Crab Dribble?
 

If you missed the Cavs vs Wizards NBE game today, there were some interesting events (some of which we talk about here). Look for it on ESPN. Here is an excerpt of a review:

LeBron James wants the NBA to take a closer look at what he calls his "crab dribble." The move, James insists, does not constitute traveling. A referee disagreed Sunday.

James was whistled for taking an extra step while driving for a potential tying layup with 2.3 seconds left, and his Cleveland Cavaliers lost 80-77.

``Bad call,'' said James, who compiled 30 points, 10 assists and six rebounds. ``We all make mistakes, and I think I got the wrong end of the bargain. I watched it 10 times after the game, and it was clearly a good play.''

Without raising his voice or getting particularly animated, James dissected the game's key sequence in extensive detail - even pointing out that he felt he was fouled as he released the shot, which went in. His biggest beef, though, was with what he considered a misunderstanding of the way he moved to the basket.

``You have your trademark play, and that's one of my plays. It kind of looks like a travel because it's slow, and it's kind of a high-step, but it's a one-two just as fluent as any other one-two in this league. I got the wrong end of it, but I think they need to look at it - and they need to understand that's not a travel,'' James said. ``It's a perfectly legal play, something I've always done.''

Indeed, Washington's Caron Butler - who scored 19 points and guarded James most of the game, including on that closing play - remembers that same move, without an official's call, from one of the teams' recent playoff meetings.

``I definitely knew he traveled, but I didn't know they were going to call it,'' Butler said about what happened Sunday. ``That was one of them situations in which a great player made a move, good officiating, and they called the call. And I was like, 'Oh, man, there is a God.'''
That was hardly the only contentious moment in a game between teams that faced each other the past three postseasons, with Cleveland winning every series.

…..Oh, and there was the ejection of Cavaliers coach Mike Brown, who ran nearly the length of the court to protest an offensive foul call against James with about 6 1/2 minutes left. The Cavs were down 70-54 early in the fourth quarter, then 71-58 after Butler made one of two technical free throws when Brown was tossed for all his pointing and yelling.

Ahhhhh Love the NBA...........

Maybe they need a couple games where there are no rules. You can walk, run, beat on the other team as much as you want. A no halds barred event worthy of the "Thunderdome"!! Two teams enter, one team leaves!

You know....the Thunderdome.....from Mad Max....Tina Turner/Mel Gibson......Master Blaster......

I hope I'm not dating myself with references to old movies.........

The last thing Lebron should want is for anybody to take a closer look at his moves.

No - if you referenced "The Great Train Robbery", to me that's an old movie. Or maybe not. ;)

If someone posts a video clip of the play that would be helpful and we could take a look.

It's on youtube. He looks like Jack jumping over the candlestick.

How about a link?

Looks to me like a poorly executed jump stop. Players and fans need to get this two steps crap out of their heads; it's all about the pivot foot.

Happens at the 2:00 mark of the video....and, IT'S NOT like Jack jumping over a candlestick.....it's a CRAB DRIBBLE! C'mon!!! ;)

I get it. A crab has 8 legs, so the pivot foot is a real mystery, just like when Lebron does practically anything.

My call is traveling.

Since I couldn't slow the tape down, so it took me a while to break it down but here is how I saw it:

1) He stopped his dribble (grabbing the ball with both hands) while his right foot was in contact with the floor.

2) He then proceeded to jump off his right foot.

3) He then landed on his left foot.

4) He then leaped off his left foot.

5) He then landed on his right foot.

6) He then leaped off his right foot in an attempt to shoot the ball.

Casebook traveling.

MTD, Sr.


P.S. What I really liked was the offensive foul for charging the was called against LaBron about a minute earlier in the game. He was trying to move diagonally across the defender and made full contact with the front of the defender's torso and knocked him down. The Cleveland HC recieved a free E-Ticket to the lockerroom because his protesting the foul against LaBron.

Fast and slow, looked like 3 steps to me...a poorly executed jumpstop.

Sorry LBJ, you are wrong on this one....they got it correct (unless the NBA rulebook allows for a pivot foot to be lifted and returned to the floor prior to releasing a shot).

That version of the crab dribble is clearly a travel.

You are CORRECT, sir! ;)

Someone posted an article on here a while back about NBA referees. They mentioned that the one rule that people don't understand is that the NBA has some other kind of criteria for traveling. Something about a rythym that they use. I can't remember it exactly. Does anyone else remember this?

http://forum.officiating.com/basketb...n-go-tape.html

It was from USA Today - I actually posted it. (Link above, article excerpt below)

Many fans believe NBA referees ignore all but the most blatant of traveling calls. But after countless hours of video review, Foster maintains that most of the time, they get it right.

