Partners not on same page....
 

Situation is this; I am sure everyone has called a game with someone that you are not on the same page with. I worked a championship tournament and My partner and I were not on the same planet. He was calling all over the floor, and "Breathe on you" fouls. Anyway, At halftime, I tactfully said, and in a polite way, I said, "partner, If you would just slow down a bit and referee the result of the play, Some of the fouls you might not have to call. He got very Defensive and Actually got Upset and felt he was being talked down to. He actually made the comment that He hates how Officials do that and etc. He also told me, "I called you to go work this game with me, Don't forget that. And it was him that did me the favor, etc. I said Ok, Got it and tried to change the subject. I didn't want to upset him anymore because we had another half to work. So we went out to work the 2nd half and because i didn't match his calls, We looked terrible as a crew. I wasn't about to make up fouls to be on the same page with him. Guess that made us very "INCONSISTENT" as the coaches like to use. I really tried to be a good partner but because he called everything, It looked like I didn't know what I was doing. I honestly didn't mean it in a degrading way but I can say, I will be ok if we don't work together again. Wondering if anyone else has had a partner that you just didn't blend in with.........Thanks for your input in advance.........freddie_g2001 at Yahoo.com

I think we've all had a partner or two who we wouldn't mind never working with again. We also maybe have had partners who never want to work with us again.

There's just no way that we're always going to have great chemistry with everyone we work with.

Your next partner could be the best you've ever had.

Just another day in the life of an official.

Peace

Us referees can be a sensitive bunch at times. Perhaps you could've worded it differently?

I'm learning to start with myself (whether its true or not) which makes it easier for others to open up & talk about their miscues.

"How do you feel about our consistency as a crew? I know that I need to slow down a bit & referee the result of the contact, I could've saved a couple of fouls. What do you think?"


Some nights we have to trick partners into getting on the same page. And on those other nights... savor the moment!!

Sometimes we just need to finish the game and go home.

Tref
 

Perhaps you are right, Although I Sincerely didn't mean to hurt the guys feelings, I have a friend that has always told me, I have good intentions, Bad Delivery. Probably true. Maybe i could have re-worded it. I really did like the guy and know he wants to be good. I have strived the past 3 or 4 years to be a better partner, but Will not make Calls Up for the sake of matching a partner's call........Guess it is what it is...........Thanks for the input.

If your description is accurate, more likely it looked like he didn't know what he was doing.

Wondering about this guy's age and experience level.

a good pre game can sometimes be a good preventative tool. i normally ask if either of us have had these teams/players. i try to let me partner know what i am working on that game and ask them the same. however, i know in most non varsity games we meet a few minutes before tip off and run out. i had a coach tell me that he can tell how the game is going to go by the greetings the referees show one another. a regular hand shake means we are meeting for the first time and a hug/chest bump shows him we know each other... good luck the rest of the season.

4 yrs.
 

Partner had 4 years experience.....No bigger game experience......only worked a hand full of varsity games......mostly JV and below.......

I called a two whistle game with a guy like this once - except I am not sure he was even on the same floor or the same sport even. I had pre-gamed with him and he said he was relatively new so I went through what we needed to look for, etc. I told him not to be afraid to call a foul and if he called one to follow through. I said to be sure to blow the whistle with authority so we can all hear it.

Got to the game and he never called ANYTHING - and I am being serious. He never called a foul the whole game, wouldn't blow whistle, call color or point direction on a OOB play, his mechanics were non existent, etc. He didn't understand rotation. It was a disaster. The coaches were livid and I understood. Of course if I called something that was out of my PCA (since he never did), they were upset. If I didn't call something, they were upset. Both coaches ended up with Ts before the night was over. I hated to whack them but it was getting out of control. It was by far the worse partner I have ever had. He looked horrible and it made me look bad as well.

I called our assigner after the game and told him that he didn't need to be calling games. I never saw him again and he isn't listed on our roster of officials.

Maybe your partner just had a different concept of how much contact should be allowed. Maybe he also thought you were letting way too much go. If he had come to you first at the half and said "Partner, if you would just slow down a bit and referee the result of the play, you might get more of the fouls.", would you get defensive and upset and felt that you were being talked down to?

Think about it.

Every official has their own idea of how much contact should be allowed and what is a foul. Who decides which one.... the official who calls a tight game or the official that calls a loose game....is right? If I'm observing/evaluating and an official is consistent in his foul calling, what am I supposed to say to him?

Some officials just don't work well together because of different play-calling philosophies. There's not much you can do if you get a partner with opposite views except get through it. Smart assignors pick these things up and will try to keep you away from each other. And note, that doesn't mean that either official was wrong or a bad official. They're just not suited to work with each other.

JMO.

In my pre-games I always talk about how tight or loose we are going to call something. This way I learn my partner(s) take on fouls,e tc and they learn mine. We might not agree totally but I know that going in. I agree that some partners call too loose and some too tight but if you discuss some of this before hand, it won't eliminate the issue but might help get you on same page. I agree that if you call consistently it shouldn't make much difference

I tend to call MS games more loose than HS games

Pet Peeves
 

Of course, this is all after the fact. But perhaps this idea might be useful to keep the same kind of thing from happening again with your next new guy/gal.
A favorite thing to do in a pre-game is ask a partner new to me the question, "What are two or three of your favorite pet peeves, that is, what do you see partners doing and you say to yourself, 'I hope this new guy (me) won't do that tonight." This opens up the opportunity to express one or two things during the pregame which, though not necessarily pointed at the new partner, will come across loudly and clearly with the likelihood that the new partner will adjust to the pet peeves you've expressed.
This was a successful, non-offensive way for me to deal in advance with not a few "That Guys" assigned to me for the first time, whose shortfalls I had seen in games I've observed previously.
I began to do this because of a similar situation two years ago--partner wouldn't call a thing, nor use any mechanics, approved or not. Called the assignor who was unaware of this and adjustments were made to his schudule for the benefit of all. I think he went on to volleyball or something.
Contributions by posters of this discussion board helped me come up with a good list of pet peeves.

