This seems to be happening a lot this year on free throws:

Me: (stepping into lane) "Two shots guys"
Player on low post (as I'm backing out): "Hey ref, how many shots?"

Huh?

Let me guess - these are all public schools?

I see the same thing. Kids not only are not paying attention, but are clueless about so many things. A shooting foul on the first possesion of the game. Isn't everybody supposed to know that it's 2 shots? Beginning of the game. Which goal is ours? Where did you warm up? Duh... Start of 2nd quarter: Hey ref, whose ball is it? This one is the one that really kills me. See that little arrow on the table over there......

Ok, now that hurt...even better yet is I step into lane and say "Bonus"...player on low block saya "Hey ref, is that the same as one-and-one"...I thought I was gonna puke on his shoes!

On the next one, just look at him and say O-N-E.

The one that kills me is after a team calls a timeout. They always come out of the timeout and ask "who's ball"? Well, son, there's a new rule in town, a timeout is a turnover it's their ball.

I tell them to ask a teammate how many free throws.

Just this fall in a girls varsity game the coach requested a timeout while his player was holding the ball right in front of us. When the timeout was over the same coach asked me who was getting the throw-in and where.

A few possibilities, Dan.......

1. Kids tend not to pay attention (probably the likely reason),

2. If it's happening alot, as you say, and if it's always a player in the lowest lane space, perhaps you're getting too close to the FT line when stepping into the key to administer, or........

3. Your fellow officials have conspired with several players to make you think you're crazy.

Aha! Just as I suspected!

It's Chuck's fault!

Good advice I've received over the years:

* Players often "hear" only the last word of your statement. I've since had more success just stating "TWO" or "be ready...ONE and ONE!"

* Even though the rule has changed to allow subs only on the last FT, I still tell subs that replace players in the first two FT positions "one shot, okay?"...then state "ONE!" to everyone else. Good preventative mechanic.

Regarding Timeouts:

I actually had a HS player beleive me when I told him "The first team out of a time out gets the ball". Subsequently, he helped get his team out without delay, much to the delight and surpise of my partner!

We played great defense yesterday, earned a 5 second count, and as our players were lining up for the throw-in, B called time out. We set-up for a sideline inbounds against their press. When we returned, the ref gave the ball to B explaining that they couldn't have called timeout if they didn't have the ball. When we reminded him of the five second count, he changed his story and said the five second count happened after the request for TO. Never mind that we all saw B's coach get up to make the request after the 5 second call and and we saw the ref grant it while he was standing OOB awaiting to administer the throwin a good 5-10 seconds after his initial call.

Suffice to say, anybody can lose concentration and screw up (although I didn't like this guy covering his screw up by creating an alternate reality).

I knew it!!!!

Tangent (sorry, it's rather long)
 

In my profession (software engineer with emphasis on human-computer interaction) I have had cause to study some about the limits of human mental ability. I did not do the research on this, I only have read what others have written about it. Still, I find it rather fascinating.

Our conscious and our subconscious are both plugging away, all the time. While the subconscious can handle many tasks at once (e.g., walking and chewing gum :)), our conscious can only handle one stream of thought at a time.

So, while a player is lining up along the lane and desparately trying to remember what his coach said about free throw situations, he is not even capable of also consciously paying attention to the ref. He has got to focus on one or the other.

The player is taking it all in, of course, but subconsciously. We don't yet understand how information goes back and forth across the boundary from concsious to subconscious, but it's an imperfect process. Perhaps especially so when it happens in a moment of panic, like when a player suddenly realizes that he doesn't know how many shots.

It's entirely plausable that he can pull the last thing he heard from the ref across the boundary, but lose all the rest. That being the case, I think pizanno's advice is right on the money--make sure that last word is the important one.

The "usability guy" in me wants to get on the soapbox about it being rather unfair to characterize players as "not paying attention," as if they are somehow misbehaving. They're doing just what the coach wants them to do--think! It's the limitation of the conscious mind that allows only one stream of thought. But I'll resist the urge. ;)

BTW, it's that same "limitation" that allows us to focus on the game and not notice all that is going on around us off of the floor.

Re: Tangent (sorry, it's rather long)
 

To be honest, the look on these poor guy's faces is what I imagine I look like when I say "Yes dear....what was that again?" Good point.

And I thought I was the only one who did that :D

PS. I'm still trying to figure out how to work this gizmo. How do I get the really nice looking quotes with the bold text and the italicized citation (i.e., Originally posted by...)?

That is too funny!

Yikes!!

