The Official Forum

The Official Forum (https://forum.officiating.com/)
-   Basketball (https://forum.officiating.com/basketball/)
-   -   Hey Rook! (https://forum.officiating.com/basketball/57609-hey-rook.html)

Rooster Fri Mar 19, 2010 03:00pm

Hey Rook!
 
After attending my first camp this past summer I just finished my first season as a middle school official, with intentions of attending a camp (or two) this coming summer, working a summer league (or two) and joining my state association to officiate high school in 2010-2011. I’ve got decent mechanics and am studying the rule book but I would like to work on improving my court vision and overall “with-it-ness” in order to improve my intangibles. I think I did a pretty good job with court presence but I want to improve on that as well.

I’m reffing the defense, keeping ‘em boxed in, and I never turn my back on the court in transition. In my head I’m telling myself “White on D, white on D…” and when the defense gets close to the ball I’ll mentally say something like “White 14,” especially in the post. But I’d like to be able to see more of my PCA. I know angles and moving to improve are important but I still feel like I’m tunneling in. Any suggestions?

One other problem I’m having that makes me feel ridiculous: I sometimes having trouble getting the color right on an out of bounds call. I get the direction right but sometimes yell the wrong color, or vice versa, confusing players, not to mention looking like a dope. Most guys I’m watching make it seem so effortless. Anyone have any quick phrases you say in your head that helps keep everything straight?

Thanks for whatever y'all got.

Viva Officiating.com

mutantducky Fri Mar 19, 2010 03:48pm

refs even at the nba and college still make that mistakes. I remember in my first couple of years I was mixing up really obvious out of bounds calls like you are. Now it is a minor issue so exp helps. Before the game and in the first minute I'll tell myself something like White going this way, Red the way and point. When the ball goes out of bounds just mentally get it right and signal. It doesn't need to be really fast. I'm sure others will have better ideas but it is something that gets easier with experience.

Rooster Fri Mar 19, 2010 03:55pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by mutantducky (Post 669295)
Before the game and in the first minute I'll tell myself something like White going this way, Red the way and point.

Yeah, I've been doing that and you're right, it seems to help. I just like the idea of being quick AND right (ya know, decisive for the sell :D) and am hoping that someone has that magic mental key so that when the stuff starts to fly I can be "auto man." :cool:

Adam Fri Mar 19, 2010 04:08pm

Stop saying the color, just point.

Mark Padgett Fri Mar 19, 2010 04:24pm

Or just always yell, "GRAY"! Hey - it's neutral.

Camron Rust Fri Mar 19, 2010 04:40pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snaqwells (Post 669298)
Stop saying the color, just point.

Really? :confused:

It is the saying of the color that is usually the most reliable.

Rich Fri Mar 19, 2010 04:50pm

Even after years of doing this, I'll sneak a quick peek at the bench early in the game once in a while. They're going opposite the benches the first half, towards them the second half.

Yesterday, an NCAA game tipped with the R losing track of which way the teams were going -- he ended up being the C tableside and U2 filled in. You could see the R tapping his chest and saying, "my bad." Happens. Shrug.

Adam Fri Mar 19, 2010 04:54pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Camron Rust (Post 669306)
Really? :confused:

It is the saying of the color that is usually the most reliable.

Sorry, I should have elaborated. When I quit saying the color, it made me focus on the directional signal and they came more quickly.
Now, like Rich, I often have to take a peak at the bench as I'm ready to point. Sometimes, if it's a close play and waiting will look bad, I'll say the color as I look to the bench.

It's just a tool I used to get quicker at the directional signal.

M&M Guy Fri Mar 19, 2010 04:56pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snaqwells (Post 669298)
Stop saying the color, just point.

For whatever it's worth, I've been told to always verbalize the color. Perhaps it's a "location" thing, so find out how they want it done in your area. And, if you state a color, don't say, "Off white, red ball". Most players and coaches will only hear the first color verbalized, and that can cause unnecessary confusion.

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Rooster
I just like the idea of being quick AND right (ya know, decisive for the sell ) and am hoping that someone has that magic mental key so that when the stuff starts to fly I can be "auto man."

This may be part of the problem; you don't need to "sell" all your calls and be so quick. The same reason applies here as it does for deciding foul calls - just like a patient whistle helps you see the play and more likely to get it right, a slight hesitation will give you that extra time to realize the right color and get the direction correct. In fact, most of the time it should be the same timing as when you call the "obvious" ones. Save the quick and dramatic calls only for the closest calls at the most important part of the game.

