The response to a shot clock comment in another thread made me interested in learning which states not only use a shot clock, but also 3-man crews for HS games.
Would you please list your state and whether you use shot clocks (please note how many seconds and if it is for boys or girls or both) and three officials or only two. Also, if your state switches to three officials for playoffs please say so.
Thanks.

For example:
 

Nevada has no shot clocks and uses 3-man for both boys and girls 4A games (largest school classification) and 2-man for all others during the regular season, then uses 3-man for all levels in post-season play.

We have different rules in different counties. In Nassau and Suffolk counties (Long Island, NY) we use a 35 second shot clock in high school. We also use two whistles in a game, but there is a move afoot to use three man mechanics in some playoff games. This could open the door in the future to the use of three man in all games at the high school varsity level.

MA: shot clock, 2-whistle for all games, including playoffs

Indiana

No shot clock.
3-man is not required, but some larger schools use 3-man for varsity contests.
3-man will be used for tourney games in the spring. (Maybe not for the 1st round, but at least for the more advanced rounds.)

Washington State: 2 officials for all games.

Shot clock in girls basketball only (30 seconds).

Z

Maryland:

Almost all Public Schools throughout the state use 2-man. The DC Catholic league which includes MD schools uses all 3-man. The playoffs in Maryland are 2-Man the first two rounds, but then for the regional semi-finals, regional finals, state semi's, and state finals it's 3-man. No shot clock in boys basketball anywhere in MD.

However, the girls in Maryland play with a 30 sec shot clock.

Minnesota has two man officials for all H.S. games. No shot clock. There is movement afoot for three man mechanics to be taught in case we go that way in the near future. There are some conferences in Minneapolis that use three man, but all playoff games are two man.

Much Like Big Joe
 

Wisconsin has two whistles for all H.S. games. No shot clock. Also experimenting with three whistle crews in some conferences in Milwaukee area (so I have been told), but all playoff games are two whistle.

With the school budgets as they are, I do not foresee any swift switch to 3-whistle games

[Edited by williebfree on Dec 13th, 2002 at 08:49 AM]

In MO, no shot clock, 2-man crews, except for certain playoff games that have 3-man. Schools refuse to pay for the 3rd ref.

Since Ref in PA is a little slow :)

In Pennsylvania we have:

no shot clock (they might in the Philly Public League or Catholic League, I don't know, but those leagues aren't part of the statewide association, the PIAA)

two officials regular season

three officials post-season

Also, we start with the seat belt rule. If you are standing, it is assumed you are requesting a timeout.

Klancie,

Where in MO are you? I ref in Mid-Missouri(Jefferson City area) and majority of our games are 2-man but tourney championship games and larger school games have been using 3-man for a couple of years at least. And as far as I know all playoff games are done 2-man. Even the final four in Columbia.

In South Carolina we use 3 man on all varsity games and attempt to use 3 man on JV's if enough officials are available for the JV's...no shot clock.

I NC, 3 man is required for all varsity games. We use it for as many JV games as possible as well.

What's a shot clock? :)

In Louisiana no shot clock, and most regular season games use 2 man. Although a coach can request a 3 man crew (strictly a budgetary move). 3 man playoffs.

Maine: No shot clock. Mostly two-man during regular season. All tournament games are three-man assignments.

Illinois:

No shot clocks. All the large school varsity games I have seen this season have 3 man crews. Don't know what the norm is throughout the state.

Also, no 10 second count in backcourt for girls HS.
Why, I have no idea. The shot clock is 30 secs.
We also have 5 full time outs (no 30 second time outs).
We also use the optional coaching box, until the coach is mandated to sit because of a direct or indirect T foul.

Alaska:

No shot clock
Most of Alaska is lucky enough to get two refs per game.
Some areas around Anchorage use three man.

Post season 2 man

AK ref SE

Texas.
No shot clock.
3 man in certain areas and limited use. I know Houston uses three man for everything. Here in East Texas, we use it for some tournaments and whenever coaches ask for it. Final 4 will use 3 man.

Colorado.
No Shot clock
3 man approved for experimental use. Playoffs are two man.

Ohio
 

Ohio... mostly three whistles for boys varsity, mostly two whistles for girls varsity (although some large school leagues are using three whistles for the first time this year).

No shot clock.

Not to stir up a hornets nest:
Perhaps my mind has not quite molded to the entire offiicating mindset, but why the change in officials at Tourney time?
THinking as a former player and coach, this would be a difficult adjustment. I don't think there would be much argument to say that there is a difference between a game called by a three man crew and a game called by a two man crew. If my team and style are dictated all year by what happens in two man crew, why is it a good thing to be forced to adapt in the tournament to a different style of game? There is no question using a 3-man crew is better, but it would be better ALL year not just the tournament.

