Last night I had a game that constituted the last district game of the season as well as the year for two teams (Middle of the District Teams). However, these two teams are only a couple of miles apart and are therefore, huge rivals (typically schedule each other as the last game of district for this reason). Very evenly matched and well played game (In fact it went to overtime on a last second bank 3 pointer and should have gone double OT as the Visiting Team missed a wide open lay-up at the buzzer). Visiting team is making a run and cut the 10 point deficit to 1 with 1:30 to go in the game. Crowd is going wild. Visiting coach calls a timeout and I grant it as appropriate. He then asks me how many he has left. I tell him I will check and he proceeds with his team in the timeout. I check with the official book (who of course is affiliated with the home team) and she tells me that the Home team has 3 fulls and that the Visiting team has 1 full. At the end of the timeout, I tell the visiting coach he has 1 full left (per the home book) and as a courtesy tell the Home coach what he has. We resume play. Visiting team subsequently steals the ball and requests their final timout. Here is the problem. The home book and official scorer miss informed me and they actually had zero timeouts left! Claims she looked at the book wrong.

I'd like to hear the boards thoughts on how they would handle this situation and then I will tell you what we did.....

Book Errors
 

First, I would recommend that you always request that the home and visiting book sit next to each other. When ever you check one book, you can always ask the other book keeper if they agree and get an immediate answer.

Some score keepers do not want to sit next to the home book. If that is the case, make a plea to the coach to ask that they sit at the table with the home book.

Following this mechanic probably would have avoided this problem.

Other than that, I would suggest that if you official scorere is a student, that you actually verify with your own eyes the time-out situation written in the book. It won't delay the game that much longer and will avoid this problem. If the scorer is an adult, than it is more likely that things will be accurate (although, by no means guaranteed!).

As to your question, I'm inclined to want to give them the time-out without penalty, but I don't think you can do that. Do you think that the scorer intentionally mislead you or was it a genuine mistake?

You are required to inform a coach, by rule.

SECTION 11 SCORERS' DUTIES
The scorers shall:
ART. 6 . . . Record the time-out information charged to each team (who and when) and notify a team and its coach, through an official, whenever that team is granted its final allotted charged time-out.

So you have two rules that were violated, the first being the rule that the coach is to be notified. Having not only failed to notify, but actually provided incorrect information, I cannot see how you would assess this as a T.

I think it's the same as a baseball umpire telling you that there are two outs and it ends up only being one out. It's ultimately up to the coaches and the players to know what is going on.

I coach and if this situation happened to me, I wouldn't be getting on the officials, I would be getting on my book person for screwing up the book or if we were the visitiors, for not paying attention. I always have my book sit with the home book on the road, if there isn't any room, then they sit behind them.

TO
 

When I attended the Rules Interp this spring, the exact scenario was discussed as a NCAA team lost in a playoff because of it. The table said they had one TO left and they had none. Long story short, losing team called a TO they didn't have with 11 seconds left in the game, down by one, bang a T...end of story. Unfortunately the officials end up being the bad guys or gals in this case. The recommendation of the NCAA this year is that officials should not advise coaches as to how many TO's they have left. That's what assistants are for. We do it as a courtesy and it can only get you in trouble.That is the message I carried back to our local board along with the suggestion that this year when we introduce ourselves to the coaches, maybe mention the fact that we will not be reminding them of how many TO's they have left. Had no problems at all this year and the coaches don't mind it at all.

Adult scorer, varstiy game. Both books were sitting right next to each other and the other book knew what I was asking and said nothing, I presume because she showed none and the home book was saying- I don't know. I have used the technique of checking both books when I felt it was needed. However, this was my third time at this school this year, same scorer and no problems.

Hawks Coach,

With all due respect (and I have enjoyed your posts in the past- very educated coach on the rules!)I disagree that 2 rules were violated. The rule you quoted states that a coach needs to be notified when he has used his last timeout. Per the book (official) he had not used his last timeout. During his timeout, I was going to check the timeout situation anyway for my knowledge. If it was his last he would have been duly informed. I simply answered his question.

Secondly, I fail to understand how I violated a rule by giving incorrect information. This implies that I knowingly passed on wrong info (lying)! NEVER!!!

NCAA Ref,

Very good points. However, would you answer the coach by telling him to check with his assistant. To me this sounds sort of stand-offish and adversarial (sp?) How would you handle the situation?

Junkie, Hawks Coach's statement does not imply that you were lying. He would not make such an implication. It's more like you gave the ball to White instead of Red on an OOB call. You screwed it up, but didn't do it maliciously or intentionally.

That's a very tough situation, but the fact is that they took all their allotted TOs and you didn't notify them; which, by rule, we're supposed to do. That was the coach's only point.

Chuck

Good point NCAAREF, but in NFHS rules, isn't the official "required" to notify the coach after the last time-out is used? A subtle, but noteworthy difference between NFHS and NCAA, in this situation.

Rule violations and intent
 

Thanks Chuck. I never meant to imply intent. Most rule violations occur with lack of intent, rather than intent. How many layers intentionally travel?

As for the resolution, I still vehemently disagree. You have a book that gave you one answer, now has a different answer, and you gave answer #1 to the coach and never revised it. You now wish to revisit that answer when it causes a T for the coach. Sorry - that just strikes me as completely wrong. what if coach says my book shows us with 1 AND you told me we had 1 left. Now your going to assess a T? I can't buy that.

I'll just throw this out for debate...........

Ref: "Coach, the table made a mistake. You are out of time outs. Do you still want this one?"

Coach: "No"

Ref: "Tweet, White ball on the side, Let's go."

If the other coach objects, say:
"Coach, the Official Scorer told him he had one, I'd do the same thing for you."

Might work if you fine out soon enough.
What do ya think?

Blackhawk

That's exactly how I would handle it Blackhawk. Sometimes you better have sense; common sense.

As a former coach and now a ref I really like what Blackhawk says. Sure there is some benefit because the clock stopped but not much. If I was the home coach in that situation I would agree with Blackhawk as well.

I have used this line before in similar situations, and have found it very successful in calming coaches down. But it can only be used in appropriate situations.

Given the situation, if it ever happens again (God willing it won't), I think I will heed the suggestion of Blackhawk... I like it.

Here is what we did (right, wrong or indifferent)...No "T" was assessed. Since the Home book (official book)informed him through me that he had one time out left, we granted a 30 second TO. I explained this to the home coach and he took it as best as he could, in other words he understood the situation we were in and felt our hands were tied. He heard me tell the coach he had 1 left per the book shortly after I told him of his 3.(Side Note- The home coach has a bit of a reputation for being a "Howler"). He had a few words with his book keeper and we went on to finish what was probably the most competitive game I've had all season(see original post) Given all of this, what we did, resolved the situation and both coaches were happy/lived with it. Maybe this wasn't the right thing to do and hence my reason for posting... to gather other insights.

PS. Hawks Coach... I did not take your comments personnally, like I said your input from the 'other' perspective brings much value to this board. However, I never had the opportunity to advise him he had used his last timeout because I was told he had one left... Just a bad sitch all the way around!

Yours in Hoops,