I waffled on this before posting my initial reply for one reason. I was not sure that the ball had achieved frontcourt status. I decided that, like a game day official, i had to go with one call or the other.

Is that the reason for this being the interpretation of the rule? Would it matter if the ball had started in a clear frontcourt position, as opposed to at halfcourt? I was not clear about the ball in frontcourt part of the rule, as I believe that it is mainly applied to a dribbler (both feet and ball before frontcourt), from previous posts I have seen on this subject.

OK newbies - try this one. A1 in backcourt. A1 attempts pass to A2 who is in frontcourt but the pass hits an official in the frontcourt and bounces back to A1 who touches it in the backcourt. What's the call, if anything?

BTW - I've only seen this happen once in 21 years of officiating, but of course, it will happen in your next game http://www.refereeforum.com/ubb/smile.gif

Just got back to the site and saw your post PaulK. Correct answer. No violation for this exception.

Jack

Mark,

The correct call would be....over and back. Just like when a ball hits an official out of bounds, the ball is out of bounds, hitting the official in the frontcourt causes the ball to become frontcourt status. When touched by A1 in the backcourt it is a violation.

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Mr. Kelly Spann

While I would agree that the ball achieved frontcourt status upon hitting the official, there is no team control, so I would say no violation.

Do you not need all three points to establish front court position? (ball and both feet) The ball hitting the official definitely causes it to have front court status but what about the other two points? In FIBA international rules it is definitely a back court violation but NCAA I would say no.

Oh Mark, you're a sneaky one! Rule 9, NFHS, Section 9, Note, "If a player of the team in control in its backcourt causes the ball to go from backcourt to frontcourt and return to the backcourt still in team control without touching a player in the frontcourt, it is a violation for such player or teammate to be first to touch it there." Don't you love how they write these things! Therefore, VIOLATION!

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Geneva">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Hawks Coach:
While I would agree that the ball achieved frontcourt status upon hitting the official, there is no team control, so I would say no violation.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Team control begins simultaneously with player control and continues until a shot is released, the other team secures control, or the ball becomes dead (violation, foul, timeout). Therefore, when A1 releases the ball on a pass, team control is still present (player control is not).

My bad - I misread this as another inbound situation with A1 inbounding from backcourt, which is why I said no team control. With A1 possessing the ball inbounds already, team control exists, should be a violation.

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Geneva">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Mark Padgett:

BTW - I've only seen this happen once in 21 years of officiating, but of course, it will happen in your next game http://www.refereeforum.com/ubb/smile.gif<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Mark
Just curious - was the call made when you saw it?

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Geneva">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Shawn LeBleu:
Do you not need all three points to establish front court position? (ball and both feet) The ball hitting the official definitely causes it to have front court status but what about the other two points?
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

"three points" only applies to a dribbler. Once a ball is caught and/or passed, this requirement is irrelevant.

Now here's the next variation.

On the inbound, player A2 jumps from the front court, catches the ball in the air, and lands with the first foot in the front court, and the second foot in the back court.

Do you have a violation?

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Geneva">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Richard Ogg:
Now here's the next variation.

On the inbound, player A2 jumps from the front court, catches the ball in the air, and lands with the first foot in the front court, and the second foot in the back court.

Do you have a violation?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Is this a quiz that you want rookies to answer, or are you really asking this?

If it's the former, all rookies stop reading now. If it's the latter, scroll down


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Not a violation. The exception doens't mention anything about which foot lands first. THere's a specific case on this.

No. Both feet and the ball must be in the frontcourt in order to be "Frontcourt". Right? (I'm a newbie) *grin*.

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Geneva">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by doghead:
No. Both feet and the ball must be in the frontcourt in order to be "Frontcourt". Right? (I'm a newbie) *grin*.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

No. As I stated earlier, this only applies to a dribbler.

There is a specific exception for a throwin where it allows a player to land with one or both feet in the backcourt. To qualify, the landing must be <em>normal</em>. It is possible that you could have a violation of the landing is not <em>normal</em> and the first foot down is in the frontcourt and the second down is in the back. It would be a judgement as to whether it would be a violation or not. I would determine it based on whether the player has established a stable and controlled position on that first foot and the second foot's contact is in a seperate action and delayed from the first.