Yes it is an ajustment on coaches. But many places are still in transition from 2 man to three man officiating systems. Why the differentce. 1) not enough officials to call three man all the time in district play. 2) more officials get to call a tournemant game if they are done three man. In my area of Texas. You will not be forced to have three officials until you get to the state final four. The coaches get to choose two man or three man for the playoff games before that time.

If I remember some of the reasoning about why they have stayed 2-man mechanics in the state tournament in Missouri is one the amount of extra money that is required and also the coaches would prefer the more experienced 2-man crew to a little bit less experienced 3-man crew. They basically don't want younger less experienced officals calling state tournament games.

Oregon: No shot clock. 2-man for everything.

Down state
 

Downstate areas have been doing 3 Man in Boy's games for almost as long as the state required it for all playoff games. I know the Chicago area was far behind the rest of the state in implementing 3 Person in games. I even have one game this year in a Class AA Conference that is 2 Man. But I was doing games in Western Illinois area with 3 Officials for about 5 years.

Peace

Probably because that is the same as college.

Pennsylvania Coach,

Why do you suppose the coaches are seatbelted in your state throughout the game? Did they try the coaching box and it didn't work or did the mighty officials union in your state get the box taken away before you got it?
Also, could you tell us from a coaches perspective, what difference it is going from two whistles during the whole season and then having three man crews in the playoffs? Our state probably won't go to three man in the playoffs unless they have three man throughout the season.

I used to live in PA, and I believe they've never instituted a box.

Personally, I don't care how big the coach's box is. Frankly, a 28-foot box would be fine by me. A frustrated coach can get a lot out of his system if he can walk a bit. And my standards for acceptable behavior don't change much regardless of where a coach is.

I worked a varsity girls' game Friday night where I called a technical on a visiting team head coach (the home team snapped a 40-game losing streak, BTW, and the game wasn't close). He was sitting on the bench the entire time, even though he could've been using the coach's box. Great tantrum, though. Not a peep after the T, either.

Having worked in state with a box and states with a seatbelt rule, I don't think the coaches behave any differently just because they can stand and work from within a box. At least with a coaching box I don't have to worry about whether a coach is kneeling in front of his bench (which was a pet peeve of my supervisor in a seatbelt state I worked in).

Rich

WEST TEXAS
 

Well here in the western part of Texas, (we are so big I guess we can divide into two, eh Tim?) We use 3 person crews for all 5A, 4A, and some 3A districts if the schools in the distric vote it in during the fall meeting of all the coaches for that district. We have given the schools a financial break of $10/official to help convince their superiors to take on the expense of another official, PLUS we have given coaches clinics showing how much better a 3 person game can be officiated. We don't use the shot clock, although I wish we did, and part of that is because of the expense of the shot clock itself on the schools. Some of the newer schools that have been built already have a shot clock installed so I hope that we can get it in the next few years. It sure would help prevent the boooring stalling that can occur now. That is why I enjoy my college games sometimes more than my HS.

Re: WEST TEXAS
 

Actually, to be technical, Texas is five states. The annexation papers making us a part of the union has given us the right to divide into five states. Midland is definitely a different state but you do produce the same dark stuff out of the ground that we have here.

I know that at one point, Texas was its own republic, and some claim that it still has the legal right to secede from the United States at any time. But what are the five states that make (or made) up the republic?

Chuck

I have no idea why the rule is that way. This is my 7th year in coaching, and it's always been that way. I don't remember coaches in high school standing, but I don't know if the rule was in place then.

It'd be difficult at some of the schools to stand and not be on the court. Probably one-third of the schools in our league have the bleachers that pull out from the wall and when fully extended, are three feet or so from the sideline.

My first year as an assistant coach, we qualified for the playoffs. In our first 21 games, we averaged 14 fouls per game, with a low of 8 and a high of 22. In our playoff game (the three-man game), we had 34. We were convinced at the time that each ref calls as much as they usually do, but since there are three of them, well, there are 50% more calls. However, since then, I've not noticed anything like this in a playoff game. It's gotta be tricky for the officials, however.

Probably because that is the same as college. [/QUOTE]


Well....I think it's dumb that they don't count the 10 sec backcourt in women's college (as well as HS). Basketball is basketball, boys/girls, mens/womens.

Iowa: No shot clock, two whistle tournaments. I think some conferences are experimenting with three man crews but not in my area. We also have a seperate girls state association which has variations to the fed rules. ie: nobody below the block on free throws and a coin toss determines possesion to start the game. There are others but these are the biggies.

California:

Two man crews in our association but three man in playoffs
30 second clock for boys
35 second clock for girls
6 foot coaches box
new grey shirts at our option

Stan
 

Does Iowa still have 6 players on the court (3 FC "offensive" & 3 BC "defenders") in the girls game?

