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-   -   Varsity blowouts, concentration, and timing (https://forum.officiating.com/basketball/6704-varsity-blowouts-concentration-timing.html)

Rich Mon Dec 23, 2002 01:05pm

As I said before, I'm back working basketball after a time off the court.

After working a handful of JV games, I worked three varsity games last week. The first two were eaaaaaasy -- blowout games, few fouls. I really felt on top of my game.

Then Friday, I had a slightly different experience. The game was still a blowout (46-14 at halftime), but I didn't have as smooth a game as I did the previous week. I thought I'd share some of my less-than-perfect moments just to spur some discussion and maybe get some pointers from some of the vets on the board.

(1) I had a player drive baseline and cream a defender who was in position. I headed to the table and immediately realized I had made the rookie mistake of leaving the scene without a number. I had the number of the player who got fouled, like that was of any use on a player-control foul. I talked to my partner, and he gave me the number of the defender. I went to the table, and all they cared about was whether the basket counted. I still don't know who the foul was on, but it apparently got auto-recorded by the scorer. Well, thanks, THIS TIME.

My conclusion: I was too darned fast most of the night after calling fouls. On this particular instance I was more worried about coming out and selling the call hard than I was about getting the details right.

Of course, I wonder if I missed the call entirely. In retrospect, I failed to referee the defense properly and perhaps missed the possibility that the defender slid into position after the driving player took off. I don't think so, but there's enough doubt in my mind to make me realize that I didn't do my job. I always work deep, but I wonder if I could've had a better view if I had worked even deeper on this drive.

(2) Later in the same half, I almost went to the wrong end of the court to shoot in a bonus situation. There was a rebounding foul, the classic "over-the-back" foul that 90% of the time takes the ball in the other direction. Except this time the offensive player had position and the defender fouled.

My conclusion: Once again, TIMING. Call the foul at the spot and get bearings BEFORE heading to the table.

(3) Towards the end of the game, I had a play on the baseline that seemed innocent enough. I'm lead -- player from visiting team (losing by 30+ points) chases down ball with his toes on the baseline. I whistle the violation, and he immediately pulls his toes inbounds. Visiting captain starts barking at me. I remained calmed and explained what had happened, and then he barked again at me (essentially accusing me of making up the call). I whacked him. The player kept saying I had to listen to him because he was a captain. I headed to the table. The coach left him in the game, but said nothing to me or him about the technical.

With less than a minute left, there was a scramble at midcourt with bodies diving all over the place. Nothing worth calling, and the ball finally went OOB. One of the visiting players walked by and said, "You ever PLAY basketball, man?" I DIDN'T call a technical, taking the time and situation into account. Although the technical wouldn't have helped end the game, I don't like the message I sent by letting that go.

--------------------
My wife attended the game and she noted that the only thing said around her about the officiating was that it seemed we communicated well together and worked well together. Being the veteran spectator, she wondered where I had placed my head, though.

Can anyone give me some advice on how to slow myself down on the court? I think my positioning, for the most part is sound, my mechanics are pretty crisp, and my judgment is pretty good. I just think my timimg is off and perhaps I'm not quite as polished as I was back when I worked varsity schedules in other states.

And remember when you read this, I'm probably not as bad as I sound. I tend to come off as extremely self-critical, but to me that's the only way to get better at this. Although some partners just think I'm neurotic....

Rich

rainmaker Mon Dec 23, 2002 01:47pm

Rich --

It's very noble and generous of you to serve yourself up on a platter for us up-n-commers to taste. I can't offer suggestions, because these issues are all the things I'm working on, too. But it is helpful to know that others are in the same situation and struggling with the same "issues". I'm guessing someone else is clear through this stage and will give some helpful advice, which I get the benefit of, without embarrassing myself. So, thanks!!

Rich Mon Dec 23, 2002 01:56pm

I don't mind....
 
....serving myself up.

The day I think I'm too good to make mistakes is the day I hang up the shoes. Besides, I am really interested in hearing some of the veterans talk about timing. I'm primarily a baseball umpire, where timing is stressed over all else. In basketball, I never thought about timing in the same way, but am starting to realize how important our timing is to the flow of a game and how important it is for us to have good timing in order to manage a game.

