Tennessee fires Bruce Pearl
 

Bruce Pearl fired as Tennessee Vols men's basketball coach - ESPN

Good, but way too late. Why stick with him all season?

Should have taken care of business when they learned that he lied.

Rhetorical Question?
 

Because they thought he could win and make the university some money......

To take advantage of the massive playing talent of his son obviously.....:rolleyes:

Bruce Pearl was the best coach Tennessee had since Ray Mears. Now they'll hire someone like Buzz Peterson (oh, wait, they already did) and the program will slip into obscurity once again. The next hire will be closer to Lane Kiffin than Ray Mears.

Do I think that Pearl made a humongous mistake? Yes. Should they have fired him? Well, I think the answer is no. Others clearly think differently. We'll see where the program heads now.

Why is there no comment of LaPhonso Ellis or U of I fans in Champaign?:eek:

Sorry Bruce
 

My wife is an Illini fan and there were more than a couple satisfied smiles in my house last night watching ESPN. I think I heard "Karma, baby" about 5 times.

Gee, no grudges there... Somebody remind me to stay on her good side. :)

No comments necessary...we're just sitting back and enjoying the view. ;)

And, somewhere, Deon Thomas is smiling a little as well.

I'm not up on my Bruce Pearl history. What am I missing?

What I know:

• Pearl coached at UW-Milwaukee
• Ellis played at Notre Dame
• Deon Thomas played at Illinois

Wow. Deja vu, man.

I didn't cut and paste from Facebook, either. :D

Deon Thomas. How could I forget about him. Imagine THAT team with Ellis!!

As an Illinois alum, I couldn't be happier. Jimmy Collins and Deon Thomas are smiling today.

Here's a good summary of the Pearl/Illinois events:
Bruce Pearl: Get ready, rat, because the Illini are comin’ - jotsheet

Bruce Pearl, when working as an assistant coach for Iowa under Tom Davis, recorded a phone call with Deonn Thomas (while recruiting him) that implicated Illinois. I believe the Illini faced some sanctions, but it's been 20 years (talk about holding on to your grudges), so the memories from my teenage years are fading.

Before he became the coach at UW-Mil., Bruce Pearl was an asst. coach at Iowa under Dr. Tom Davis. Back in the day, both IA and IL were recruiting Deon Thomas. Supposedly he had a taped conversation of a phone call w/Deon where Deon supposedly admitted that IL had offered him cash and a Chevy Blazer to attend IL. Pearl and IA then turned in the info to the NCAA; they investigated, found no direct proof of any wrongdoing, but sanctioned IL anyway due to "lack of institutional control". Digger Phelps and ND were involved in the investigation somehow because ND and IL were also involved in the recruitment of Ellis at that time.

The main reason Pearl is hated around here is because the whole investigation was started under shady circumstances - it was a supposedly illegal wiretapped phone conversation, initiated by Pearl, that started the investigation, but that particular item was never publically addressed. Add to it the NCAA never found any direct wrongdoing, but the lead investigator at the time, and the NCAA, decided to punish IL for general violations after a year or two. Btw, the lead investigator was Mike Slive, who is now the commisioner of the SEC.

LMAO, now that's funny.

Fixed THAT part for ya. No charge.:D

Fwiw John Calipari was appalled that that Pearl would do something underhanded like that. He said that it taints the accomplishments of the rest of the SEC coaches who would never dream of acting like that and that he deserved to be fired.

Or maybe not......



What's the difference between Pearl and every other coach in the SEC? He got caught. :)

You know, I actually thought about going back and changing it myself after I posted it. Thanks! :D

I am on a site of HS and Illini fans and they never seem to let it go. But then again that is what Illini fans do, worry about things that have no relevance to them. They are still holding onto why Self left their program 8 years ago.

Peace

Maybe they can blame Pearl for that, too?

That is almost true.
 

They damn near blame him for that. Because when Jimmy Collins was not hired or his reputation was sullied, then they believe it set the program back years and the Chicago Public Schools would not send players to that program. So they do not come out and make that direct connection most of the time, but there are people that believe they are connected and one of the reasons Self did not want to stay.