Re: Stan
 

No, we got rid of that a long time ago but not sure when. We had 6 players in 1975 when I was in high school. Actually those were very good games. There was more passing because only two dribbles were allowed, but to many people wanted the girls to play like boys.

Stan
 

While in college (1981), I dated a girl from Iowa that had played the 6-girl game. I found it quite intriguing.

Thanks for the update!

I like the gray shirts. Wish we were using them here.

GEORGIA

3-person crews for most varsity. It is up to the schools/regions.

Sub-Varsity is 2-person.

All State Tournament Games are 3-person.

No shot clocks, nor do I foresee that happening here. Some of the S Ga areas are fairly poor, so it would be tough to force them to buy that sort of equipt.
After all, this is the South, where HS Football is KING.

ND - Class A boys - 35 seconds - 3 officials
- Class A girls - 30 seconds - 2 or 3 officials
- Class B boys - no clock - 2 officials
- Class B girsl - no clock - 2 officials

TN
HS Varsity - 3 person crew
No shot clock.

JV, Freshman & Middle School used 2 person crew.
Girls have 10 sec. back court rule. However I've worked girls 13/under summer tourneys that used NCAA rules.

I LOVE THIS THREAD!!!

Way cool, to see all the variations, and the different ways of handling things. No wonder sometimes we don't agree about block/charge, how to handle coaches, advantage/disadvantage and so forth. We have all come up in different cultures, under different rules, with different role models. I LOVE diversity!

AZ - no shot clock

2 officials for all HS games. Some of the invitational holiday tournaments will use three man.

Some conferences (5A, 4A, on down) will use 3 man for state semi-final and final games for both boys and girls. 3 man is at the discretion of each individual conference for their semi and final games.

Out here in the mountainous, unpopulated solitude of Idaho we:

have no shot clock

work almost all games as 2-man (Sometimes do 3-man JV at the little schools, where the school is anxious to have officials. Rather than having the two varsity refs split the JV game with the single JV official, they do 3-man. The JV gets paid for his game and the Varsity guys get their pay plus a half JV game - same pay as if they had split the JV game.)

I believe there is some experimentation with 3-man at some of the larger school districts this year - not in District VI, Idaho Falls.

In Cal. 30 sec. clock for girls and 35 sec. for boys and two man except certain big var. and most playoffs are three.

Northern VA area:

3-whistle crew for all varsity games, district/region/state tourneys

2-whistle crew for sub-varsity

30 second clock for private school girls games

Well....I think it's dumb that they don't count the 10 sec backcourt in women's college (as well as HS). Basketball is basketball, boys/girls, mens/womens. [/QUOTE]

The rationale is as follows: the backcourt violation and the 10 second count were put in to prevent stalling. These rules made it more difficult to play keep-away as they forced the game into a smaller area. With the addition of the shot clock, many people have advocated the position that since a team cannot hold the ball these rules are not necessary. It seems that this position was behind the dropping of the 10 second count. Also, it seems that this modification is mostly on the girls side as they have a shorter shot clock in most places for HS and certainly in the NCAA.

Oklahoma rules
 

In Oklahoma we have no shot clock and use 2 man crew for JV and HS. I know in classes A, B, 2A, 3A and 4A we use a 2 man crew for the state playoffs. In 5A & 6A I don't know what they use. Most of the bigger schools that are 5A & 6A are around Tulsa and I haven't seen their playoffs.

Misspoke
 

Cameron Rust mis-stated Oregon officiating:

In "Cameron's Area" all games are two man. He works in Beaverton, Hillsboro and the Greater Portland Area.

The Valley League (as just one example) which covers Salem, Corvallis, Lebanon area (AAAA Large schools) use 3 man for varsity boys at all times.

We have 28 states so far, Maybe ce can do research for the Missing states.
These are the states that we have had comments on:

AK, ID, TX, OH, OR, CA, IA, GA, ND, TN, AZ, VA, OK, IL, MA, IN, WA, MD, MN, WI, MO, PA, SC, NC, LA.....
Forgive me if I used the wrong Abbr. for your state!

AK ref SE

I can't answer with complete authority, as I've been away at college for 2 years, but when I went back last Christmas nothing had changed (and I doubt any other changes yet) in the state of Connecticut.

No shot clock for either boys or girls. Crews during the regular season can be 2/3 man (I don't think the state says anything on this) - mostly 2 man around me with the occasional 3 man crew for "big" games. Tournament is 2 man for the first few rounds then 3 man for (I believe) quarters, semis, and finals.

AK
 

I thought you would have posted these according to the different categories...:D

Williebfree-

I will do that for you when we get all fifty states!

AK ref SE