NFHS - Two Hand Reporting
 

What is the decision behind using only 1 hand for foul reporting in NFHS? Have they ever explained their stance?

Using one hand forces you to slow down, signal each number individually. That's important when you may have a 14 y/o kid keeping score. It's worked in high school AND college for years.

Also, if it's really loud in the gym, it helps the scorer know that the foul in on number 14 and not number 5.

I don't know a scorer who would read four fingers on the left hand and one finger on the right hand as the number five. This ain't addition.

The reason, IMO, why it's not explicitly allowed in NFHS is since the talent of officials encompasses all levels of officials, they keep it simple for everyone. There would be too many officials who mix up how to properly report with two hands. Also, the same thing with scorers who would somehow mix this up.

The two-handed system doesn't distinguish between 52 and 7, par example.

It's expected that the score keeper at an NBA is a professional with ample basketball knowledge and is able to discern whom the foul was called upon.

Except 7 is not even a legal number under NF, so that's an afterthought.

My point was that even in the NBA and their professional scorekeepers, two-handed reporting has it's difficulties. That these issues wouldn't exist in Fed wasn't my point. (Other issues would exist as noted.)

I used to work a basketball tournament with modified pro rules and one year, a team had both #55 and #99 on their roster. For each one, the official would flash both hands and fingers so fast I had no idea who they were calling the foul on. If it was noisy, that just added to the challenge of figuring out which player got the foul. :D

At the risk of a hijack, are officials supposed to have their hands in front of the body when indicating the number or off to the side? When some officials indicate numbers with their hands in front of the body, the fingers sometimes blend in with the stripes. :(

But We'll Travel Along, Singin' A Song ...
 

IAABO mechanics went to the side two years ago. I can't comment on NFHS mechanics, but I'm sure that someone who knows will be along to comment soon.

Off to the side, head level I believe.

I don't have my Official's Manual with me, but we were taught to report in front about chest level.

make sure you pulse the hand foward and back, then show the back of the hand for the 2nd digit.:eek: NOT!:)
And don't forget to keep moving while reporting.

Any issues that could come up from two-hand reporting are counterbalanced by a similar issue with one-hand reporting...neither one communicates better or worse than the other. The problem with communicating to the table usually resides with us - not whether we use one or two hands to report numbers, but whether we take the time to make eye contact, speak loudly and clearly as we state and show the number, etc., etc...

I worked with a gal in spring league about a month ago who would have had to hold her hands waaaaay out in front to do this. ;)

Not everything is done out of that manual. This is one of those cases for most people.

Peace

...and whether the scorer is paying attention.

I'd like to see it
 

I wish the NFHS would experiment with two hand reporting just for the heck of it. IMO two hands look stronger.

When done properly. You also have officials looking like Frankenstein walking towards the table with 2 arms stiffly outstretched in front of them. :eek:

This I agree with...two hands looks stronger when reporting, but there are too many officials who would screw it up...especially since there's such a wide degree of officials with differing levels of compentency. I think 95 percent of the people that post here could handle it with no problem, but NF has to make mechanics for everybody.

Mixed Signals ???
 

Over the back?

http://ts2.mm.bing.net/images/thumbn...0c0cf2b0d84b04

"Looks stronger"? Why? Because we see it on TV? I just disagree. It's different, but it doesn't look any better at all. One-handed reporting can be just as crisp and strong as two-handed. It's just different.

Comedy!

Not only does it look stronger IMO, it feels stronger when I do it.
One single snap of the offenders # with 2 hands accompanied by a strong voice & body language communicates the "as-a-matter-of-fact" factor.

Snapping twice with the same hand in the same manner as above could communicate that one is slow or not very sure.
Plus the visual delivery never quite syncs up with verbal delivery! Reminds me of the old karate flicks (if you know what I mean) :D

Honestly, I believe the table crew could mess up 1 hand reporting easier than 2 handed.
It would be very easy to put a foul on #2 when reporting with 1 hand, "White twenty-four" but 2 handed it would be very clear, well, except if the official can read it themselves :eek: that would be "Fourty-two" to the table :D

I do agree with your take on us seeing it on TV! Because when I see the ones that walk & talk snap with 2 it looks waaaaay better than those than run, stop & snap with 1, twice.

Too bad the percentage of 2-hand reporting officials who do it this way is very low based on my personal observations.

I'm a one-handed reporting official and my top 2 compliments when camping are my voice and my presense. Never once has anyone suggest to me that I'd looked stronger going with 2 hands.

When doing one handed reporting we are supposed to vocalize the number that is on our hand "Five, two" rather than "Fifty-two."

How many actually do that?