Peace

I'm not sure I follow you - how does not liking a scumbag who directly affected the program for several years afterward "have no relevence"?

This one I don't understand as well. Not your comment, but the feeling that Self was some sort of "traitor". Not all IL fans actually hold that opinion, btw. He had ties to KS, and for him it was move up, along with being closer geographically to his family, I believe. Also, he didn't exactly go pursuing the job; the only reason it was open was because Matt Dougherty was fired at North Carolina, which opened up the job for Roy Williams to leave KS. I personally met him once when his son played Little League on a different team from my son - he was engaging and seemed like a class individual. He didn't do anything that I'm aware to screw the program or the school, other than leave for what he considered a better job. In the meantime, there might be some fans who thought they had found a long-term, top-level coach, and he didn't stay as intended.

So, what were the actual violations that set your program back so far? Regardless of the reason the investigation started, it seems y'all were caught with something.

Did he really affect the program that seriously? What Pearl happens in programs all over the country all the time, we just do not hear about the details to know. Heck the SEC has this happen almost every time a school gets on probation. Not sure why it has that much relevance when Illini is not a much better place to attend. Lou Henson could not recruit the state very well, that is the reason Illini has not been a great program. I think the "Pearl incident" was one thing in a long list of events that have hurt the program.


Of course not all fans feel that way, just stating that anytime these issues come up there is a very vocal contingency that is holding on to these things that have very little to do with the health or success of the program. I think Self brought the Illini program into a better light and gets more attention based on what he did when he was there. I do feel that when Collins was not hired by Illini when Henson left, the CPS schools did kind of "boycott" the school or tried to send their kids elsewhere, but that was more about Illini and their insecurity of the issue than what Pearl did or did not do while at Iowa.

Peace

This is exactly my point. They were not clean and what Pearl might have reported was not the worst thing or unusual in any way from a competing program. Recruiting is sleazy in major college basketball, this was just something that got out and Coach Pearl was directly involved. But if you talk to many Illini fans, they just will not let it go. They have relished in this situation with Pearl as if the situation is directly involved with the Illini situation.

Peace

The actual violation was "lack of institutional control". Iow, they did not find any specific major violations, such as the ones originally implied on the recruitments of Thomas and Ellis. The article mentioned above, while perhaps written a little over-the-top, was accurate from the other reporting I'd seen at the time. The tapes of phone conversations that Pearl provided had problems, from both a technical and a legal standpoint. The principal person involved with the Ellis recruitment admitted he lied. After many weeks and months involved in the NCAA investigation, you will not find any mention in the final report of the events that started it. The feeling was they found some minor infractions that could be found almost anywhere and not penalized, but since they spent all this time on it, they had to come up with "something". There's also the feeling that since IL didn't automatically go along with the NCAA attorney (Mike Slive) and actually fought the initial charges, that the purposely-vague charge was retribution of sorts for going against the NCAA.

Maybe. But Pearl is the one that initiated the investigation that caused the probation, the suspension of Collins and some of the rest of the staff, and all the associated problems, without any apparent concrete basis. So he gets to be the scapegoat.

That is really my point. Does it matter that Pearl's actions started the investigation, but he did not alone penalize the program. Blame the NCAA for their woes, not an opposing coach that is basically going for the same players.

Peace

Exactly. This is the reason there's so much animosity about Pearl and the situation - it happens everywhere, but only penalized here. (True, "only" is not correct, but it certainly felt that way at that time.) Sleaze started the process, and apparently none of that sleaze was penalized. If IL did something wrong, they deserved to be penalized just like everyone else. Not different from everyone else.

I don't think it's an issue of feeling it directly involes Illinois, but rather a feeling that perhaps a little bit of karma has finally come back to run over the person that started the process.

Looking at this from a neutral standpoint because I don't care about Pearl or his history or the Illini, look at what you said.

To me it sounds like you are saying, yes everybody is doing it and that's not why we're mad, we're mad because we got caught and it's Pearl's fault.