When I've had a problem with pointing the proper direction is usually at the beginning of a game or half, when I try to be too quick with the point while verbalizing the color. I've gotten away from that problem by blowing the whistle, saying, "Red!", then taking a half second or so to check out the direction, then point. (Well, then there's my other problem when the teams are actually white and blue... :eek: )

Rich Fri Mar 19, 2010 04:57pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snaqwells (Post 669309)
Sorry, I should have elaborated. When I quit saying the color, it made me focus on the directional signal and they came more quickly.
Now, like Rich, I often have to take a peak at the bench as I'm ready to point. Sometimes, if it's a close play and waiting will look bad, I'll say the color as I look to the bench.

It's just a tool I used to get quicker at the directional signal.

I try to delay a bit on every call. If I do feel the need to grab a peek, it looks no different than any other call. Whistle, short delay, point.

BillyMac Fri Mar 19, 2010 05:36pm

Whistle, Stop Clock, Point, Peek At Bench, Color ...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by RichMSN (Post 669307)
Even after years of doing this, I'll sneak a quick peek at the bench early in the game once in a while. They're going opposite the benches the first half, towards them the second half.

Good advice. I occasionally use this method myself.

Rooster Fri Mar 19, 2010 05:54pm

Thanks for all the good perspectives
 
Thanks to everyone who has contributed so far (keep 'em coming). Does anyone have an issue and/or strategy to deal with the tunneling in that I mentioned earlier?

Thanks.

Judtech Fri Mar 19, 2010 07:32pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snaqwells (Post 669298)
Stop saying the color, just point.

I have found myself doing this as well, but with a twist. I was watching an evaluator I had at a camp do a game and they would say "Stay Here" if the ball was staying or just point or point and say "That way" if going the other direction. I asked them what their thought process was, and they said it was for a couple of reasons. 1. THEY sometimes mixed up the colors 2. They said that with some uniform colors not being "typical" (red, blue, black white) it was easier than saying Purple, Magenta or any of the other 118 colors in the Crayola box.
I've stolen that little mechanic and have not had any negative feedback. But like always see what your assignors WANT and go from there.

Adam Fri Mar 19, 2010 07:50pm

I've found myself using the "that way" or "stay here" verbage on occasion, but I'm not fond of it personally. I must have picked it up from someone, but couldn't say who it was.

sseltser Fri Mar 19, 2010 07:50pm

Just to add to this. There are times where I notice the defense tipped it last, but didn't really think of which color is going which way, so I just point, then look around and say the color. Other times, particularly during scrambles, I'll yell the color, peak to benches and point...

I don't think anybody really notices but us. You have to delay pretty considerably before anybody would notice anything out of the ordinary.

Camron Rust Fri Mar 19, 2010 07:50pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Judtech (Post 669346)
I have found myself doing this as well, but with a twist. I was watching an evaluator I had at a camp do a game and they would say "Stay Here" if the ball was staying or just point or point and say "That way" if going the other direction. I asked them what their thought process was, and they said it was for a couple of reasons. 1. THEY sometimes mixed up the colors 2. They said that with some uniform colors not being "typical" (red, blue, black white) it was easier than saying Purple, Magenta or any of the other 118 colors in the Crayola box.
I've stolen that little mechanic and have not had any negative feedback. But like always see what your assignors WANT and go from there.

When there is a scramble for a lose ball in the middle third of the court, what way does "Stay Here" indicate?

Stick with the colors. I don't think I've said a wrong color more then once every few years....(when I meant the other color, not getting the call wrong.)

I've pointed the wrong way far more often than saying the wrong color....not a common thing, but relatively speaking.

Judtech Fri Mar 19, 2010 08:11pm

In that particular play I would either go with a color or a "That way" with a point. In all honesty it would all depend on where I was positioned. If I am getting taken out by a player diving for a loose ball then I'd go color. VERY difficult to give a hand signal while getting a chop or cross body block! I may be wrong but those types of plays don't happen very often in a game. But that is just me.
I would further add, that I am not adverse to using color and do so on some occasions (can't put a number on it) but this is just a mechanic I picked up that has helped and I like and have had no negative reprecussions (or CONCUSSIONS) for that matter!

