Anyone here ever revoked a T?

imagomer · #1 (**permalink**) Tue Feb 17, 2009, 09:36am

In a game this wknd, I was asst coach for Boys' Varsity. One of our boys who has a tendency to foul too much had just picked up his 2nd and was walking back to half court as free throws were about to be administered. He was apologizing to the coach for being foolish; I indicated to him that this was his 2nd, and the coach shouted "Don't guard him any more!" meaning for this boy to switch men. The new trail (2 man) was just beyond and in line with the boy, so he heard the coach's comment, and was offended, thinking the coach had made a smart-alec remark regarding the call - you all know the type of comment - "well then, we'll just not play ANY defense at all, since the refs are calling EVERYTHING a foul. . ." The official gave the coach the stop sign and a stern look, and then interpreted the coach's confusion and gesturing as more offense. Next play, that official came table-side, and the coach cleared the whole thing up, and everyone was good.

Question - IF that Official had actually awarded and reported the T, and had been willing to discuss, and had been satisfied that there had not, in fact, been any unsporting conduct by the coach, could that official have "revoked the T?"

Anyone ever seen/done anything like this?

Terrapins Fan · #2 (**permalink**) Tue Feb 17, 2009, 10:34am

Hahahahahaha.....

Uh, No. Never seen a "T" revoked. Doubt that I ever will. I also doubt that some one would have given a "T" for what you described. JMO.

I can tell you that I "T"ed up a coach last year in the first quarter. The night before I had a coach all over me for every call and he was out of the box. I didn't "T" he but should have. I decided I wasn't putting up with tha behavior again. I warned the coach during the pregame what we were enforcing the coaches box.

In the first quarter he came out of the box and argued a call. I warned him to get back in the box and stay in the box. a minute later on a call against his team, he came near the table complaining. I "T"ed him up. He lost his coaching box. He also lost the game. The final score was about 60-12, if I had known his team was that bad, I may not have "T"ed him up, but he deserved the "T"

Mark Padgett · #3 (**permalink**) Tue Feb 17, 2009, 11:52am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Terrapins Fan

if I had known his team was that bad, I may not have "T"ed him up

Please explain why that should have anything to do with it. The T is based on his behavior, not the score of the game.

just another ref · #4 (**permalink**) Tue Feb 17, 2009, 12:00pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by imagomer

Question - IF that Official had actually awarded and reported the T, and had been willing to discuss, and had been satisfied that there had not, in fact, been any unsporting conduct by the coach, could that official have "revoked the T?"

Anyone ever seen/done anything like this?

I've never seen this happen. Could it? I guess so. TWEET Technical foul on the coach! What's that? Uh-huh. Uh-huh. Well, okay. Never mind. No T.

Could anything make an official look much worse? Probably not. Can you be absolutely certain what happened on every call you make? No. In a case like this, you need to be certain or not make a call.

BayStateRef · #5 (**permalink**) Tue Feb 17, 2009, 12:09pm

I have revoked a T. I had a varsity game with "co-coaches" -- a man and a woman. In the first half, both coaches were standing and I told the man that only the head coach could stand and there could be only one head coach. A few minutes later, the woman is standing and I issue a T for the assistant being up.

When I go to report, the man asks me why the T. He tells me that she is the "head coach" today and that he is the assistant. He said that after my "warning," they agreed she would be the head coach. He had not stood since my "warning," so I revoked the T.

When the other team's coach asked what happened, I told him: I issued a T for the assistant standing, but I since learned she was today's head coach, revoked the T and used POI to put the ball back in play. He accepted that.

I have since become much, much more careful when I have games with co-coaches. I make certain that we identify the one coach that will be the head coach for that game -- and make sure the coaches know before the game starts.