So Illini fans are blaming him for something that would never had happened if they hadn't cheated in the first place? Sounds like passing the buck rather than owning up to it.

Just my $.02 and I'm putting on my fire proof suit as we speak...

Trust me, there's plenty of feelings about the NCAA and the process. But again, I point out the method that Pearl used - taping a phone converstaion without the other person's knowledge, then using an apparently doctored version of it to start problems for a rival school. At best, it's borderline illegal.

As to his claims that he was simply trying "right the wrongs" of a rival school, and he is simply a "whistle-blower", maybe he doesn't lie about things like that. Oh, wait...

I don't think that's the feeling in general. (At least not in my case.) If IL did something wrong, they should be penalized. But everyone should be penalized. I'm not talking about other schools and minor infractions - that's like complaining to the officer who pulls you over for speeding that everyone else is doing it too. I'm talking about the informant that uses an illegal wiretap to call the police about an on-going major crime, then the police break in without a warrant and find the crime isn't happening, but while they're there, they find some marijuana cigarettes in the ashtray. How far would that case get in the court system? Cool, possession is wrong and should be punished. But so should the informant that used the illegal wiretap, and so should the cops who busted in without probable cause. That's the difference in the feeling around here.

+1

But I'm a Hawkeye fan and found the entire scenario amusing.

OK, but if you are clean then you do not have to worry about it. This was not a court of law; this was something that lead to an investigation with the NCAA. Sorry, but I am not seeing what the outrage is if they did not get caught. If anyone you need to be mad at it is not Pearl, but the NCAA.

As you know I am a big Michigan fan and I do not get upset at anyone for what happened with the Fab 5. And it appears that what Michigan and even Webber was accused of was not as cut and dry as many wanted to make it. That feeling of anger or disappointment is more about the NCAA, not people who blew the whistle on the activities, which happened to be the Federal Government that was investigating a guy and where he got his money and who he gave it to.

The actions of the University and their coaches got them in trouble, not some guy that taped a conversation in another program. I guess it just makes "ya'll" feel better by ragging on Pearl and trying to make some connection with this current situation. And when Pearl lands on his feet elsewhere and with probably a better job, then what are the Illini faithful going to say then?

Peace

If Pearl's tape was illegal, isn't it up to UI to press for charges? IIRC, he wasn't even so much as reprimanded from that angle.

I've got no love for Pearl, although there was a time I would have been happy to see him coaching at Iowa. His behavior towards the high school officials in TN turned me off of him in a hurry.

As for your question:
1st, wouldn't happen. If it did, the evidence would have been thrown out.

The difference, of course, is that the NCAA doesn't operate under the same rules of evidence and presumption of innocence as the US Justice System. More like Haazard County, IMO.

Talk about painting with a broad brush. I, personally, have no problems whatsoever with Bill Self.

It wasn't cut and dried? :confused: Do you know something we don't know? Correct me if I'm wrong but didn't Webber get fined through the legal system for those loans, also get suspended by the NBA for them, get his 1993 All-American honors removed and ordered not to associate with the Michigan program until 2013? Not to mention having Michigan's records removed completely from the 1992 & 93 Final Fours?

None of that happened?

Note I didn't even mention recent Michigan football. :p

First of all I am not painting anything with a broad brush. Even the media focused on the issue of Self and what he did at Illinois and Self had to make it clear "That was 8 years ago." It seems to be a major focus of Illinois fans and what he meant or did not mean to the program. Also it is talked about a lot in Illini discussion boards and other things when the Illini program is a topic. When Kansas won a title a couple of years ago you would have thought that Self betrayed them. Again you do not have to believe me, but I have never seen a fan base talk about things in the past as if they have direct influence today. Even Weber cannot be judged on his own but by what Self had and why he made the Final Four.

