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-   -   Holding that whistle (https://forum.officiating.com/basketball/65302-holding-whistle.html)

bainsey Mon Mar 21, 2011 10:22am

Holding that whistle
 
I worked a girls' tourney over the weekend, and one play sticks out that I'd like to have back.

A-1 is going on a breakway, with B-2 just behind her. B-2 has two hands on A-1 as she's driving, but A-1 can easily play through it, so I hold the whistle. At the last split-second, B-2 releases contact, and A-1's attempt hits the bottom of the backboard. I have nothing but a staredown from the coach, a veteran varsity coach. I can't argue with his silent dispute.

I'm not crazy about blowing the whistle immediately when both hands are touching in this case, for aforementioned reasons. In these cases, is it generally better to blow the whistle on the release? Am I wrong not to blow the whistle immediately every time there's two handed contact? Should I wait to see if the layup is good? (I've seen some veteran officials do this.)

I know I'm producing a HTBT, but what are your thoughts?

JugglingReferee Mon Mar 21, 2011 10:27am

It sounds as if the two hands on the back were there for a period of time, and they did not increase or decrease in pressure.

If you think there should be a foul, consider this:

Do you think there is a difference in B disadvantaging A when comparing A's dribble to A's shot attempt?

If so, then call a shooting foul.

If not, then give it a split-second to see if B removes their hands, and if not, you have to call the common foul before any attempt is made.

My personal opinion is that there most definitely is a difference. I'd definitely consider a shooting foul. But, I would have to see the play.

Adam Mon Mar 21, 2011 10:28am

So, did A1 drive by B2 or not?

Seems to me you can't have a shooting foul, so you need to decide if B2 impeded A1's shot or not. If she didn't, you let A1 live with the results of her layup. If she did, call the foul.

Camron Rust Mon Mar 21, 2011 11:21am

Sounds to me like A1 was in her habitual motion at the time the hands were removed. Once you've seen enough to determine an advantage was gained, call the foul, even if it takes a moment....that may be when the shot doesn't get released cleanly or on a path that wouldn't have occurred without the contact.

If you blow the whistle too early, you take a way A1's earned advantageous position OR you make it a more difficult sales job for you to count the basket if it goes. I'm going to err on the side of letting the shooter get to the shot if there is anyway that can be done.

Adam Mon Mar 21, 2011 11:25am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snaqwells (Post 741955)
<strike>So, did A1 drive by B2 or not?

Seems to me you can't have a shooting foul, so you need to decide if B2 impeded A1's shot or not. If she didn't, you let A1 live with the results of her layup. If she did, call the foul.</strike>

Quote:

Originally Posted by Camron Rust (Post 741973)
Sounds to me like A1 was in her habitual motion at the time the hands were removed. Once you've seen enough to determine an advantage was gained, call the foul, even if it takes a moment....they may be when the shot doesn't get released cleanly or on a path that wouldn't have occurred without the contact.

If you blow the whistle too early, you take a way A1's earned advantageous position OR you make it a more difficult sales job for you to count the basket if it goes. I'm going to err on the side of letting the shooter get to the shot if there is anyway that can be done.

After re-reading the play, I agree with Camron.

Mark T. DeNucci, Sr. Mon Mar 21, 2011 12:36pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snaqwells (Post 741976)
After re-reading the play, I agree with Camron.


Snaqs:

How do you make that crossout line in you last post above?

MTD, Sr.

Adam Mon Mar 21, 2011 12:39pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr. (Post 742018)
Snaqs:

How do you make that crossout line in you last post above?

MTD, Sr.

Mark,
Use the word "strike".
Now, put the < symbol in front.
Then put the > in back.
To end the effect, do the same thing but put the / symbol in front of "strike".

Welpe Mon Mar 21, 2011 01:02pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snaqwells (Post 742023)
Mark,
<s>Use the word "strike".</s>
Use the letter "s".
Now, put the < symbol in front.
Then put the > in back.
To end the effect, do the same thing but put the / symbol in front of <s>"strike"</s> "s".

As an example...just S works too.

Adam Mon Mar 21, 2011 01:11pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr. (Post 742018)
Snaqs:

How do you make that crossout line in you last post above?

MTD, Sr.

Here's another helper. Just quote my post, and you'll see how it's done.
<strike>here</strike>

Camron Rust Mon Mar 21, 2011 04:50pm

But if you mess up where you put the tags or how the tag is spelled, you get something like this....

<strike>
Quote:

Originally Posted by Snaqwells (Post 742048)
Here's another helper. Just quote my post, and you'll see how it's done.
<strike>here</strike>

</strr>
fdofd

Adam Mon Mar 21, 2011 04:54pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Camron Rust (Post 742149)
But if you mess up where you put the tags or how the tag is spelled, you get something like this....

<strike>
</strr>
fdofd

Now that's just cool.

Welpe Mon Mar 21, 2011 05:03pm

That's funny, it struck the signature delimiter and the signature itself.

M&M Guy Mon Mar 21, 2011 05:10pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snaqwells (Post 742150)
Now that's just cool.

You mean lining out all your posts?

:D

Adam Mon Mar 21, 2011 08:25pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by M&M Guy (Post 742154)
You mean lining out all your posts?

:D

Again with the hate. You needed more hugs, didn't you?

26 Year Gap Tue Mar 22, 2011 09:53am

But, not from THIS guy.
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Snaqwells (Post 742208)
Again with the hate. You needed more hugs, didn't you?

http://www.baxterboo.com/catdogblog/...nagglepuss.jpg


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