To be honest, keeping focus during huge blowouts is something I have always had to work hard at. And this game was a blowout five minutes in.

Rich

mikesears Mon Dec 23, 2002 02:23pm

Re: I don't mind....
 
Quote:

Originally posted by Rich Fronheiser
....serving myself up.

The day I think I'm too good to make mistakes is the day I hang up the shoes. Besides, I am really interested in hearing some of the veterans talk about timing. I'm primarily a baseball umpire, where timing is stressed over all else. In basketball, I never thought about timing in the same way, but am starting to realize how important our timing is to the flow of a game and how important it is for us to have good timing in order to manage a game.

To be honest, keeping focus during huge blowouts is something I have always had to work hard at. And this game was a blowout five minutes in.

Rich

While I don't work basketball anyomore and I never obtained "veteren" status, one thing that always helped me with getting a number was (after blowing the whistle and going up with the fist), say the number of the player who commited the foul. "#45, red . . ." Bird-dogging also assisted me in remembering to get a jersey number. If I was pointing at them, I'd realize it was either a name or a jersey number. Much easier to remember the number :)

Good luck. Hope to come back to basketball later in my career, too.


LarryS Mon Dec 23, 2002 02:46pm

Rich,
I know that feeling. Most of the time I let my partner know when I feel I am out of kilter and ask him to let me know at each break if he noticed something I am doing wrong. I have found that simply asking for the feedback from an "on floor evaluator" causes me to focus more.

Unfortunately last Friday both my partner and I were off. We both arrived at the game 20 minutes before tip (and I left work 2 1/2 hours before game time for a drive should have taken an hour...sometimes I hate traffic). We change as fast as we can and hit the floor. The JV game was first and we talked every chance. He admitted first that he felt like everything he was seeing, doing and thinking was on fast-forward. When I owned up to the same, we just talked about what we were doing on the floor. The varisty game felt a lot better.

We bumped into the visiting varsity coach while being escorted to our cars after the game and he complimented us both. Said we had a good first game but were really on top of things in the second. My partner started laughing and told him how we both felt like the first game was OK at best. Kinda makes you wonder about the officials he has had this year.

BigJoe Mon Dec 23, 2002 03:35pm

Rich,

The best advice I can give to help slow down after the foul call is to work on your preliminary signals before you go to the table. If it is a "normal" call, one that doesn't require it to be sold, I step towards the play and verbalize right there what I will be reporting to the table in a few seconds. For instance, A1 with the ball, is hacked by B1 attempting a steal. I blow the whistle at the same time arm goes up with closed fist. I birddog towards the offending player, probably get withing 5-10 feet of the player depending on how far away I was at the time of the foul but definitely step into the play. While stepping towards the play I will say out loud what I have. #23 blue with a reach and will make the proper Fed signal. I will then verbalize what will happen as a result. Whites ball and point to the spot or White #12 will shoot 1 and 1 or double bonus whatever the case may be. This takes a total of five seconds and everyone in the gym knows what you have before you go to the table. It is really important that your partner knows what you have so he can be positioning himself and the players to continue the game when you come back. I am over 40 and I can forget the number from the spot of the foul to the reporting area. By doing this small thing you will reinforce your call in your mind before going to the table. Nothing looks worse than an official sorting through the players while in the reporting area looking for a number and who it is on. When you need to really sell a call you will do the same thing after you have made the block charge signal, etc. I hope this helps you out a little. I was taught that when I started 10 years ago and it has served me well. I teach that to all my new officials as well.

Keep 'em straight up!

A Pennsylvania Coach Mon Dec 23, 2002 03:45pm

Quote:

Originally posted by BigJoe
#23 blue with a reach
What is a reach? :o

RecRef Mon Dec 23, 2002 03:53pm

Unless your association is really hard-up for refs someone has seen something in you to put you into varsity ball so soon after you got back....

The PC on the baseline drive - Don’t beat yourself with this. Remember that there is no time and distance when defending the dribbler. Was the D moving toward the dribbler when contact was made? Had he had legal guarding position before he moved? Was the distance between D and the baseline 3ft or less? These are the things that count in your call.