Peace

You obviously do not understand the point I was making. If you watched the ESPN Documentary that premiered over a week ago about the "Fab 5" you would have seen that the participants and even those that covered the team and the program are not totally convinced that Weber took money while at school. And according to Jalen Rose, who lived in the same community of Weber and Martin said that much of the accusations directed toward Martin were not associated with the Michigan program. Rose made it clear that Martin did things for kids throughout the community and not just players that went to a particular school or even were college players. And reporter Mitch Album (sp?) that was close to the situation claimed that if Webber was getting money while at Michigan, he sure was hiding it very well with the car he drove and the clothes he had on his back or the place he lived. So the issues do not seem cut and dry to those that witnessed the events. Album's assertion is that Weber left school after his sophomore year because he was not getting and benefit to what he and his teammates were bringing to the school and Nike specifically.

And this means what? You can mention it all you like and the reason that coach is now gone. I doubt seriously that anyone in 5 years will be complaining about what happen as the reason the program is up or down. What happened with Pearl was over 20 years ago. If Rich Rod lost another job I can tell you I would be surprised that anyone at Michigan would care or hope that it happens. Illini fans are not only mad that the program is where it is today, but they claim to still be mad that a certain coach never got the job as if the investigation is the only reason that coach ended up at UIC. I am not assuming this, I have asked many for what they think and it seems to come back to what happen a long time ago when this coach is brought up. It does not have to be all that feel this way, but the ones that believe this are very vocal.

Peace

Jalen Rose is a trusted source? Jalen Rose? THE Jalen Rose?

Bu-wa-ha-ha-ha.....:D

Again, are you freaking serious? By his own admission, Webber started taking money when he was in junior high school. The MHSAA wanted to expunge all his high school records too, but Webber's high school refused to do it and the MHSAA didn't have the power to do it themselves.

Soooooo, Webber admitted himself that he took money but others think he was lying. Got it. :)

Webber was charged with lying to a Grand Jury. He pleaded guilty and was fined $100,000. Yup, he pled "guilty". Whatinthehell is more convincing than pleading guilty?

Maybe you should check some facts, Jeff, before getting on your high horse. Google is your friend.

Chris Webber - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

That's just one source.

I don't disagree here. However, just because they're vocal doesn't mean they're the majority. Just ask a union member. ;)

The media isn't the most credible source. Of course they are looking for stories and sometimes fabricate the drama. I understand that there is still a section of the fanbase that feels spurned, but that doesn't make it the majority. That's the only point I was trying to make.

At any rate, that's not really the topic so I'll won't delve into it any further.

From what I remember, the laws in IA were/are different than IL about wiretapping, and thus it would've been a difficult prosecution based on jurisdictions, available evidence, etc.

The whole process was started as a result of Pearl having a tape of a recruit admitting that IL offered him a specific amount of cash, and a car. How much more of a major violation can there be? This isn't accidentally speaking to a recruit on the wrong day of the week. Play the tape in a news conference and IL will be knocked back down to Division 3 status. But yet, none of that was part of the final findings. Not a single mention. Even with the NCAA's version of justice. How come?

Agreed, hence the same disdain for the NCAA. I believe the NCAA even said outright in their news conference that even though they couldn't prove anything, they still felt IL was guilty. If that isn't Hazzard Co.-like, I don't know what is...

Oh, and Jeff - if it's not right to dislike a person that does your team wrong over time, how come I never see you wearing a red sweater vest? ;) :D

Because Thomas was smart enough to have a plausible explanation.
or
He was proven to be telling the truth. Doesn't really matter too much.



Like I said, I don't remember much about it except fans shaking their car keys at Carver Hawkeye Arena and vague talk of the possibility of batteries (representing the tape recorder) being thrown on the floor if Pearl went to the game at Illinois. Hawkeye fans found the whole thing amusing. I do remember there being some question of legality regarding the tapes, too.

But I had more important things on my mind when I was 16.

Because he's not Bill Cosby?

Like how do I get my hands on that cash and Blazer?

Or, how do I get my hands on other things?...

Cash and the blazer would have been nice, but it was the "other things."

How do you know?

Because Cosby would be on here bragging about Temple.

And on that note....

Do you know what the difference is between Bruce Pearl and Jim Tressel?

Nothing.

Yes, he was there. Were you or I there? Oh, and a reporter was there too and talked about the situation as well.

