Foul by disqualified player

[Fathertime]

We had different positions on this after our chapter meeting tonight.

A1 has fouled out and has been disqualified with the coach notified. Later in the game, B1 has a breakaway and A1 jumps off of the bench and tackles B1 before B1 can shoot.

What exactly do you call here? How many free throws, who is penalized and how, etc.

[tjones1]

From the 2005-2006 Interps

SITUATION 12: Team B has just scored to go up by three points with time running out in the fourth quarter. Player A1 inbounds the ball to A2 close to the sideline of Team B's bench. A2 releases a three-point try just prior to the horn sounding. Substitute B7 leaves the bench area, enters the court and blocks the shot. RULING: B7 shall be charged with two technical fouls and ejected. One technical foul is assessed for entering the court without permission and one for unsporting conduct. Any member of Team A may shoot the four free throws for the technical fouls. The results of these free throws will determine if the game is over or going into overtime. COMMENT: Two technical fouls must be assessed in this situation. Otherwise, the team committing the infraction would benefit from the act. (10-4-1; 10-4-2)

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by tjones1

From the 2005-2006 Interps

SITUATION 12: Team B has just scored to go up by three points with time running out in the fourth quarter. Player A1 inbounds the ball to A2 close to the sideline of Team B's bench. A2 releases a three-point try just prior to the horn sounding. Substitute B7 leaves the bench area, enters the court and blocks the shot. RULING: B7 shall be charged with two technical fouls and ejected. One technical foul is assessed for entering the court without permission and one for unsporting conduct. Any member of Team A may shoot the four free throws for the technical fouls. The results of these free throws will determine if the game is over or going into overtime. COMMENT: Two technical fouls must be assessed in this situation. Otherwise, the team committing the infraction would benefit from the act. (10-4-1; 10-4-2)

Personally, I would rule the second Technical to be Flagrant.

[CoachP]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

Personally, I would rule the second Technical to be Flagrant.

Why?

[jdmara]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

Personally, I would rule the second Technical to be Flagrant.

Originally Posted by CoachP

Why?

Because in the OP, A1 tackled B1!

-Josh

[CoachP]

Originally Posted by jdmara

Because in the OP, A1 tackled B1!

-Josh

Oh..the OP yeah.

I read into it that BadNews was refering to the 2005 interp as that is what he quoted...my bad.

[Adam]

If it's a last second situation, like the case play, go with two Ts (one flagrant). If it's not, go with one flagrant T. Each T you assess gets assessed indirectly to the HC for good measure.

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

If it's a last second situation, like the case play, go with two Ts (one flagrant). If it's not, go with one flagrant T. Each T you assess gets assessed indirectly to the HC for good measure.

Heck, you could also assess a direct T to the coach for "allowing a DQ'd player to participate" (or whatever the specific wording is).

That way, the coach could accompany the player to the locker room.

[tjones1]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

If it's a last second situation, like the case play, go with two Ts (one flagrant). If it's not, go with one flagrant T. Each T you assess gets assessed indirectly to the HC for good measure.

I think you have to at least go with two Ts. One for entering the court without permission and the other for the unsporting action (which would be flagrant).

You could certainly make an argument for 10-5-3, as Bob said.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by tjones1

I think you have to at least go with two Ts. One for entering the court without permission and the other for the unsporting action (which would be flagrant).

You could certainly make an argument for 10-5-3, as Bob said.

My understanding is that with one act, they generally want us to call one foul. The case play addresses a very specific situation where calling one foul would allow the offending team to gain an advantage by that foul; thus they give us leeway to call 2. I don't see that here, so I think in most situations a single flagrant would be enough.

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by tjones1

I think you have to at least go with two Ts. One for entering the court without permission and the other for the unsporting action (which would be flagrant).

If we're discussing the OP ("B6 tackles A1"), then I agree. If we're discussing the case play (B6 blocks the shot), then I don't think it qualifies as flagrant.

You could certainly make an argument for 10-5-3, as Bob said.

I think you need to check your humor plug-in.

The only way I'd issue a direct to the coach on this is if s/he said "go in and block that shot."

[just another ref]

If you go with two Ts, what's the difference if one is flagrant or not?

[Adam]

Originally Posted by just another ref

If you go with two Ts, what's the difference if one is flagrant or not?

Maybe nothing. Maybe state sanctions for fighting. The point is, I think, that the tackle needs to be labeled flagrant simply because it is a flagrant foul.

[SmokeEater]

Originally Posted by just another ref

If you go with two Ts, what's the difference if one is flagrant or not?

In the interp it was mentioned that there is an advantage if 2 T's are not called in this example? Since team B was up by 3 then only calling 1 T will only give team A 2 shots, even if flagrant the game was over in the interp.

In the OP you could go withthe 1 T and make it a flagrant for the tackle, then A would get the ball back again since it does not say if its the end of the game or not.

[Adam]

In the case play, A6 does not foul the shooter, he only blocks the shot.