Toes on the baseline – Here the no call crowd would let it go. By letting it go one sets up other refs for trouble. By letting it go you are cheating in favor of the team that violated. IMO, you need to be quick in your turnaround of the ball. Tweet, point and call the color, spot, hand the ball to the inbounder and start your count.

“Did you ever play basketball man?” - At this point I don’t know what I would do. Maybe just say yes and let it go at that.

Remember the number – What can I say but take your time. We all make mistakes.

RecRef Mon Dec 23, 2002 03:55pm

Quote:

Originally posted by BigJoe
Rich,

#23 blue with a reach and will make the proper Fed signal.

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO! !!!!!!!

Jurassic Referee Mon Dec 23, 2002 03:59pm

Quote:

Originally posted by A Pennsylvania Coach
Quote:

Originally posted by BigJoe
#23 blue with a reach
What is a reach? :o

Whoa,sharp little dude,aren't ya?

I can hear you now- "Reaching is only a foul when you got contact along with it,ref.How can you call #23 for just reaching?". Sputter,Sputter..:D

BigJoe Mon Dec 23, 2002 04:08pm

Here it comes!!!!!! I guess I won't be able to find a reaching foul in the rule book just as I won't be able to find the explaination that I would give to the player like you stuck out your leg when he went by or you belly bumped him etc. At least the proper signals are used when reporting to the table. Have seen some officials report the foul and point to his hip or stick out a knee. I don't think you would get your point across to the player if you told him he used his hands illegally!!! If a person is going to get attacked when making a post that will not help this forum. We are here to exchange ideas and improve. If someone dissects everything you say a person may say why in the he77 would I want to get put down for anything I have to say? These type of comments will also prevent new people from posting legitimate questions on this board for fear of being put down. No one wants to be made to look like an idiot.

BigJoe Mon Dec 23, 2002 04:11pm

Oh by the way a reach is illegal use of the hands by a defender going for the ball from a bad defensive position!!!! Rule 4-19 Art. 20

Tim C Mon Dec 23, 2002 04:18pm

RecRef
 
I believe that Rich works in an area of the country where you, as an offical, sell your own skills and develop your OWN schedule of games.

There are several areas in the US where there is not an "association" or an "assigning commissioner" . . . you get your own games.

HOWEVER, Rich is a VERY successful offical in other sports and I am sure that he is being his own worst clinic in this thread.

Mark Padgett Mon Dec 23, 2002 05:01pm

Quote:

Originally posted by Rich Fronheiser
One of the visiting players walked by and said, "You ever PLAY basketball, man?"
The Davism for this is "Yes, unlike the members of your team - as indicated by the score."

Jurassic Referee Mon Dec 23, 2002 05:05pm

Quote:

Originally posted by BigJoe
Here it comes!!!!!! I guess I won't be able to find a reaching foul in the rule book just as I won't be able to find the explaination that I would give to the player like you stuck out your leg when he went by or you belly bumped him etc. At least the proper signals are used when reporting to the table. Have seen some officials report the foul and point to his hip or stick out a knee. I don't think you would get your point across to the player if you told him he used his hands illegally!!! If a person is going to get attacked when making a post that will not help this forum. We are here to exchange ideas and improve. If someone dissects everything you say a person may say why in the he77 would I want to get put down for anything I have to say? These type of comments will also prevent new people from posting legitimate questions on this board for fear of being put down. No one wants to be made to look like an idiot.
Wow,you are one touchy l'il feller.aren't ya?:D

There is one heckuva difference between trying to make someone look like an idiot,and someone trying to make a legitimate point.

The point is,as Pennsylvania Coach is aware of because he's read it many times,is that "a reach" is completely the wrong terminology to use to identify a foul."Reaching" is not a foul.Making illegal contact while "reaching" is a foul."Reaching" is not in the rule book,and there is no official signal for it.If you are being evaluated at a lot of camps,state play-downs.etc.,you would certainly be quickly marked down for using a term like that.Evaluators generally want us to stick with the approved terms and signals.Believe me,they can be quite anal like that.

There's some pretty sharp people on this forum,Joe.That includes coaches,too.Did you ever think that you might be able to learn from them,too? JMHO!