The NBA allows a "two-count rhythm" after a player gathers the ball. But fans don't recognize that a player must have complete possession of the ball, and that the steps start after the gather. "In some cases that can be two very large strides to the basket," Foster says. "After reviewing tape it is often seen that what fans might have thought was a travel is in fact just an 'awkward' legal move."

At other levels of basketball, players are whistled for traveling if they fall to the floor with the ball. Not so in the NBA — as long as the player gains no advantage by rolling or sliding away from an opponent.

An NBA player is also free to rise if he gains control of the ball while on the floor.

There is an instance where NBA referees call traveling that won't be called at other levels. It's the "hop-hop" travel, when a player alights off a foot and lands on the same foot, i.e., a "jump stop."

A bad jump stop?
 

Yes, I think it is traveling too. It is three steps and it doesn't follow the "two count rhythm."

What I don't understand is this being referred to as a poorly executed jump stop. He didn't try to do anything like a jump stop - that description has me puzzled.

The problem is that no one really understands what the heck that means! I've never seen a detailed explanation of what constitutes a "two-count rhythm" and what doesn't. The rule is so vague that it is practically useless. :(

The NBA should change their traveling rule to match the FIBA rule.

I'm not a NBA basher, but there is one thing I know for sure: the NBA will not follow any other organization. Stern will never let anyone think his league doesn't have all the answers.

I know he wasn't trying to do a jump stop, but what I saw was him jumping off the right foot upon gathering the ball. Normally, we see this with a jump stop the way he jumped. The problem was, he had no intention of a jump stop so he basically jump stepped instead of landing on both feet and then jumping; which would have been legal.

Instead, maybe I should have described it as a triple-jump.

He may be the next Carl Lewis?
 

Now he can participate in two events at the next Summer Olympics, basketball and the triple jump.

Ya know, some of you guys are just wrong! How can you take a serious post and turn it all upside down? I can’t believe we’re talking about a “triple jump.” This is serious business!

I just checked the NBA Rule Book – Page 734, Section 126, Par 3.c. specifically states – “The “crab dribble”, if executed effectively by a Superstar* shall not be called during “crunch time” of any game, especially in the playoffs. However, said dribble shall be illegal the remainder of the time when not a playoff game or a team has more than a 20 point lead with under 4 minutes to go in the final period.”

Obviously, Lebron was correct and the refs misapplied the rule. ;)

* Superstar is defined in Section 125. (Look it up yourself)

Dude: crabs are decapods. Maybe that reinforces your point. ;)

ROFLMAO, :D

MTD, Sr.

This discussion about LJ reaffirms my opinion. "Crab-dribble?":confused: There is something to be said for the requirement of NCAA participation both for the classroom and court experience.

It's actually not vague at all if you own a NBA rulebook. It explains it quite well.

In short, the first count is when the ball has been gathered and upon the gather the first foot (feet) to contact the floor. meaning that if a player gathers the ball off the floor and lands with both feet that is the count of 1. if he gathers while on the floor, that is the count of 1.

The second count is after the first... obviously. If the player gathers the ball in the air and lands with two then he is allowed to pivot upon landing, as he has only completed a count of 1. If the gather is prior to leaving the floor then he has to land with both, due to the "two-count rhythm" guidelines and he is not allowed to pivot.

This is the same as the HS and college rule! I've said that for years!

The only play that is different is our "hop" travel rule.

They had former player and "expert of all things NBA" Jalen rose on ESPN First Take to discuss the play. He described what a crab dribble is and laughed as he said the "crab dribble had absolutely nothing to do with the three steps he took on his way to the hoop." I was actually kind of relieved to hear that basically everyone there, except Lebron, agreed, just as we do here: It's always a travel, they just don't call it. The only question that remains is

WHY?

Ben,

I still don't understand. Are you saying that if a player gathers the ball with his right foot on the floor and then his left foot comes down to the floor that his left foot is his pivot foot? I have tried numerous times to grasp this 2 count rhythm thing and I am absolutely clueless.

Jay, in the play you are describing count 1 is his right foot and count 2 is his left foot, he is now no longer allowed to progress any further without penalty.

All this talk about crab is making me hungry.

I've also never seen a crab dribble a basketball so I think this is all a mute [sic, just for mbyron] point.

Are you saying players are allowed to hop in the NBA? Because that's traveling in NFHS and NCAA.

What's really funny is they had just let him get away with a travel moments before. Then they call it in that sit. Bummer for LBJ

Agreed. It was 4, and possibly 5 steps total.

