again bored at work today so I'm coming up with some topics for discussion:

I was hoping you could share some tips for managing the table crew: I work subvarsity games and the book/time keepers are usually whomever they can grab. I had several times last year where I resumed play only to then be told the player had fouled out and things like this that make me look bad as an official but I really couldn't control, or could I?

What are some things you say or do to work better with the table?

thanks again
GTW

To BOTH the scorekeeper and clock operator I generally say:

"Please check to make sure you are in agreement in regards to point totals and foul totals after every basket and foul call."

"If there are any problems or confusion here, hit the horn at a dead ball and we'll come over and get it fixed."

"Please notify me immediately if a player gets their fifth foul."

"Please tell me immediately if you are requested to make any changes to numbers in the book."

"After a dead ball, one of us will always be chopping an arm to give you the start the clock signal." (I remind them of this again near the end of close ball games).

I also try not to get too dependent on my table. In other words, I go look at the book after each quarter and at each time-out near the end of a close game. I'm looking to see if any players are nearing their fifth foul, how many time-outs each team has left etc. (just general game awareness stuff).

One thing I like to do is spend a couple minutes before the game at the table smiling and being friendly. I want them to relax and know they are part of the officiating team and there is nothing we can't handle. Table crews seem to do better if they feel comfortable rather than stressed and if they think the officials are normal people instead of robots assigned to the game.

Z

All good pieces of advice....a couple more:

I ask the scorer not to record any information on a foul until we report it.

I also tell the scorer that I will not report a foul until I get eye contact with him or her at the table.

I also ask for notification from them at team foul #6 and #9 so we can be prepared for the right # of FT. I am all for game awareness and not needing this help, but I would rather be safe than sorry.

Especially if it's a kid, I phrase this as "... because we might change our minds between the time we blow the whistle and the time we report."

Bob
 

I even tell them that I will stand out in the middle of the court until they bring their head up and look at me. It usually takes one time and then they pay attention after that.

Peace

In my opinion, this is probably the most important piece of advice.

Also, don't forget to check the arrow after every held ball, and at the beginning of every quarter. Be sure you include your table people in the motion (not physically include!) to change the arrow at half-time. If they don't understand, explain fully. Tis way there are no problems at the beginning of the third quarter.

Slightly off topic, but........
 

Whenever a kid shoots after the whistle, I tell the kid "Don't shoot after the whistle. It confuses the scorer and he's not too sharp to begin with."

Last year, one kid replied, "Yeah, I know. He's my dad."

Another piece of advice.

You as the official on the floor should have an idea when bonus is coming up. If you are nt sure when you report a fouls and youre close ask them how many team fouls?

Game awarenesss also tells you you should know who has three and foulr fouls. or have a pretty good idea.

when you check the book dicretely look and stay on top of it

That way a couple of things you mention do not sneak up on you

Remember even in the NBA where the scorers and timers have done forever, they always have a pre-gme and cover the same topics every game with them. Its always a good idea...

2nd Dead Ball...Correctable Error
 

Z [/B][/QUOTE]

"If there are any problems or confusion here, hit the horn at a dead ball and we'll come over and get it fixed."

Hmmmmmm, I might want the scorers to hit the horn immediately, even during a live ball, if they have a problem concerning a correctable error.
Rule 2-10-3
"If...the error is made while the clock is running and the ball dead, it must be recognized by an official before the second live ball."
A scorer may not realize the ball is dead after a made basket, because the clock is still running, therefore it may be a good idea to just have them hit the horn when they discover a problem rather than waiting for a "dead ball".
Any examples to support me?

RD

<i> therefore it may be a good idea to just have them hit the horn when they discover a problem rather than waiting for a "dead ball". Any examples to support me?</i>

Since <B> I </B> even have trouble memorizing every single thing in rule 2.10, I certainly don't think there are is anyone working at the table at a high school game that has it all committed to memory. IMHO, I would not ever tell the table personnel to hit the horn during a live ball in order to get my attention.

Z

What do you say to the table regarding subs? How do you handle the scorekeeper that blows the horn for a sub as you admininster an in-bounds play, etc? Do you ensure the scorekeeper has the subs correct when a team does a "student body left"? Not look over the scorekeeper's shoulder or anything, just a "you got that?", or something similar?

Just wonderin'.

Do not blow the horn!!!!
 

Tell them to only blow the horn if you have not noticed a sub. Other than that, let us do that instead. Someone on the crew should be watching the table for subs. They may blow the horn when it is inproper. And believe me that will happen.

Peace

Here is my favorite story about the table.We are taught from our first year on to always have a good pre-game with table personel and this is a great thing.Well my first year
I walk up to the scorekeeper who I find out later is a thirty year softball official and has done scorekeeping for just about as long and I attempr my speech.Almost before I can say nice to meet you and there's a few things I would like to go over he has a answer ready.He says shut up put the whistle in your mouth and don't blow on it,walk over there throw the ball up and lets go!So I meekly went over and did what I was told.

That kind of answer only serves to piss me off. I always say in reply, "You've done this forever? Then you only get the short version. . ." Grrrrrrrr

Chuck

Excuse me! Not being able to hear HOW he said it obviously can make a difference, but I can't think of any acceptable tone for a comment along those lines. They are part of the crew. Pretty sure the referee can have someone removed from the table (don't have my books with me at work). Considering those two things, that guy say that to me and he would get some along the lines of; "I'm sorry, but as referee of tonights game you are part of my crew. There are some things I'm going to review with the table personel. You will sit there, listen to what I have to say and treat me with the common courtesy that should be afforded any human being. If that is unacceptable to you, let me know that now so I can get someone to replace you. And don't tell me to shut up again. Do you have any questions before I continue?"

If this "man" really was an official with 30 years experience he would know how to conduct himself. Sounds more like a person with one year experience that has been repeated 29 times. :(

I think I would have had him removed anyway. With that attitude, he could and probably would cause you grief for the whole game. Had a game last year where the R (3-person) had the home scorer removed for questioning every thing we reported. Turned out she was the coach's wife. She had a reputation as being "a know-it-all *itch".

Just wanted to add in the years since I have learned how to deal with guys like him.The best way I have found is to play on their ego.I say something like I know you know this stuff cold but it helps me to go over it.Like Dbl said the table can cause you serious grief as the game goes on.We had another guy we had to get the local assoc.to get fixed because when you reported a foul against his home team and would visably shake his head like you made the worst call ever!By the way mister thirty years retired from all officiating yea.