Spence · #6 (**permalink**) Tue Feb 17, 2009, 12:39pm

Had my partner gotten together with me after whacking a kid for slapping the backboard on an obvious block attempt we would have revoked the T. However, he immediately reported it and THEN told me he realized as soon as he blew his whistle that it was a clean play.

fullor30 · #7 (**permalink**) Tue Feb 17, 2009, 12:41pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by imagomer

In a game this wknd, I was asst coach for Boys' Varsity. One of our boys who has a tendency to foul too much had just picked up his 2nd and was walking back to half court as free throws were about to be administered. He was apologizing to the coach for being foolish; I indicated to him that this was his 2nd, and the coach shouted "Don't guard him any more!" meaning for this boy to switch men. The new trail (2 man) was just beyond and in line with the boy, so he heard the coach's comment, and was offended, thinking the coach had made a smart-alec remark regarding the call - you all know the type of comment - "well then, we'll just not play ANY defense at all, since the refs are calling EVERYTHING a foul. . ." The official gave the coach the stop sign and a stern look, and then interpreted the coach's confusion and gesturing as more offense. Next play, that official came table-side, and the coach cleared the whole thing up, and everyone was good.

Question - IF that Official had actually awarded and reported the T, and had been willing to discuss, and had been satisfied that there had not, in fact, been any unsporting conduct by the coach, could that official have "revoked the T?"

Anyone ever seen/done anything like this?

A card laid is a card played I always say.

That said, I try and leave no doubt as to a deserving whack.

JRutledge · #8 (**permalink**) Tue Feb 17, 2009, 12:45pm

I have never revoked a T or seen this happen, but I am sure it could under the right circumstances. For example, giving a T for some administrative reason only to find out later that there was no violation of the rules. But for conduct situation, I cannot see anyone taking that back. Nor would I advocate such an action.

Peace

Shades of Gray · #9 (**permalink**) Tue Feb 17, 2009, 12:59pm

I have twice seen Ts revoked, once in a men's rec league game and once in a boys varsity game. The rec league T came after the ref made a call and turned to report it. At that point a spectator threw the ball back to the ref, hitting him in the back of the head. When the ref wheeled around and saw a player laughing, he immediately signaled a T and ejected the player from the game thinking that the player had thrown the ball at him. Fortunately, his partner had witnessed the indicident and after a conference with both coaches, both the T and the ejection were revoked.

Second time was an administrative T for having the wrong number in the scorebook. After the T was called the Visitor's coach showed the book that they had submitted to the official scorekeeper, who had copied down a number wrong. After this was shown and the official scorekeeper agreed the error was his, this T was also revoked and play continued.

Not sure if either of these are allowed by rule, but the outcome seems equitable in both cases.

JugglingReferee · #10 (**permalink**) Tue Feb 17, 2009, 01:06pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shades of Gray

Second time was an administrative T for having the wrong number in the scorebook. After the T was called the Visitor's coach showed the book that they had submitted to the official scorekeeper, who had copied down a number wrong. After this was shown and the official scorekeeper agreed the error was his, this T was also revoked and play continued.

Not sure if either of these are allowed by rule, but the outcome seems equitable in both cases.

So many times coaches around here tell the table to fill in their team. If I'm around, I ask if the table would rather the coach do it. If they agree to fill in the sheet, the coach must confirm the lineup before we progress.

If the table does one team, then it's reasonable that they do both teams. Often in tournaments, the table only gets a break for those 12-15 minutes between games, so I make sure that they get that break. Also, this is when they get a chance to eat something - or visit the freshroom etc...

SWMOzebra · #11 (**permalink**) Tue Feb 17, 2009, 01:24pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by imagomer

...could that official have "revoked the T?"

Anyone ever seen/done anything like this?

Revoke a T? Wouldn't that be like "de-gifting?" The taking back of something you had previously given to someone? I would never do that, it sounds quite rude and I doubt Emily Post would approve!

mutantducky · #12 (**permalink**) Tue Feb 17, 2009, 02:46pm

I've seen it done in an nba game before.

SCalScoreKeeper · #13 (**permalink**) Tue Feb 17, 2009, 04:18pm

It happened to a friend of mine earlier this season! In his game he had a technical foul revoked and a common foul changed about 10 minutes after it was called.