Has anyone considered this situation?

Before the new rule change for the 2002/03 season, the penalty for excessively swinging elbows was a T.

Now it is just a violation.

It would seem the defense would have an advantage now.
The defense could swing their elbows excessively and it would only be a violation. Well, if you do not have the ball it forces the offense to take the ball out of bounds.
This forces the offense to make a throw-in.

I know some officials may call a T if there is contact, but if there no contact it is now a violation on the defense, which give the defense an advantage (maybe).

Any thoughts: Am I all wet?

If a Def. player starts swinging elbows, he is getting a T for unsprotman like act.

bugman-?, pest control-?, bug eyes-?, you like bugging people-?, you own a VW-?, you collect bugs-?, OK it must be you just like the name. :)

I find it presumptious (sp?) of the Fed to assume we don't call that becuse the penalty was too harsh. Last ime I checked we are paid for our judgement, I think you can call it what you want, it has to be pretty severe and blatant to make the call. I can think of maybe one or two times in years, that I even thought, wow that is close to needing to be called. I just don't see this much, and I flat out don't think it is a problem.

I think the severe nature of the penalty helped prevent it, now it may get worse.

Brian, i agree, its been a violation in college and i may call a violation once in 3 or 4 years. I just don't see it except when there is contact. Then i have a PC foul. Usually a player swings when def. pressures and and it is usually one or two swings, contact, beep, foul.

It's consistent with another rule change they made. In NF football, there was only 1 face mask penalty and it was 15 yards. They felt that some officials were not calling facemask fouls because of the stiff penalty, so, last year, they added the 5 yard penalty. The 5 yarder is for grasping the mask but not jerking or pulling the player's head.

This year, they changed the clipping penalty. Any block from behind was considered clipping and it cost the offender 15 yards. Now, they've changed the rule to illegal use of hands if the contact is above the waist. It's a 10 yarder. Clipping is now blocking from behind, below the waist and is still 15 yards.

I never had a problem with the old rules. But they seem to think we do.

BkbRef,

I'm interested to read more of your thoughts on the football rule change. I've been wanting to see a distinction made between blocking in the back and clipping for years. It seems to me that the two fouls need differing penalties due to the respective severity of each. A block in the back obviously creates a tremendous advantage (unfairly) for the offense/return team, whereas a clip does the same, but in a very dangerous manner.

I think the Fed took a great step with the clip and facemask rule changes. As it stands now, the only 15-yd contact penalties that are allowed by rule are for plays that are unusually dangerous, which seems to be very in line with the spirit of the game. Just my thoughts.

jb

Hey - get over to the football board with all this clipping and face-masking drivel...this is a basketball board for crying out loud!!!:)

You obviously did not see any of my 16U AAU games last
weekend! :)

I don't have a problem with the changes. But some of the rationale that I read stated the changes were made because officials were reluctant to flag the major penalties. I don't think that's true.

Personally, I think any block at the knees creates a greater possibility of injury. I would like to see all blocking below the waist eliminated, even in the FBZ. Do you realize that if a blocker A1 goes low, the blockee B1
makes inital contact with his hands, and then the blocker hits B1 in the knees, the block is legal? That makes no sense. It's instinct for the blockee to extend his hands to protect himself. But in doing so, he legalizes the block.

BTW, think about this. Blocking below the waist is already a penalty. Now, we have a penalty for blocking above the waist in the back. Why do we even need a clipping penalty? Blocking below the waist is blocking below the waist, whether it's done from the front or the back. Throw the clipping penalty out. Frankly, most clipping fouls under the old rule were abovew the waist. Very seldom do you see a clip, as defined by the new rule.


DJ, it's slow on the board. Let us have some fun. :)

Football rules are harder than basketball rules, but football is easier to officiate.

I hear you Tony...I tried officiating football for a sort time, but it was really boring - probably because I was only doing Jr. High games, but after so many years of b-ball, I kept yawning out there all the time...so what do you think about the new rules concerning disqualifying a wrestler who uses a choke hold instead of just penalizing points???

It sucks! All you have to do is get to the ropes and the opponent has to drop the choke hold or get your partner to jump in and save you. Of course, while the ref is trying to get your partner out of the ring, the other two guys are are gonna double team you. And the d@mn ref never turns aroiund in time to catch'em! ;)

And then someone runs down the ramp with a chair, and it's all over...sigh...good thing Smackdown is on again next Thursday...we have way too much free time in the off season...

How about those folding tables that have been convienently placed under the ring?

"Wow! Look guys! Someone left this table here! I think I'll body slam someone on it!" :)

What are you saying??? You're not trying to say that it's rigged are you??? Never say that!!