Thus it is no different than other travel rules in this situation.

Can you give me a specific example of a play/move that would be a travel in NFHS/NCAA etc... and legal in the NBA?

This will help your coach/player relationship......
 

From today's Washington Post:

"Cavaliers Coach Mike Brown, who was ejected in the fourth quarter for disputing an offensive foul on James, agreed with head official Bill Spooner's call that James indeed traveled on the possession."

Ouch, I hope Coach Brown has his resume in order.

This is the only place the "crab dribble" is legal.

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2288/...6d36a1e8_m.jpg

I Think I'm Getting The Hang Of This ...
 

Here's my attempt at a mbryon to English translation:

"Crabs have ten legs"

Actually, that's the biological order to which crabs belong: the decapods are one type of crustacean. No translation needed! :)

Funny that James even thinks it wasn't traveling:

Washington Wizards call LeBron James' 'crab dribble' traveling - ESPN

There's a charge called earlier where James traveled before contact - at least it appeared so to me.

The only thing different in the NBA is the "hop" travel, which the rule book states that a player is not allowed to alight off one foot and and have that same foot be the first to land. The rhythm of that is 1-1-2 meaning he can't alight off his left foot and the land with his left foot followed by his right foot, now if he lands with both, no problem.

As i have stated years before, there is really no difference in the pro and college rules in traveling. The only way it is refereed different, imo, is that referees at the college and HS level is that they call travels that are marginal or really inconclusive or too close to call or plays that look awkward, whereas in the pro game we are told that we MUST pick up the pivot foot and be 100% sure that it is a travel and if we don't know, not to guess even if you go "ohhhh! that looked funny". I believe that is why the pros catch gufff for quote unquote "they never call travels".

Well, I watched it about 5 times. And I counted 3 steps every time after he had gathered the ball in. Guess he didn't do well in math class.

It just keeps getting better here in DC.....
 

WASHINGTON (AP)—Add LeBron James’ “crab dribble” to the lengthy list of talking points in the Cavaliers-Wizards rivalry.

“I’ll have to check in my book to see what a ‘crab dribble’ is. I’m not quite sure,” Washington interim coach Ed Tapscott said with a smile Monday. “I do know that we don’t seem to get away with very many of them, whatever they are.”

James and the rest of the Cavaliers were given Monday off by coach Mike Brown, so the world will have to wait for more thoughts from them as to whether The Chosen One did, indeed, travel a day earlier when driving for a potential tying basket in the closing seconds of Cleveland’s 80-77 loss at Washington.

Referee Bill Spooner waved off the play and called the violation. Asked to clarify his ruling, Spooner wrote in an e-mail to a pool reporter: “3 steps on the move to the basket. Basic travel call.”

The NBA did not immediately respond to a request from The Associated Press to comment on whether Spooner made the correct call.

On Sunday, James said it was a “bad call” and that “they need to look at it and they need to understand that’s not a travel.”

In giving his take on what happened, James said: “I watched it again, and I took a ‘crab dribble,’ which is a hesitation dribble, and then two steps.”

Asked Monday if he knows what a “crab dribble” is, Wizards All-Star forward Antawn Jamison said, “I know what a traveling is. … I think we all know what traveling is.”

Washington’s other All-Star forward, Caron Butler, gave a similar answer.

“‘Crab dribble’ is when you, uh, travel,” Butler said. “That’s the hottest thing on the market right now.”

Turning to a more serious explanation, Butler said he thought James switched his pivot foot.“I couldn’t do it in AAU, I couldn’t do it in college,” Butler said, “and obviously I can’t do it now.”

AP Sports Writer Tom Withers contributed to this report.

... "Referee Bill Spooner waved off the play and called the violation. Asked to clarify his ruling, Spooner wrote in an e-mail to a pool reporter: "3 steps on the move to the basket. Basic travel call."

... "Asked Monday if he knows what a "crab dribble" is, Wizards All-Star forward Antawn Jamison said, "I know what a traveling is. ... I think we all know what traveling is."

So now we know who some of those unnamed "guests" reading this thread have been ...

PTI featuers Crab Dribble Tonight
 

Tony K thinks it's a travel and Bob Ryan says to let it go, quoting some NBA rule about a "two step rhythm".

What is going on here?
 

"Paul Pierce scored 28 points, but had a key turnover in overtime. Ray Allen scored 20 points, but shot 7-for-20. Rajon Rondo committed nine turnovers. Kevin Garnett had 14 points and 13 rebounds, but shot only 7-of-18 and was called for traveling in Charlotte’s decisive spurt."

Conspiracy theorists are out...... :p