Az Missed Dunk.....Travel
 

Anyone see this play in the Arizona game?

Player goes in for a "routine dunk" and the ball doesn't go all the way through the net but bounces off his body/shoulder and goes back-up through the top of the basket. Utah player "rebounds" the ball about six feet from the basket and kinda doesn't know what to do with it. His teammate and he just stand there and look at each other for an awkward few seconds. The rebounder then takes a few steps. TWEET!!!

Most of the players were transitioning to the other end of the court and weren't paying attention. The new T missed it for some reason. C is all over it and comes from mid-court and properly gives the traveling signal. Good call on an awkward situation.

PS - Actually good camera work and announcing too - props to CBS in this case.

:eek: Wow that was an interesting play. You can watch it by going here and then clicking on "Brackets / Games On Demand" and then the Arizona / Utah game and then click Highlights. It is near the end at with 0:38 left in the game.

The Trail (not really the "old" trail b/c the play never ended) was the one that called the travel. It also should have been a travel on the Utah player not the Arizona player but what a great job by the trail official.

Thanks for posting it!

Your right, it was the new L/old T that called the travel from mid-court. Unfortunaely, this highlight doesn't show it. The original call on TV was great.

And, it WAS Utah that got called for the travel, not Az. Great film, thanks for posting it.

Utah took the ball out on the ensuing throw-in so AZ must have been whistled for the travel.

The calling official on this now infamous play . . . none other than the esteemed Curtis "Quick Draw" Shaw. Damn fine call too.

Actually the AZ player with dreads catches the ball and drops it. Then the little Utah player grabs the ball, takes 2 steps, then dribbles. AZ should have taken the ball out under their own basket.

That's what I thought happened, but alas, CBS cut away......

From the ESPN Play-by-Play

All of the following are Arizona Players
<table class="tablehead" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tbody><tr class="oddrow"><td valign="top" width="50">0:38</td><td valign="top">Jamelle Horne missed Two Point Dunk Shot.</td><td valign="top" align="center" nowrap="nowrap">80-69</td><td valign="top"> </td></tr> <tr class="evenrow"><td valign="top" width="50">0:38</td><td valign="top">Jordan Hill Offensive Rebound.</td><td valign="top" align="center" nowrap="nowrap">80-69</td><td valign="top"> </td></tr> <tr class="oddrow"><td valign="top" width="50">0:38</td><td valign="top">Jordan Hill Turnover.</td><td valign="top" align="center" nowrap="nowrap">80-69</td><td valign="top"> </td></tr></tbody></table>

Shaw had to come in w/ something. He sold it well and bailed out his two partners, especially the "C" who looked totally lost.

That's exactly what happened. Of the 13 people on the floor, Curtis Shaw was the only one who knew what was going on. He blew the travel on the AZ player before the Utah player could do anything with it.

Confused
 

Wait, am I missing something? :confused: What did Arizona do illegal? Arizona misses dunk, teammate rebounds ball, and subsequently drops the ball. Then a Utah player grabbed the ball and traveled with it. Shouldn't the ball have gone to Arizona on the baseline instead of giving back to Utah? :confused:

Yes... The ball should have gone to Arizona OOB. I watched the reply about a dozen times, and the AZ player gets the ball and just tosses it behind him to the ground, as if giving it to Utah for what he thought was an ensuing inbounds. The Utah player definitely traveled with the ball. It was the right call on the wrong team.

The ball has to go completely through the net for it to count as a basket. In the case of the Arizona player's dunk, the ball didn't do that.

It was the correct call.

(Of course, I'm going by memory as I watched that entire game yesterday.)

I think everyone agrees that it was no basket. The question is who, if anyone, committed a violation. What was your idea about the call?

How is it the correct call? If you watch the video again, you will see the AZ player who caught it didn't violate. The only violation came when the Utah player caught it. He seemed a little surprised, like he didn't know if it counted or not. He then traveled with the ball.

Once again, I preface this by saying I'm going solely on memory from watching the game and I haven't looked at any replay.

But from my memory, I don't remember saying to myself the U of A player actually committed a violation. But I do remember that play happening and everyone just stopping and freezing cause they were caught off guard. That's when Shaw stepped in.

Don't Let The Bedbugs Bite ...
 

I'm not very familiar with three person mechanics, but could the new trail have missed it because as the old lead he may have thought the ball went in because, as the lead, he should not have been looking up at the basket.

