Thinking about an "almost" simultaneous foul last season

[zebraman]

Just thinking about a play that happened in districts last season:

I am T. Ball gets passed to the baseline corner, just outside the 3-pt. line. A1 shoots a three. After he lands, but while the shot is still airborne, A1 gets knocked to the ground by B1 who was closing out hard and could not stop. I blow my whistle. I am going to call a foul after the shot. A1 is not in bonus so they will get the ball for a spot throw-in. However, I hear another whistle at the exact same time as mine coming from the C's area. The shot goes in.

I signal a three and count the shot and then run to the C. He says he has an off-ball foul on A2 while the shot was airborne. After a very quick conversation, we decide that his foul happened first. We count the three, he reports the foul on A2 and we give the ball to team B for a throw-in.

Just curious how many of you would have chosen the simultaneous foul and reported both fouls followed by POI?

Thanks in advance.

[Nevadaref]

Originally Posted by zebraman

Just thinking about a play that happened in districts last season:

I am T. Ball gets passed to the baseline corner, just outside the 3-pt. line. A1 shoots a three. After he lands, but while the shot is still airborne, A1 gets knocked to the ground by B1 who was closing out hard and could not stop. I blow my whistle. I am going to call a foul after the shot. A1 is not in bonus so they will get the ball for a spot throw-in. However, I hear another whistle at the exact same time as mine coming from the C's area. The shot goes in.

I signal a three and count the shot and then run to the C. He says he has an off-ball foul on A2 while the shot was airborne. After a very quick conversation, we decide that his foul happened first. We count the three, he reports the foul on A2 and we give the ball to team B for a throw-in.

Just curious how many of you would have chosen the simultaneous foul and reported both fouls followed by POI?

Thanks in advance.

1. How did you decide which foul happened first since each of you were looking in a different area and couldn't possibly have seen both events?

2. Yep, simultaneous foul, penalize both players for their wrong-doing and resume the game at the POI.

[zebraman]

Nevadaref,

The C was felt that he could see some of the action in the corner through the foul that he called and he felt that his happened first. It was very, very close. In my long and mediocre career, I have never called a simultaneous foul or a multiple foul and was just curious if others would have. A college assignors that I used to work for would NEVER want a simultaneous foul in that sitch and I was just curious on other opinions, that's all.

[Nevadaref]

So the "college" assignor mentality is to give one player a free shot at another kid? That's a good way to get one player to feel that he isn't being properly protected and that leads to retaliation and fights. I guess I don't agree with Mr. College Assignor.

It sounds from your description that the contact against the player who just took the shot was severe enough that it shouldn't be ignored. Hence your decision to call a foul in the first place.
So what we have is a play in which the timing is very close and a player who clearly got whacked. For game control, I think that you are better off not splitting hairs or even thinking about calling an intentional foul, but simply penalizing both kids by going with the simultaneous foul. Afterall, it clearly qualifies as the two fouls did occur "at approximately the same time."

[Dan_ref]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

So the "college" assignor mentality is to give one player a free shot at another kid? That's a good way to get one player to feel that he isn't being properly protected and that leads to retaliation and fights. I guess I don't agree with Mr. College Assignor.

This makes absolutely no sense at all.

Simultaneous fouls mean they happen at the same time. Unless one of the 2 players can predict the future (there will be a foul by an opponent and his own foul will be ignored) no one is getting a free shot at anything.

[Nevadaref]

Originally Posted by Dan_ref

This makes absolutely no sense at all.

Simultaneous fouls mean they happen at APPROXIMATELY the same time. Unless one of the 2 players can predict the future (there will be a foul by an opponent and his own foul will be ignored) no one is getting a free shot at anything.

Fixed it for you, and that's according to the rules book. Hope it makes sense to you now.