And this means what? Again if you paid attention the reports the kid played in the gutter of Detroit. Not sure what he benefitted from while in HS.

When did I say anything about what Webber did or did not admit to? I said reports were scratchy as to when he took money and the circumstances. And that Grand Jury was about Martin and his finances, not just about athletes. And the man died before anything was solved.

I am fully aware of the charges and what he was accused of lying to a Grand Jury, not doing anything else wrong legally. I am fully aware of what was reported. And know you want to us Google as a trusted source when anyone can put up things. I would trust the people that cover the team or were around than Wikipedia for God's sake. You make it sound like everyone agrees with the rules of the NCAA and things those kids have to be expected to do. Not every situation is about being an athlete and benefitting from such things.

Peace

I did not say they were credible, but they do tend to keep up drama that is silly. And if they are trying to make some issue out of his being at Illinois 8 years ago, do not tell me fans are not right behind them and those opinions. And I never said that the "majority" of anyone felt anyway. Actually you or I will never know how many feel one way or not feel one way on something like this. I just know that Illinois fans bring it up often. I was not even watching the games and that was what several mentioned when the topic came up. Majority or not, it is brought up too much if you ask me. ;)

Peace

Have you heard me even talk about Tressel? Actually it is interesting, but I do not care. And what he was accused of was worse than I can remember anyone from the Michigan football program doing.

You obviously do not know much about my personal opinions on Bill Cosby. I will leave it there. :rolleyes:

Peace

They really aren't relevant to a discussion of whether you wear a sweater vest. :rolleyes:

Cosby did not wear a vest. ;)

Peace

I call photoshop!

But they have let it go.
 

Lion's Eyes opinions

Deadspin Article

So much for letting it go.

Peace

A conviction on Webber's record for lying isn't a trusted source? An admission by Webber that he was getting money from a numbers operator and money launderer from the time he was in junior high school isn't either? But your personal idea of what actually happened ....even though it's contrary to the written record and can't be proven in any way.....is what happened?

Got it.

The man is a saint.

I'm done. And note I didn't make my point either. History did that for me. :)

Pearl was just fired for lying and cheating. That's why those articles have come to surface. They are relevant.

Every time I see Pearl on TV I have an urge to take a shower.

He's about as slimy as they come.

Best coach= biggest crook

The best part of him getting fired is my ability to relive the glory days of the scandal. Thanks fellas.

I went to Tennessee for grad school back in the Kevin O'Neill days -- Pearl made Tennessee a school where people looked forward to MEN'S basketball as well as WOMEN'S basketball.

I'm sure some no-name guy from some crappy D-1 conference will come in now and lead the team to a 17-16 record and an NIT berth or 3 before getting canned when they'll hire another no-name to come in and do the same.

Welcome to my life as a Hawkeye fan.

Your Todd Lickliter is my Buzz Peterson.

A lot of Hawkeye fans wish we'd kept Davis longer, and Keno would have been coaching now.

Hopefully your new coach will do it honestly, something that can't be said for
'Pearl Scam'

Like I really care. The only difference between Pearl and everyone else is that Pearl got caught. The real problem is with the idiotic rules the NCAA has put in place that all but make recruiting impossible.

Agreed. It's not like he offered anyone an SUV or anything.

Glad I could help.
How did ALford work out for ya?:p

Absolutely agree.

Having had a football player who was being recruited by a couple of colleges, I tried to read up on some of the recruiting rules - just to make sure the kid didn't get into any trouble.

What a bunch of convoluted crap. There are inconsistencies and downright contradictions all over the place in those stupid rules. A strict reading of the rules would almost make it impossible for a college coach to even look at a HS player.:mad:

Better than the next guy, not as good as the guy who hired Pearl.

I honestly think Alford got hired because the AD missed out on Stoops the year before. Now, we're suffering in obscurity because of the way Dr. Tom was treated.

That's Karma.

Don't fire him...really Rich? If you lied to your boss and then admitted you lied to your boss would they keep you around? He is just a bad person...plain and simple.

