I can't seem to find it in black and white. What is the throw-in spot for a flagrant personal foul and for a flagrant technical foul? Had an area meeting last night and we are talking about swinging elbows and they kept saying you could call it an "intentional technical" or a "flagrant technical". I pointed out to them that since the ball was live and we had contact it was not a technical and they told me I was crazy. You gotta love these guys, supposedly the cream of the crop, don't think they have picked up a rulebook since Reagan was President.

devdog69...am I reading you right?
Are you saying you can't have a technical during a live ball?
Because if you are, I gotta tell ya, you can have a technical during a live ball.

Dude

Personal - Nearest spot
Technical - Division line

The term flagrant doesn't change much except for the number of available players.

Flagrant and intentional are just labels applied to the two basic types of fouls - personal and technical. Any personal foul has a throw-in spot at the OOB spot closest to the foul. Any technical foul is inbounded at the halfcourt line, opposite the table.

Methinks the intentional/flagrant technical comes from swinging the arms as part of a fight. Whether or not a punch or kick "connects," it is still punishable as a fight, hence the technical foul penalty.

What did I say Rook? We had a live ball AND we had contact, there is no technical foul that involves live ball contact, other than fighting.

I appreciate your responses Mick and Mark, and I totally agree with what you are saying. But, and there is always a but, these guys aren't going to listen to me unless I show them in black and white, i.e., a rule. I need to find it in the book where a flagrant personal foul would be inbounded from the nearest spot.

Rule 7-5-8&11 for technical and flagrant personal fouls.

R7-5-5
R7-5-8

...And yes 7-5-11. (Thanks JR)

[Edited by mick on Jan 7th, 2003 at 09:04 AM]

Ahhhh.. 7-5-11 Bingo, thanks, guys, I knew I could count on you.

...ahhhhh, and what did I say dog? :D

You CAN have a technical foul during a live ball...you said it yourself after your original post...FIGHTING.

Dude

Ok, here's another one: This one from the guy I probably most respect in our area, good friend of mine, though I think he's wrong here.

He says that if A1 is holding the ball and B1 slaps the ball out of A1's hands to the floor, picks it up with both hands, then dribbles away, that this is a double dribble violation and that he has been calling it that way and was more or less telling us that we were missing this when it happens.

Your friend is saying the "slap" or stealing of the ball is the beginning of a dribble.
I'm with you...I disagree.

Dude

Don't forget - any other noncontact situation applies here, too - i.e., unsportsmanlike conduct.

Mark, you are absolutely correct!
I believe devdog69 was talking about contact situations though.

Dude

Yes, of course, all the unsporting non-contact stuff can happen during a live ball or dead ball. And you got me Rook, I forgot to give the fighting exception during my first post. My main point is these guys that see someone throw a flagrant elbow and they think it's a technical foul. I would be willing to bet that had we been asked what the call was on this last night that 9 out of 10 of the most respected officials in my area would have said "flagrant technical foul". Of course, it doesn't help when the guy in charge of the meeting keeps saying it too, ughh, just zip it and get me out of here.