Always been taught opposite...to actually say the number. Too easy for a scorer to hear only one of the numbers. A lot harder to mistake fifty-two rather than five-two.

Do you have manual reference for this?

+1

Peace

Watching some summer V bball on Tuesday. Host gym coaches were reffing, which was pretty funny. He signaled all foul numbers with both hands.

Shooting foul on #11, he signals the # with both pointer fingers, of course the kids all think it's one and one. So they all play the miss. Not a huge deal, but one that should be easily avoided right?

Value of voice!

Not me. I do the opposite. Just as APG described.
I have had this discussion with fellow officials. And I recall, all that is mentioned in the book is to 'Report the Number'. It does not say report each seperate digit.

Official Zombie ...
 

So is she:

http://ts2.mm.bing.net/images/thumbn...3ccb12d272b9a5

Seriously?

Are you freaking kidding me Billy?

Actually, Cold, Not Cool ...
 

Hey. Zombies are cool. Look at the ratings for Walking Dead last season. Kids today really dig zombies.

You know what would also be cool? If instead you didn't post stupid images like you try to do in every thread, and actually stick to the subject at hand.

Sticky Subject ...
 

For what it's worth, in my little corner of Connecticut, one hand reporting, vocalizing the numeral(s), i.e. "Four. Two.", not "Forty-two". Some will flip their hand over for the second numeral, most don't.

omg smh!!!!

If I had my way, I'd cut off the hand of anyone doing two handed reporting. Its totally unnecessary (at least for HS and College and less than 5 as a digit -- and since there are plenty of numbers, that is sufficient) and potentially confusing.

Please: why does everything have to move to mimic what professional leagues are doing? Adopting good ideas and ones that benefit the game are fine, but a wholesale changeover for the hell of it (half circle in the lane is one of the better, more stupid idea, examples)?

we as a officials need to COMMUNICATE clearly obviously you have to use judgement say in a jv game. young scorekeeper, you may want to ask him or her what is best for them upper level games IMO two-hand works best be efficient be calm but keep the game moving

Every clinician/supervisor/assigner I've ever met has said say the number, not the digits.

I have to guess, but it seems this is your final sentence, and I would say it's not always true. Do what works in your area, and do what the powers want.

I wont say which district im in but lets just say most of our officials are behind a little bit they believe all change is bad. In my case im not looking to officiate in this area too much longer im looking at bigger and better things (jr college and up) so I dont care what my Dist director says im going to do it most efficiently.;)

Then you don't plan on making much money prior to moving up to JuCo and beyond. ;)

And I would be hesitant to quickly jump on them and assume they don't know what they're doing. Unless you're moving out of the area, I would also assume the high school leadership has at least some significant say (due to overlap and all that) in who gets picked for college ball.

And a JuCo supervisor is likely to reach out to the HS supervisor/commissioner for some feedback on a prospect.

Yep.

"Who? Oh yeah, I remember him now. 2nd year guy who likes to try and use college/NBA mechanics."

Can you explain to me how two-hand reporting keeps the game moving better than one-hand reporting? Are you suggesting that one-hand reporting takes significantly longer than two-hand reporting? (And by "significantly", I mean more than a tenth of a second.) Perhaps you find that one-hand reporting causes so much confusion that you have to re-report the number significantly more often (more than once per season) than when using two hands?

I know you haven't been here long, so I apologize if I am seriously mis-reading your comments. But your statement above sounds so arrogant to me, I'm honestly taken aback. If you take a game, then do that game. Don't prep for some better assignment that you're angling for.

(BTW -- I see the "winkie" after your post, but I can't tell what that's supposed to mean.)

There's nothing wrong with having goals. Almost everyone would like do games at the "next level", whatever that level is. But when you work a game, use the rules and mechanics for that level of game. Using incorrect signals or mechanics (or areas of coverage) can be confusing to your partner or table personnel.

Do the game you're assigned to do. Work on the other stuff at a college camp.

ontheway
Location: SC

Not sure if thats South Carolina or SoCal. If its the latter, then he wont have to worry about HS too long :D

scrapper my intent wasnt to be arrogant. im deffinetly not it wasnt my intention to sound that way. I get what your saying with how i should call one game at a time how im directed too. its great advice and i appreciate it!

Georgia went to two-hand reporting a couple of years ago and it has gone very well. I love it. We have been fairly progressive at incorporating many of the women's NCAA mechanics, and I think they have helped in may ways.

I'll be moving to Georgia then!

I'm also in Georgia and love our two hand mechanics along with the rest of the women's college mechanics. Makes you think a little more though when you have JUCO and High School games in the same week.