What happens when his team is the first to break the huddle, but the other team gets the ball?? :eek:

These kids should've asked
 

Freshman boys. Partner calls foul on black team. White is in the bonus. I go to Lead to administer. As partner is walking to Trail position, he clearly says to me "1&1!" In the lane, I clearly say, "Line up men, 1&1." There is some shuffling along the lane, so I repeat "1&1, men" as I toss the ball to the white team's shooter. Naturally he clanks it off the side of the rim. I guess the players heard me say 2 shots, because no one moves, & ball is bouncing toward sideline. Black team member in lowest lane position, thinking he's being helpful, grabs ball and starts walking toward me. I did my best to not see him travel, while his parents in the stands are yelling at him to dribble. Unfortunately, I did see him throw it to me where I was standing out of bounds.

Re: These kids should've asked
 

Had a similar situation--but ball was bouncing in the lane while everyone looked at it. Finally one kid figured it out and grabbed it.

Re: Re: These kids should've asked
 

I had that happen in a Jr. High game.
The Coach apologized after the game and said, "I'm sorry, but my team hasn't been in the bonus all year."

Let's call those fouls in Jr.High, too. ;)

click the tab labelled "quote" under the post you want to....uhmmmm....quote.

This kills me too, b/c what the heck was the coach just talking about for the last 60 seconds?!?!

Chuck

I'm in the middle of the Carribean, enjoying the sun, miles from the nearest basketball, and I'm <font size = +4 color = red>still</font> taking abuse from you guys!!

At least I know where to stand as Lead during my FTs!

Now. . . As Eric Cartman might (or might not say), screw you guys. I'm going to the breakfast buffet.

Chuck

I'm in the middle of the Carribean, enjoying the sun, miles from the nearest basketball, and I'm <font size = +4 color = red>still</font> taking abuse from you guys!!

[/B][/QUOTE]Well,I miss ya!:D

And you obviously know where to go in January. The thermometer on my deck is hovering just above zero right now.

Quote:

Now. . . As Eric Cartman might (or might not say), screw you guys. I'm going to the breakfast buffet. Chuck

No....more....bacon......

..
 

In defense of the kids, you have to remember that some of these kids really dont know what the hell is going on regardless if they are on the bench or in uniform starting for a team. Many players are just beginners. Some kids have coaches who dont tell them the rules. Sometimes its pretty loud in the gym and possibly he/she didnt hear the ref signal 2 shots physically and verbally. What I found is that most of the kids are just too damn nervous on the court and really get caught up in what they are supposed to immediately after the free throw/s instead of focus on the exact situation at hand.

Believe it or not, some kids just ask just so they can talk to the ref. It sounds stupid but I used to do this as a player(i guess some of you guys are mad at me). I would ask or just repeat what the ref said in a questioning way so that he can respond to me, 1 on 1. I dont know exactly why I did this but when the ref would make eye contact with me and tell me the situation, it gave me a feeling that I knew that me and the ref were on the same page. This made me at ease for some weird reason.

Either way, the refs are the professionals and have to give some kids a little break. What may be crystal clear to some players may be completely misunderstood by others.

Refs are supposed to be on point with all situations on the court. Sometiems they are not. Same goes with the kids.

has anyone ever considered this "question" from the players as an "innocent" attmept to disconcert?

There are a couple of schools in my area that do this before every free throw attmepted by the opposition, usually from the player(s) closest to the shooter.

Just another thought.

Well that's a LOT easier than building it by hand. Thanks.

Re: ..
 

Well, yeah, maybe, but I'm talking about kids who shave. And drive.

Quote:

Believe it or not, some kids just ask just so they can talk to the ref. It sounds stupid but I used to do this as a player(i guess some of you guys are mad at me). I would ask or just repeat what the ref said in a questioning way so that he can respond to me, 1 on 1. I dont know exactly why I did this but when the ref would make eye contact with me and tell me the situation, it gave me a feeling that I knew that me and the ref were on the same page. This made me at ease for some weird reason.

Bingo! This is exactly what I think is going on most of the time.

Re: ..
 

Good point. Next time I will just smile and say yes that's right...or something like it. Thanks for your post.

I guess. Unfortunately, I obviously had to make myself "unavailable" to work games for a week, which I didn't like to do. Giving up probably $500-$700 in game fees. But my whole family was going. Priorities, priorities. . .

Quote:

No....more....bacon......

Jeez, I can't even think about eating bacon. . . I've gotta be 20 pounds heavier than I was a week ago.

Chuck

whoa...that's a LOT of 5th grade girls rec games! :)

Quote:

Jeez, I can't even think about eating bacon. . . I've gotta be 20 pounds heavier than I was a week ago. Chuck

have fun!

[Edited by Dan_ref on Jan 17th, 2003 at 07:09 AM]