Back In The Saddle Fri Mar 19, 2010 10:50pm

All helpful advice. In my experience, it's much easier to get the color right than the point. It is very effective to call out the color and delay the point until you figure out the direction. I have also come to realize that in that moment of panic and doubt it feels like it's taking us weeks to figure out the direction, but almost always nobody notices the delay.

From my experience and observation:
* Early in our careers we want to make the call as quickly as possible. We feel like we're "on it like Blue Bonnet". In reality we're rushing and don't look confident and in control.
* Soon we develop a calm and rhythm to our mechanics. Quick whistles and emphatic salesmanship are held in reserve for close calls.
* At some point we discover the virtue of the little pause, whether to sneak a peek at the benches, or to read the players' body language to help when you're not sure
* Finally we learn to alter our rhythm to control the game, sometimes hustling the ball back into play, sometimes slowing and injecting a deep-breath moment when the pace gets out of control.

biggravy Sat Mar 20, 2010 12:09am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Back In The Saddle (Post 669395)
All helpful advice. In my experience, it's much easier to get the color right than the point. It is very effective to call out the color and delay the point until you figure out the direction. I have also come to realize that in that moment of panic and doubt it feels like it's taking us weeks to figure out the direction, but almost always nobody notices the delay.

From my experience and observation:
* Early in our careers we want to make the call as quickly as possible. We feel like we're "on it like Blue Bonnet". In reality we're rushing and don't look confident and in control.
* Soon we develop a calm and rhythm to our mechanics. Quick whistles and emphatic salesmanship are held in reserve for close calls.
* At some point we discover the virtue of the little pause, whether to sneak a peek at the benches, or to read the players' body language to help when you're not sure
* Finally we learn to alter our rhythm to control the game, sometimes hustling the ball back into play, sometimes slowing and injecting a deep-breath moment when the pace gets out of control.

Post of the Week.

Judtech Sat Mar 20, 2010 08:41am

Quote:

Originally Posted by biggravy (Post 669409)
Post of the Week.

I know it brought a tear to my eye. But I agree

Texas Aggie Sat Mar 20, 2010 08:36pm

Quote:

Stop saying the color, just point.
no, No, NO! ALWAYS say the color. In my opinion, this is not debatable.

We can live with pointing wrong. Worst case is a couple of players look at you funny, you correct it, and go on. If you don't say the color, you look like you are giving in to a player asking you to change the call.

Adam Sat Mar 20, 2010 08:45pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Texas Aggie (Post 669540)
no, No, NO! ALWAYS say the color. In my opinion, this is not debatable.

We can live with pointing wrong. Worst case is a couple of players look at you funny, you correct it, and go on. If you don't say the color, you look like you are giving in to a player asking you to change the call.

And saying the wrong color and changing doesn't look even more like you caved?

Tio Sun Mar 21, 2010 10:36pm

I think you may want to look at the symptoms of why you are struggling with this play. Generally, slow down, don't be in a hurry. Many out of bounds plays "call themselves." The players all heading in the other direction is usually a good indication of what happened. Make sure you "see the whole play." If your positioning isn't good, you may only be seeing the middle or finish of the play and therefore not getting the call correct.

Camron Rust Mon Mar 22, 2010 01:27am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snaqwells (Post 669541)
And saying the wrong color and changing doesn't look even more like you caved?

It would, but it has to be dramatically less likely to occur than pointing the wrong direction.

Adam Mon Mar 22, 2010 08:24am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Camron Rust (Post 669712)
It would, but it has to be dramatically less likely to occur than pointing the wrong direction.

Absolutely, I agree pointing in the wrong direction is more likely; but verbalizing the wrong color looks worse than pointing the wrong direction IMO. Do you have situation A, which looks less bad but happens more often verses sutation B which looks far worse (IMO) but happens rarely (the OP didn't say how often he does it). Which would you rather fix first?

Also, assuming a given official only struggles with B and not A?

Also, I was responding to Texas Aggie who said "If you don't say the color, you look like you are giving in to a player asking you to change the call." Frankly, I disagree with this completely. This looks less like caving than if you delay for a split second.

Rooster Mon Mar 22, 2010 09:48am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tio (Post 669704)
I think you may want to look at the symptoms of why you are struggling with this play. Generally, slow down, don't be in a hurry.

Yep, this is a good key and will be a personal POE going forward. That's what I saw on my cards more than once during camp last summer. That, and "enjoy the game," at which I am getting much better. I am hooked.

Kool-aid anyone? :rolleyes:


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:28pm.



Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.3.0 RC1