evolve sometimes and decide to try something else. There really is not a right or wrong with this.

Peace

I do it cause that's how I was taught, never realized or noticed a difference. I will not voice the signal on my next game and watch the film on it. I may end up liking not voicing the signal more.

Why do you feel the need to check with scorekeeper to keep coach informed if he has 2,3,4 timeouts left.

The whole point is table tells you he has one left...YOU tell coach, table then finds mistake later in game and guess who gets blamed when he calls a TO and there isn't one left? You're right, not the table. Why act as his concierge?

Personally, I could care less when officials tell me how many TOs a team has left unless he's out. That said can't remember any Varsity partners telling me TO situation unless out. Just useless stuff.

I also don't want to train coaches to ask me how many TO they have which you mentioned(can't ever recall a varsity coach asking me how many they have left).

I do not try to keep track of timeouts throughout the game and would rather a partner NOT tell me when they are or come back from the table and say "white has 2 fulls and a 30 and blue has 3 fulls." I just smile and kinda think, good for them.

End of the game, yes I will make sure I know if they have 1 or Zero left. That's all I want to need and know.

As for verbalizing signals I really don't say anything other than maybe "body" with the push mechanic on plays to make sure people know where the contact was if up top was clean. I think sometimes I do say, "hit" on the illegal use of hands signal. Probably out of habit but I don't do it nearly as often as I use to.

ETA- The one signal verbalized more often than not by me and those I observe is on Player Control.

Right, "Blue, 24, Illegal" for me. (Sometimes I say "use," sometimes not.)

As for the "reach/over the back," if it's a newer official, I offer advice later when we're off the floor. If it's a vet, I don't bother. It also makes me cringe, but I don't think face-palming is an approved mechanic.

The only value I see in keeping track of timeouts is to help expedite the process if I know a coach is out of one type or the other. When I know that, I don't have to bother asking which one they want.

This just seems overly redundant to me and utterly useless.

I also have always found it silly when anyone says "hit". But a lot of people do it, so maybe I'm the one who has a problem...

If you know a coach only has 30s (or fulls), then you can just grant and report the TO. You won't need to ask a question with an obvious (to the coach) answer. More than one coach has become iritated at that question. Perhaps they shouldn't, but why even give them the chance?

I work with a really good veteran partner that says..."hack"...oh well.:o

I've had several coaches respond with an irritated "That's all I've got left." Ok, great. I don't know that for sure and it's not my responsibility to know that. That's what the table and the 5 clowns you have dressed up on your bench are for.

I get it. The coach's irritation is from the game and the pressure to win...whatever. And then you ask them a question that to them is obvious. But good staffs have an asst tell you what the coach wants or a coach can give u the full or 30 signal or just flippin say what they want. It takes a nano second.

Sometimes it works out that I do know what they have left but it's not a conscious effort.

Uh Oh....somebody here very sensitive to word hack

Kids' game awhile back, I said hammered to coach and table for a few chuckles

That is exactly how I feel. Well said - made me chuckle because it is dead on...

I have a general idea, as a good table may tell me previously where we are. If a coach becomes aggravated because he didn't indicate what kind of TO and I have to ask, I'm really not worried how that effects my rating from him, much like I'm not concerned what he thinks of a call I made. Never had someone gripe yet. I ask respectfully and most coaches indicate prior to having to ask what they want.

That said again, if I know for certain, of course I proceed without asking.

After all, I am fullor30.................can't change to coachuhave2

Yeah, uh, I did that in my first and second year, too.

Bless me, Striped Father, for I have sinned...

...since we are confessing to our "Striped Father"...;)

I use "BOOM" while giving the "T" and during my "player control" signal.

He's Alive ...
 

That's Awesome!:D

Hey fellow officials...leaving to do my 6th BV game in 7 days...probably won't be on the forum till I get back to work after Christmas...

So...

MERRY CHRISTMAS TO ALL...AND TO ALL A GOODNIGHT!

Me, neither. It's just one more (minor but they all add up) game management technique.

That's the one! :eek:

Back to the OP:

Until you know all the coaches and they know you, I'd recommend against sarcasm, facetiousness, and other forms of irony. If they joke with you before the game, you can feel free to joke back, but on the floor it almost never plays well.

If a coach makes a comment that gets a rule wrong, I won't argue with him about it. Learn the useful expression: "That's not the rule, coach."

When you say that, be right about it. :)

He's A Genius ...
 

Just say the number of the rule. "Sorry Coach, that's a misapplication of rule four". Most coaches don't know that there are only ten rules. They'll be amazed that you've memorized every single rule in the entire rulebook by number. The higher the number you quote, the better it sounds.

I had a conversation about this about an hour ago with one of my friends who is a rookie in the NBA this season. He told me that the "rule" has been to answer questions and not comments. He went on to say that isn't necessarily what we have to do because some comments must be addressed.

What brought this up was a game he was at today where one coach was an irritant and the other coach followed suit - the just kept making comments and calling out "ref". He said it was to the point where it was getting on his nerves in the stands. I can imagine he is more in tune with this than the regular fan since officiating is what he does for a living. The point is, the officials on the game didn't address the comments. Another reason he said they should have addressed it is because they were one 50/50 play away from either of the coaches going off. He said when that happens we often wonder why and it could have been prevented by addressing - through conflict resolution skills - the coaches earlier.

I guess, maybe I'll try it.

It almost goes without saying...
 

...that experience plays a big part in this. Sometimes it's just about letting the coach know you've taken in what they've said. If I'm at L or C and I can acknowledge with a nod, I'll do that. If it's a question, if I have the time, I'll answer. Over time you get better able to separate the wheat from the chaff, and you have a better feel for what's, to you, a distraction, what's to be ignored, and what's to definitely be addressed.

In the youth league I work in, two schools' teams will often meet at a third-party gym due to scheduling, and it's not always clear who's "home" and who's "away", although it's usually listed on a schedule that's put out.

Recently, I had a coach screaming about all kinds of violations that the other team was (wasn't) committing. I finally put up the magic hand and said, "Relax coach, you're killing them as it is. I don't want to hear anything more out of you." He's been chirping most of the game, and I've been ignoring him utterly, as has my partner. So he was flabbergasted when I actually turned around and addressed him. The score is 42-14 home at this point. As I'm administering the throw-in, I hear him say to his AC, "Wait, we're home?" The AC responds with, "Yeah, that's why I had them wear white today. What game are you watching?"

The coach sat down and I don't think he said another word to anybody for the rest of the game.

As for me, I discovered how hard it is to concentrate when you're trying not to laugh through your whistle.