"I see it, coach, but I'm not going to blow dead a fast break"

"Not even for blood? For Pete's sake, what if it gets on the other players?!!"

"Well, she doesn't have to stand right there in the middle of the key, she could wait over here by the sideline"

"You're going to punish us becuase she's bleeding?"

"No, but I'm also not going to punish your opponent!.... okay, they missed the shot, and you've got the ball, now, let's get her out."

"Oh, so you'll blow dead OUR fast break?"

"Coach that's the rule, as you well know"

(Thinking quietly, "Sheez, Louise, this guy puts the howl into the howler monkey!")

Handled well
 

Your diplomacy was admirable.

I would end this dialogue with "Coach, as you know, you have 30 seconds to replace her, starting NOW!"

This shifts his focus to where it should be coaching.

Blood on the back of a shirt.
 

During rebounding action I noticed red on the small of the back of H50.
Team H got the ball.
[*Tweet*] "Lemmee look at your shirt"
"You have to change your shirt."
Coach H, "Well it's not his blood!"
"Yes, Coach; we will look for the bleeder."
V42 comes over with dripping forearm from a long scratch.

Mick,
Remember the player does not have to change the shirt just because it has blood on it. The rule says an "excessive" amount of blood. If you don't think it is a big deal, don't make it one.
You do still need to find the player who is bleeding though and take care of him.

Nevada,I think that mick had all the bases covered.His quotes:
1)"Lemmee look at your shirt.You have to change your shirt".
2)"V42 comes over with a dripping forearm from a long scratch".
He checked the shirt and made HIS decision on it:then he found the bleeding player-V42.I can't think of anything else that he shoulda done in this sitch.

Perhaps, direct V42 to leave the game! ;) I assume he did this, but the post just stopped.
And I was emphasizing that there is a difference between merely having some blood on your shirt and having an "excessive amount" of blood on it. Most officials mistakenly believe that if a player has ANY blood on the uniform they MUST change. That is not true.

[Edited by Nevadaref on Dec 31st, 2002 at 05:08 AM]

To me,any blood on a shirt is an "excessive amount".I think that the intent of the rule was to not spread blood around among the players.It doesn't take much blood to accomplish that,in my mind.

Well, that is your decision and in your game you are certainly entitled to call it that way.
I, however, believe that there is a threshold involved. The official must use his judgment to what that is, but I do not have a zero tolerance policy.
What would you rule on a shirt that got blood on it on Friday, but due to travel the team was unable to wash it, and now on Saturday it has a dried blood splatter on it.
Are you going to say blood is blood and the shirt must go? Or do you think that it isn't likely to be spread to another player and is permissible?

Nevadref,
This was a pretty easy call for me.
I was looking at three bloodspots, an 8" long smear, a 4" smear and a 2" smear.
And both players were out for less than 20 seconds of game time. The bleeder was 6'8" 240 and one of his teammates was slightly concerned when he asked me, "How long does he have to be out?" This teammate breathed a sigh of relief when I told him that the big guy could come in at the next whistle. :cool:
mick

Had a player at varsity HS tourney this past weekend who got a bloody nose. There was 3 large spots of blood on the players shirt. As I was directing the player out I asked head coach if he had an extra jersey (IMO all teams should carry an extra for this sitch) coach did not but had a spray to put on the blood that cleaned it up and neutralized it. He did this and I allowed him to return to the game a couple of whistles later. Other coach asks me if this is legal. (the bloodied player was the other teams stud) I told him that the blood spots were neutralized and dried so they no longer represented a threat. Thoughts on this???

MN3,
Never heard of that.
So, you are familiar with the spray?
What is the product called ?
mick

Mick:

When the incident happened I looked at the spray bottle quickly and I can't remember the name of the product. The trainer took it out of a medical kit. I do remember that it turned the bllod areas a light brown and the spots became very faint. I have e-mailed the school to find out some more info about the product, but I am sure it will be a while since schools are on break until after the new-year. When I find out I will let you know.

I think that you covered the intent and purpose of the rule perfectly.

Liability maybe?
 

We talk so much about liability, this is possibly a liability issue. If a player in one of your games gets a disease (does not have to be HIV or AIDS) I do not think you want to have allowed blood to stay on a uniform or on a players body without removing that individual. It might not even have been caused by anything in a game, but people will sue for just about anything. I personally have it removed and tell them to use that stuff that removes it and disinfects the blood. I would rather be cautious and safe than careless.

Peace

I am now curious as to why you told the other coach that everything was okay, if you weren't quite familiar with the product?
I guess I would have had to say something like, "Well, their trainer assured me...." (...Some kind of disclaimer.) ;)

I don't want to start another tongue stud or held ball thread, but I always thought the jersey needed to be "saturated" with blood.

I do make players leave for excessive amount of blood and I'm all for ruling on the side of safety, but how do they get past a rule like this in the NFL? A player like Jon Ritchie of the Raiders has blood coming out of his forehead and no one ever says a word about the possible ramifications of letting him play.

MJ

MJ,
For one thing the NFL doesn't use NFHS rules.
For another thing, I was wondering the same thing. ;)
mick

I understand that they don't use the same rules, but wouldn't you think a rule like this would be a bit more universal for all sports?

MJ

I figgered the blood sports had very regular testing.

I am an athletic manager for a high school in IL and we use the spray. What we use is called formula 10 and it imedietly dissolves and disinfects any blood on the jersey or the player him/her self. Allowing our coaches to get the players back in quicker.

That would be difficult.
 

You cannot make rules that are universal. High School Students are not Professionals and Professionals are not College Students. All have a different perspective or concerns related to their particular levels. Especially when one is a job the other are extra-curricular activities.

Peace

It just depends on what the league has decided, MJ. The NBA requires players to leave the game immediately and requires trainers to wear rubber gloves when administering aid to a bleeding player. Obviously, the NFL is not as concerned with it.

For me, any amount is definately excessive (if I can see it without a microscope, there's enough there to infect someone). Not to mention, any amount of blood on the player's body merits their removal from the game (per rule).

Also, if between Friday and Saturday a team can't find a different shirt, they have bigger problems than the blood rule.

BTW, this is why I don't like the NCAA rule, which allows the teams' own trainers to decide whether or not the jersey is "saturated" with blood.

[Edited by Mark Dexter on Dec 31st, 2002 at 08:38 PM]

Do you have any more info on this stuff? Maybe a website? The chemist in me is interested in finding out how [well] it works. :)

I'll talk to our AD on the 6th and see if i can get some info for you because im wondering that myself

Formula 10
 

Interesting.
Thanks!
mick

Blood?
 

I had an amusing one the other night. This was a girls varsity game. I called a foul for B pushing A1 during a rebound. We have a bonus freethrow sit. A1 made the first free throw and the timer buzzed me over to the scorer's bench saying that "She has blood on her uniform!!" I said "Who?" "Number 12!!" So I start towards the lane as the A coach is yelling "She sat in the kids nachos!!" I walked over to A 12 and motioned for her to turn around and sure enough she had a tennis ball sized spot of what could only be nacho cheese sauce (with chili). I told the bench " It's not blood" and pointed to my partner to play on. Oh and #12 turned about 12 shades of red.

In my bloodborne pathogen training, I was taught that any blood could have high probability of transfer and that after a person cleans up the blood on floor of school, it is then double bagged and tossed in trash.
I would have person change jersey.

As a school principal, have advised my staff to always err on side of caution and to have extra jerseys and shorts in both home and away to resolve this issue.

Agree with the post on liability as well. Better safe than sorry.
CH