Jurassic Referee Mon Dec 23, 2002 05:07pm

Quote:

Originally posted by BigJoe
Oh by the way a reach is illegal use of the hands by a defender going for the ball from a bad defensive position!!!! Rule 4-19 Art. 20
????

Can't seem to find the word "reach".

Can't seem to find R4-19 Art.20.

Rich Mon Dec 23, 2002 05:21pm

Re: RecRef
 
Quote:

Originally posted by Tim C
I believe that Rich works in an area of the country where you, as an offical, sell your own skills and develop your OWN schedule of games.

There are several areas in the US where there is not an "association" or an "assigning commissioner" . . . you get your own games.

HOWEVER, Rich is a VERY successful offical in other sports and I am sure that he is being his own worst clinic in this thread.

Thanks, Tee, for your confidence :)

I've worked varsity schedules in three states where games were assigned out of an association and you had to earn a position on a varsity staff. Where I'm at now, I have to hustle my own games via athletic directors and conference commissioners (athletic directors assign all nonconference home games and conference commissioners assign all conference games).

It is a fair question: Did I seek out and accept varsity assignments too quickly? The honest truth is that I don't think so -- Tee is right that I am a harsh critic of myself and that might not paint me in the best light on an Internet discussion board. I'm OK with that, unless there are athletic directors and conference commissioners lurking that will hold such brutal honesty against me :)

The subvarsity officials I've worked with here, to be quite honest, are, well...... I partially attribute this to a weak association system here -- an official does not have to belong to an official's association since the association has no games to assign anyway. Other places I've lived, training was given through associations, assignments were made through associations, and varsity promotion and assignments were made through associations that were formed by and for the state office.

Most JV and frosh games here are covered by someone who plunks down $16 to get a state license and then receives not an iota of officiating training -- they get the assignments cause they are available at the right time and most of the time live in the town where the game is located.

The really good officials -- the ones I want to work with -- all work varsity ball, or are scratching the surface of working varsity ball.

I posted the original situation because I thought some of the veterans would be able to give me some reminders on how to slow myself down and turn this into a learning experience for some lesser experienced officials. But I did call basketball for a dozen years before my injury-induced "vacation" (I broke a foot working baseball) so I don't think that lack of experience is the problem. Maybe lack of recent experience, but I'm not sure I'd get any of that working down a couple of levels. Without challenges.......

Rich

[Edited by Rich Fronheiser on Dec 23rd, 2002 at 06:46 PM]

BigJoe Mon Dec 23, 2002 09:43pm

JR,

I learn from this forum everytime I log on. That is the reason I participate. I enjoy kidding around as much as the next guy. My point is that some people don't know when you are kidding and when you are putting someone down. I respect the opinions expressed here by all officials and coaches.
I was joking when quoting a rule reference for "reaching". It is no more a foul than "over the back" is. I sometimes use the term because that's what the kids understand, right or wrong.

Jurassic Referee Mon Dec 23, 2002 10:32pm

Quote:

Originally posted by BigJoe
My point is that some people don't know when you are kidding and when you are putting someone down.
Definitely gotta start using more smilies!

Valid observation and point,BigJoe. How about doing it this way? If you think that I'm putting you down,please assume that I am kidding.If you see something like http://users.telenet.be/eforum/emoti...rt/sport29.gif ,you'll know I'm serious.

We do a fair amount of kidding on here,interspersed with some great arguments.We do have fun.:D


rainmaker Tue Dec 24, 2002 11:10am

Quote:

Originally posted by Jurassic Referee
Quote:

Originally posted by BigJoe
My point is that some people don't know when you are kidding and when you are putting someone down.
Definitely gotta start using more smilies!

Valid observation and point,BigJoe. How about doing it this way? If you think that I'm putting you down,please assume that I am kidding.If you see something like http://users.telenet.be/eforum/emoti...rt/sport29.gif ,you'll know I'm serious.

We do a fair amount of kidding on here,interspersed with some great arguments.We do have fun.:D

Face it, JR, he out-humored your own very dry humor. Great call, BigJoe! You get the Post of the Week Award!