I thought the Big 10 traded Iowa to the Big 12 for Nebraska an a school to be named later.

fify:d

Nice...thanks!

Here's what I think is next for Pearl:

• 5-year ban from NCAA

• Coaches for a JUCO in Flordia next year

Maybe we could make a run in the Missouri Valley.

+1. Great coach. Bad person.

The Kenyans are to running as Pearl is to cheating.

Do they all do it? Perhaps, but Pearl is the leader in the clubhouse. I don't like anything about him.

You're making it sound like he was paying players or agents or something. From what I've seen, he made too many phone calls and hosted a player in his own home. Hardly puts him in the top echelon of NCAA cheaters; even in basketball. Hell, I'm pretty sure he's not really even qualified to coach in the.....WAIT FOR IT.....SEC with these lowly credentials.

Leader in the clubhouse? He's not even going to make the cut with this.

Good for you.

I like the enthusiasm and winning he brought to Knoxville on the men's side. I liked his showing up at the Lady Vol games in body paint and the rapport he had with Pat Summitt (who chose her words very carefully when asked about the situation) who showed up in a cheerleader outfit to cheer on the men's team. The team won and the fans came out.

If you don't care about Tennessee basketball or are an Illinois fan who holds a 20-year grudge, fine, he's a cheater, run him out of town, whatever. But personally, I don't give a sh!t about any of that. At all.

It's a crime that the AD (who sacrificed the team last weekend in a calculated move in an effort to save his sorry a$$) still has a job.

And the violations were what? Having a recruit at a BBQ at his house? Making a phone call or 100 too many? Y-A-W-N.

Sleaze Has No Offseason: Pearl Devoid Of Ethics in APR Criticism | Bleacher Report

I care about COLLEGE basketball and scumbags like Pearl denigrate it. I'm glad you had fun in grad school with a few wins he bought you but c'mon, raise your standards a touch. There in is the problem, programs like Tenn. are so desparate they sell their souls to the devil.

He's a bad act...........Adolph Hitler, no, but a real turd on so many levels. Please don't tell me you dig his sport coats? :)

Maybe he's not the "Leader in the Clubhouse," but, getting caught and fired - he made the "cut."

Yes, and I got the links that have been talking about Bruce Pearl to be fired since before the season has started. You can live in fantasy land all you like, but Illini fans have never let these things go. ;)

Peace

Yeah, the lying was a nice touch.

I thought I was clear earlier -- I was in grad school there a long time ago. Back then, tickets were free for the students and easy to come by. The women drew more fans than the men.

I just read that Shaka Smart is being spoken of for the Tennessee job. I could get behind that. He's from Wisconsin and his rise through the coaching ranks has been meteoric.

And therin lieth the problem.....

Some NCAA rules may be idiotic... I certainly agree with you on that... but they are the rules. It ain't no different than us having to officiate following the rules that we're given. Do you have everyone comply or no one comply?

Then the ban is lifted and he's hired as the next coach of Kentucky after Calipari leaves and Kentucky is put on probation. :D

I totally agree!!!!

Peace

Well, at least I thought you were younger! 'Shaka' Kahn would be better than Pearl.

I don't think you guys can beat Northern Iowa...maybe Drake..maybe.

Rich, you are an official and you are saying you don't care about a coach cheating...are you in the wrong part time profession?

I am a game official. I work games on the floor. I couldn't possibly care less what goes on behind the scenes.

If a coach cheats during the game, I'll take care of it within the rules I'm asked to enforce.

Also, I'm not an NCAA official and have no desire to ever be one. To me, cheating in college basketball means as much to me as cheating in the NBA. I don't really care.

To me cheating is cheating and I can't condone any of it...but that is just me.

I am sorry but I do not equate NCAA violations where it is illegal to pay to send a kid back to their parent’s funeral to someone committing academic fraud. Both illegal by the NCAA BTW.

The NCAA has a lot of stupid rules that have little or nothing to do with getting advantage.

And please, what we do on court/field/diamond is not the same as what happens off of those venues.

Peace

Do you actually believe Calipari will still be at UK in 5 years???:p