I had something similar. We had a BJV game and the first half went good. V had about 8 or 9 fouls and H about 5 or 6. At half, my partner comes to me and asks me to stop calling fouls in his area. I did not realize I was doing it, just following the play from my area to the basket, mostly at the lower box an my side as the trial. I said OK. The second half, I swallowed my whistle for play in the paint when I am trail. Bad mistake. I let about 5 or 6 fouls go for V and 1 for H. Fouls were about 9 to 2 in favor of H. V couch reasonably upset. After another no call he goes berserk and I T him. As I was reporting the T, he walks to my partner and lets him at it and he T's him for the second time and he's gone. Should never have happened. A valuable lesson learned at the expense of the coach. Next time I will talk it out with my partner and let him know I will follow drives to the basket that are near to my side. Most of these fouls were open to me and he is looking through players.

Am I wrong?

No, you're not wrong.

Assuming 2 officials:

1. It is his primary, but not an ideal area for him to have.
2. He should be crossing over to get a good look at these plays.
3. It's an area where you should hold your whistle a second before getting the call from T. Give him a chance to make the call, but I'd get them.

In situations like this, presentation is everything...rather than giving your partner a lecture - which I guarantee you is exactly how it came across to him - ask questions. "Partner, what are you seeing on those drives to the basket?" or "Partner, what is the defender doing in the post that I am missing?" Your partner will respond way better to that kind of presentation, as opposed to "You..." followed by anything.

I have learned that it is way easier to get a crew on the same page when I don't act like the teacher lecturing a student.

Probably not. It's called a PRIMARY coverage area, not an EXCLUSIVE coverage area. I always tell a partner that if you see something in my PCA, call it. I'm not territorial.

That said, I still kicked a call recently in my partner's area.

I was the trail, and had a shooting foul. The coach thought it was a clean block ("why didn't HE call it"), and my partner thought it was, too. My partner nicely spoke to me at halftime, with the "trust your partner" message. Indeed, I broke the rule about calling out of your PCA. I wasn't late (I was way too quick), nor was I right.

Still, I appreciated his thoughts. Many partners will simply not say anything, and grumble about behind your back. That doesn't help anyone. I have far more respect for a partner that tries to give constructive criticism.

I usually ask a partner about a play with the exact time and the situation and let them tell me what they saw. Then we talk about the play if that play was a "problem." Usually they say something that makes me satisfied becasue they explain something I did not see or that they had an angle I did not have. Most of all it becomes a conversation, not a lecture or it does not seem as if I am the one trying to see what I missed.

Peace

Yep.

I know this is an old thread, but...

Along the lines of partners giving feedback, I had this happen this week.

After our 3-whistle BV game, we get in the locker room and one of my partners starts a postgame conversation, which is normal. The problem I had with it was that it was that he was the only one doing the talking and he directed it all at me about one play, which I thought was unfair. Not only that, but he accused me of calling in front of him in his area, and used this one play as an example. (He didn't approach it with the "What did you see?" like others have used in this thread)

I was the C, he was the L, and we had a player in the lane shooting a 3-4 footer while moving toward the basket. The defender pushed him from behind and I got the foul. Probably not in my primary by strict interpretation, but definitely in the gray area in the lane, and I had a great angle and look at the play, so I called it. He told me that "At that point in the game we should let #32 play through that" (#32 is a very good player and it was the 4th quarter), and that the play was two feet in front of him. I simply asked if he would have called it a foul in the first quarter, to which he got really defensive. That led to a short argument and voices being raised. (If he didn't want me to respond, he shouldn't have brought it up in the first place)

He did admit on the way home that he handled it the wrong way, and I told him that I don't have a problem discussing plays, but I don't care to get accused of calling out of my area because of one play in the gray area.

Hello stranger!

Old thread, he's still on sabbatical.

This thread is about a year old. ;)

I almost missed that too.

Peace

oops!

This is something you unfortunately will always deal with.

My advice is to be REALLY good on your plays. Don't try to put the same weak calls into the game as your partner. Don't change how you referee.

Coaches will watch the film and see that your partner sucked and you did a good job. And will hopefully then rate accordingly.

As far as what you could have done, it depends on your relationship with the other official. If he is your peer, and you have a good relationship, I would definitely try to engage him by asking things like: "How do you feel the game is going?" "Are there any calls we didn't like?" Hopefully, you can start to have some honest dialog and improve things for the rest of the game.

If this other official is a "bigdog", I wouldn't waste your time. They are usually set in their ways and you don't really have the standing to approach them. So just be the BEST that YOU can be.

No matter how sweet you sounded, not very tactful IMO. How about "Am I letting them bang too much" This gives him a shot of 'fessing up' that he was a little over officious in his calls. If he doesn't bite, you know what kind of second half you're in for.

That said, so what if you hurt his feelings. You expressed your concerns and while you may be off his Christmas card list, he may adjust his calls for 2nd half which is really your goal.

What level? Sounds like JH tourney.

Edit: Sorry, just saw old thread responses