Jurassic Referee Tue Dec 24, 2002 11:48am

Quote:

Originally posted by rainmaker
[/B]
Face it, JR, he out-humored your own very dry humor. Great call, BigJoe! You get the Post of the Week Award! [/B][/QUOTE]Is grovelling optional?

ScottParks Tue Dec 24, 2002 01:38pm

Quote:

Originally posted by Jurassic Referee
Quote:

Originally posted by rainmaker
Face it, JR, he out-humored your own very dry humor. Great call, BigJoe! You get the Post of the Week Award! [/B]
Is grovelling optional? [/B][/QUOTE]I thought it was mandatoryhttp://www.bullittzero.com/Vbb/image...es/bowdown.gif

Andy Thu Jan 02, 2003 05:02pm

Quote:

Originally posted by BigJoe
Rich,

The best advice I can give to help slow down after the foul call is to work on your preliminary signals before you go to the table. If it is a "normal" call, one that doesn't require it to be sold, I step towards the play and verbalize right there what I will be reporting to the table in a few seconds. For instance, A1 with the ball, is hacked by B1 attempting a steal. I blow the whistle at the same time arm goes up with closed fist. I birddog towards the offending player, probably get withing 5-10 feet of the player depending on how far away I was at the time of the foul but definitely step into the play. While stepping towards the play I will say out loud what I have. #23 blue with a reach and will make the proper Fed signal. I will then verbalize what will happen as a result. Whites ball and point to the spot or White #12 will shoot 1 and 1 or double bonus whatever the case may be. This takes a total of five seconds and everyone in the gym knows what you have before you go to the table. It is really important that your partner knows what you have so he can be positioning himself and the players to continue the game when you come back. I am over 40 and I can forget the number from the spot of the foul to the reporting area. By doing this small thing you will reinforce your call in your mind before going to the table. Nothing looks worse than an official sorting through the players while in the reporting area looking for a number and who it is on. When you need to really sell a call you will do the same thing after you have made the block charge signal, etc. I hope this helps you out a little. I was taught that when I started 10 years ago and it has served me well. I teach that to all my new officials as well.

Keep 'em straight up!

I'll echo BigJoe here. Going through the preliminary at the spot of the foul accomplishes two things:

- Slows you down and solidifies the information in your mind
- Communicates to your partner(s) what you have and how to prepare for the next action (free throws, inbound, etc.)

I try not to say the shooters number to my partner because that will invariably be the number I report instead of the player that committed the foul. Part of my pregame is asking my partner(s) to help me pick up shooters on foul calls.

Using the preliminary mechanics should help slow you down and get the timing more consistent.

DownTownTonyBrown Thu Jan 02, 2003 07:32pm

Mechanics, Rich
 
I'm gonna hang with BigJoe on this one. We all develop our own style. Personally, "reach" or "over-the-back" aren't in my vocabulary but they are terms the players understand (even if big dog clinicians can't understand them). No funky signals are allowed and the proper words should be used in front of the table/coach. Suggest striving to use the proper words all of the time -players can figure them out too!

But what I do want to agree with Joe on, and Andy and Mikesears etc., is the mechanics of reporting a foul. And these mechanics (just like in baseball, Rich) definitely establish your focus until it becomes automatic. If you follow the mechanics as outlined in the Official's Manual, Sections 230 & 231, you will find a definite pattern of Hustle, Stop, Hustle, Stop, Hustle, Stop.
[list=1][*]Hustle to be in the proper location to make the call. Blow your whistle and raise your hand to make the call.
[*]Stop and verbally inform the player (Stating Shirt color and then Number) of his infraction. Having not moved yet, now communicate with your partner what will happen next.
[*]Hustle around the players (never through them) to the reporting area.
[*]Stop and make eye contact with the bookkeeper and make your report to the table.
[*]Hustle back to the appropriate spot for the ensuing action.
[*]Stop and signal your partner that you are ready to proceed.[/list=1]

For me this regimen sets the pace and keeps me focused where I need to be focused. As you well know, once your whistle is blown, all playing action stops and nothing is going to begin again until your are ready. DON'T HURRY. Let your pace come to you. Relaxing will likely let your natural pace return.

As for the dork that asked if you had ever played ball, I'm with Mark, "Yes I have. Have you?" [smile]


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