Let me tell you a story. Everybody get comfortable. A few years ago, I was working a high school varsity Christmas tournament. I was the lead in a two man game, this is Connecticut, we use 20th century mechanics. As the lead, I'm watching some of the larger players jockey for rebounding position as a shot by Team A goes up from the top of the key. No displacement, nor illegal contact, is observed by me. Out of the corner of my eye, with my peripheral vision, I notice that the net on the basket "swishes", and the ball, continues it's trajectory after it goes "through" the basket, bounces once inbounds, and then bounces out of bounds. I wait for Team B players to pick up the ball that passed "through" the basket when some odd things begin to happen. A Team B player picks up the ball, and gives me a questioning look for a second, or two, before making the throwin to a teammate inbounds. At the same time I heard some "murmurs", and "grumbling", coming from the crowd, and bench area. I look at my partner and he's looking at me like I'm from Mars, not Mars, Pennsylvania, but Mars, the fourth planet from the Sun. So while Team B is bringing the ball upcourt, against no backcourt pressure from Team A, I decide to put some air into my whistle to figure out what the heck was going on. I ask my partner, who replied by asking me, why I didn't blow my whistle, and hand the ball to the inbounder, after the ball went out of bounds. I replied that it was a made field goal, to which he replied that the ball never went in, the shot was short and "swished" the net under the basket ring. I did get some compliments for keeping my eyes down as the lead from the next game's varsity officials, who were in the stands. And they lived happily ever after. Now, if you're all good little Forum members, tomorrow I'll tell you a story about a five second count that "magically" changed into a ten second count that ended up with a technical foul. Goodnight.

Except that no one on AZ travelled with the ball. A1 missed the dunk, and A2 rebounded the ball and immediately dropped it. Shaw blew his whistle when the B1 had the ball and it was B1 who travelled but Team B ended up with the throw-in.

All in all not a big deal but the correct call was not made.

I'm pretty sure A2 took a few steps, based off of my memory.

He did not.

Here it is, unfortunately typical crappy youtube quality

Didn't see this play before this clip....


What should have been called was BI on the shooter...A1 (Arizona).

After that, the A2 (Arizona) touched the ball but did NOT travel....he wasn't touching the ball long enough for his feet to have moved while touching it. The defensive player he flipped it (Utah) to did travel before starting a dribble.

While the usually sharp Mr. Shaw was on his toes in recognizing something goofy and illegal just happened, he didn't get it quite right.

While I don't have an NCAA rule book handy, I would think BI is pretty much the same as in NFHS where a dunk is legal and not considered BI. It was just an odd play where he cause it to come back out. But not BI.

"You are correct, sir" (Ed McMahon)
 

NFHS 4-6 SECTION 6 Basket interference occurs when a player:
ART. 1 Touches the ball or any part of the basket (including the net) while the ball is on or within either basket.
ART. 2 Touches the ball while any part of the ball is within the imaginary cylinder which has the basket ring as its lower base.
EXCEPTION: In Arts. 1 or 2, if a player has his/her hand legally in contact with the ball, it is not a violation if such contact with the ball continues after it enters a basket cylinder or if in such action, the player touches the basket. Dunking or stuffing is legal and is not basket interference.
ART. 3 Touches the ball outside the cylinder while reaching through the basket from below.
ART. 4 Pulls down a movable ring so that it contacts the ball before the ring returns to its original position.

Even though it was only a partial explanation do I still get a prize for this one? j/k

The BI was not for the hand being in contact with the ball/basket in the process of the dunk. It would be for, after he released the rim, grabbing the bottom of the net while the ball was in the basket (which is what caused it to pop out)....noting that the definition of BI doesn't depend on which team does it (meaning we'd be counting the basket had the a defender done the same).

No, because it was not relevant.

So you are telling me that had this ball gone all the way through and cleared the bottom of the net, and player A1's hand hits the net after he lets go of the rim, you are going to wave off the basket and call BI?

I am a Utah fan... (I did not see the game though) but this should have been Arizona ball.

It looks like everyone just assumed that the dunk counted, that's why the AZ player flipped the ball back to the Utah player, and then both Utah players were just dumbfounded and walked with the ball "bringing it back in"...

Right call, wrong direction...

No.

Agreed.

Granted we're talking YouTube quality here, but go watch the real-time speed of the dunk at the beginning of the clip, and tell me you, or any of the 3 officials, could have honestly seen him grabbing the net so that you would unequivocally make that call. I think it's borderline at best even when I watch it in slo-mo, never mind when it's happening live.

As for my .02 on the ruling: correct that the basket doesn't count (for not completely passing through the basket), but wrong player called for travel.

One other thing I noticed was that it appears to me A1 (the dunker) possibly was pushed by the B1 defender running down the court just as he went up for the failed dunk. L didn't appear to have the angle to see any contact on A1's back (wasn't his primary anyway so he'd probably pass unless he was 110% sure), but the C was running down court and in relatively good position that he could've seen it. The contact wasn't severe, but probably enough that I would've called it. The real-time portion almost makes the contact look intentional, but the slo-mo replay shows B1 swatting at the ball with his right hand and kind of bracing himself against A1 with his left.

Can't disagree with that...very hard to see....but it was what really happened.