Placing the ball on the floor...
 

Hey everyone,
I have a quick question that I'd love to get your opinion on. During a time out is it OK to place the basketball on the floor at a certain spot depending on what happened during the time out?

I know this is something that is done in the NBA at every timeout, and I'm sure I follow NBA refs to closely for what I'm doing (high school, NFHS), but I do like this idea for a couple of reasons:

1- I get sweaty. Especially late in the game I feel like I am putting too much moisture on the ball. I do whatever I can to wipe off the ball before the inbound, but I would like to just grab it and go.

2- I think it would help both myself and my partner, as well as the team know what is going to happen after the timeout. Obviously we all SHOULD know that, but that doesn't always happen, especially when working with inexperienced officials.

Thoughts?

2007-09 NFHS Officials Manual, page 5

0.1.4 Dead-ball Officiating and Communication
...
B. Time-outs: Communicate with your partner(s). If a time-out has been taken, indicate the spot of the ball before reporting the time-out. Get together if necessary to discuss a potential problem or action and put the ball down at the spot of the inbound or free throw if you must leave that spot. Work with the table at that point to alleviate any questions or concerns before the ball becomes live.

Timeout Mechanics ...
 

From my long version (rookies, first time partner) pregame:

When the ball is dead, we must be alive. Team calling timeout must have player dribbling or holding the ball. Both officials must know the game situation when play resumes following a timeout (team, direction, spot or run baseline, shooter, number of shots). One official at spot of throwin or free throw line with ball facing direction in which it will be put into play. Other official at division line, quarter for 30 second and three quarters for 60 second.

Also, from my local board's guidelines:

Grant/No Grant
- grant to team if teammate has player control, but not to opponent
after foul, do not grant until information is reported to table or disqualified player has been replaced
- grant to team if ball is “at their disposal”, but not to opponent
- grant only to head coach (oral or visual); be 125% certain
- grant to airborne player with possession; example – player with both feet in air and falling out-of-bounds
- grant to either team if ball is dead
- grant excess timeout; penalize the infraction
- do not grant during interrupted dribble

Signal
- Official signals time-out by extending arm/open hand straight up with simultaneous whistle
- Official that signals the time-out also reports the time-out to table.
- Report team color, # of player or coach requesting time-out, to scorers
- Report if 30 or 60-second time-out to scorers/timer

Court Position Guidelines
- Officials do not switch court positions. Official with “line responsibility” when time-out was called, will administer the resumption of play throw-in and should assume that spot after reporting the time out.
- If 30 second - one official goes to designated resumption of play spot and other official straddles division line, half-way between center circle and sideline closest to table. Both officials face the table.
- If 60 Second - one official goes to designated resumption of play spot and other official straddles division line, half-way between sideline farthest from the table and the center circle. Both officials face the table.
- Administering official - place ball on either hip, belt or back to indicate direction of ball.
- Warning horn - when warning horn sounds, both officials initially move towards each team huddle and verbally say "first horn" and put index finger in air; then move to resumption of play court positions.
- Final horn – Administering official will blow whistle before resuming play or use resumption of play procedure if teams are not ready to play.

My rookie season I granted a TO to a coach and was only 117% certain......I'm glad I don't work in your area or I guess I'd still be doing nothing but MS games. :p

If I have the ball on the sideline, I either set the ball on the floor or hold it in the direction we will be going at resumption. If I'm on the end during the timeout, I hold (or sit) the ball in front or behind me.
Eliminates the times during boring games when the teams come out of the huddle, and I can't remember which way the ball is going!

Our assignor here in our largest class level of high school recently sent out an email not to set the ball on the floor during timeouts. Not sure why, but he's the boss!

I don't like this mechanic at any level, NBA/WNBA, FIBA, NCAA, or NFHS.

Just my humble (:D) opinion.

MTD, Sr.

99 44/100 % ???
 

Typical rookie mistake. We've all made that mistake early in our careers. Who said that you have to be a good mathematician to be a good official?

Because he is full of himself. :(

People can certainly have opinions about they like and what they don't, but they shouldn't be instructing people not to do things that are permitted by the national federation/state association.

I don't mind people having a preference for one way or the other, but I think that it is over the top to adopt a "my way is the only way" attitude.

My experience is that people such as your assignor also tell officials not to make certain calls or to call plays a certain way despite what the rules say. I can't stand that. :mad:

Maybe he's an old timer?
 

I believe that putting the ball on the floor only showed up in the mechanics manuals, definitely the IAABO manual, just recently, although some of us have been doing it for many years.

So then it is fine to leave the ball on the floor at the designated throw in spot, or the free throw line then proceed to either the top of the key (30 second TO), or the block (full TO).

Thanks everyone!

NFHS from the 2007-09 Basketball Officials Manual: Sections 2.4.3.C.3 and 3.4.3.C.3 both state that: "If the administering official needs to leave the throw-in spot, he/she may place the ball on the floor at the spot."

NCAA Women's from the 2008-09 CCA Women's Basketball Officials Manual: Section 3.4.3.A.3 states: "Put the ball at the spot where play will be resumed with a throw-in only if spot is to be vacated."

NCAA Men's from the 2008-09 CCA Men's Basketball Officials Manual: There is no such provision in the Men's Manual.

FIBA Two- and Three-Person Crews: There is no such provision in either manual.

WNBA/NBA Officials Manual: I do not have a copy of the WNBA/NBA Manual but I have seen the officails place the ball on the floor per NFHS and NCAA Women's manuals so I assume that it is allowed per WNBA/NBA Manual.

IAABO: For those of you that officiate in areas that use the IAABO Basketball Officials Manual: The 2008-09 Two- and Three-Person Manuals has no such provision. The IAABO Manual is very very simular to the NFHS Manual.

MTD, Sr.


P.S. But I still stand by my humble opinion that it does not look good at any level and I would never do it and I would recommend to other officials not to do it.

You know, holding in your feelings like this is only going to hurt you in the long run.

You seem to be confused.

You wouldn't put the ball down and then go stand somewhere else. That is not the proper mechanic at this time.

In 2-man one official is to be at the throw-in/FT location with the ball and the other is on the intersection of the division line and the center circle (front for 30, back for 60).

For 3-man one official is with the ball at the throw-in/FT location while the other two officials are at that top of the FT semicircles (30) or on the blocks (60).

The mechanic of 2-man officials taking the spots of the free officials in 3-man was dropped a couple of years ago because the FED felt that it was better to have someone at the location from where play will be resumed.

Yes I do seem to be confused. I have always believed (and been told) that for TO's you are to stand at the top of the key (30) and on the block (60).

As Nevada pointed out; this just changed. I believe it changed back to the way it used to be, but I could be wrong.

The NFHS has flipped back and forth on the proper 2-man positions. The links below detail the history, but basically it was one official at the throw-in location and one at mid-court prior to 2003. From 2003 to 2007 there was no one at the throw-in location and the two officials took spots on the FT semicircles or the blocks just as officials do in 3-man. In 2007 the NFHS decided to go back to the old way with one official at the throw-in location as it felt that this provided better information to the coaches and teams during the time-out.

http://forum.officiating.com/basketb...mechanics.html

http://forum.officiating.com/basketb...mechanics.html

Personally I like the way we do it now. I like having one of us at the throw-in spot. It makes it easier for the teams to know where we're inbounding the ball at and easier for us so we don't have to go back to the spot after going to the block or the top of the key.

Billy,

I thought so too. But the IAABO manual does not allow the ball to be placed on the floor. It requires the official to stand at the throw-in spot with the ball facing the direction of the throw-in .. or if a free throw will follow, to stand in-line with the official at the division line. (Timeout procedures R, S, T & V.)

Ball allowed on floor during time-out or intermission ???
 

At our local board's October 24, 2007 meeting we were told that there were three changes in IAABO mechanics for the 2007-08 season:
1) Not Closely Guarded Signal.
2) Referee can delegate jump ball toss.
3) Ball allowed on floor during time-out or intermission.

95% of games here in Connecticut are two-person games, and we were told that during a timeout, if the two officials needed to get together to discuss something, i.e., responsibility for last second shot, that the official responsible for inbounding the ball, or administering the foul shot, could leave the ball at that spot on the floor during the conference.

Did any of these three changes make it into the IAABO mechanics manual? I've got this in my written notes, and it's in the archive section of our local board's website, but I can't find any other citations.

My memory matches your notes...which suggests that the IAABO interpreters were told about this change at a meeting or during a conference call. I was certain that I heard about this change at last year's interpretation meeting -- and I have used the mechanic in several games (including one just last week.)

But I checked the mechanics manual from last year and this year...and I cannot locate a reference that supports this mechanic.

Bay State and Billy:

Read my post from yesterday at 11:14pm.

MTD, Sr.

Exactly...it is not in the IAABO mechanics manual, yet Billy has it in his notes and I definitely recall my interpreter saying the same thing: if you have to confer with your partner, put the ball on the floor.

Conference with your partner, would you bring the ball with you ???
 

It looks like the NFHS mechanic was somehow communicated, and accepted, by IAABO interpreters in at least two states, Connecticut, and Massachusetts, yet was not included in the 2007-08, or 2008-09 IAABO Mechanics Manual.

Was was wrong with the good old NFHS mechanics? Why did IAABO ever get into the mechanics business? What's next. Their own IAABO Rulebook? Their own IAABO uniform? Oh, that's right. We did have our own IAABO uniform, back in the mid-1980's, gray jersey with blue collar, and blue pants. And then we finally came to our senses and went to the NFHS black and white jersey, with black pants.

Mark T. DeNucci, Sr: Regarding your P.S., if you were the administering official after a time out, or an intermission, and you needed to have a short conference with your partner, would you bring the ball with you? Also, I'm curious, does your 2007-09 NFHS Basketball Officials Manual mention mechanics changes involving a not closely guarded signal, and/or allowing the referee to delegate a jump ball tosser? Thanks.

Just so you know I brought this up tonight at my local association meeting, and was told that at a 30 second timeout we are to be at the top of the key, and for a 60 second timeout we are to be at the block.

I asked about putting the ball on the floor and was told that the only way that would be acceptable is if the ball is directly in front of your feet at your designated spot on the floor. (See above)

I guess just like a lot of things, it all depends on the local associations and the supervisors in your area.

Billy:

To answer your question, yes.

I have seen pictures of officials wearing the gray shirts with blue collars, they look sharp, :D.

MTD, Sr.