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-   -   Why officiate? and rules question (https://forum.officiating.com/basketball/4288-why-officiate-rules-question.html)

utex Sun Mar 03, 2002 12:51pm

Hey guys. I am interested in officiating, and I'm not sure why. Why did you guys choose to become officials? What do you like about your jobs, and how do you handle coaches, players and fans criticism?
Also, I was watching the Texas vs. Iowa St. game last night, and an Iowa St. player was intentionally fouled, but still made the shot. The officials counted the basket and gave him 2 FTs and the ball. It should have been one shot and the ball, correct?

bigwhistle Sun Mar 03, 2002 12:55pm

Trust the official in the game utex. There is a reason he is there and you are not yet there. That reason is that he knows the rules.

Any intentional foul carries a 2 shot penalty, regardless of what happens on the shot.

ref5678 Sun Mar 03, 2002 01:51pm

Why do we officiate? For some of us it's to give something back to our community, and back to the sports they love. Others they just have to much free time.

Mark Padgett Sun Mar 03, 2002 02:22pm

Quote:

Originally posted by bigwhistle
Trust the official in the game utex. There is a reason he is there and you are not yet there. That reason is that he knows the rules.

Any intentional foul carries a 2 shot penalty, regardless of what happens on the shot.

Maybe under NCAA rules, but not under NF. An intentional foul on a shooter who misses a 3 point attempt is 3 shots and the ball.

JRutledge Sun Mar 03, 2002 02:45pm

Why I officiate?
 
I officiate because I am still a very competitive person by nature. I was not a "great" athlete but a decent one. I played Football, Basketball and Baseball since I was a kid and thru High School. I am a huge sports fan that can have an extensive talk about most major sports in both college and pro and HS. I had been looking for some way to get directly involved in sports since I could not realitically play anymore. Then a friend in college told me about how he was a HS umpire. The rest was history.

I love the fact that you still have to keep your composure and still are required to perform at the top level. And in the end, I am the one that wlil be right no matter what. Now of course you must be prepared and make good decisions, but you word is final.

And finally I stay physically fit and healthy. I am probably now in better shape then I was when I was a teenager. And if the exercise keeps me healthy longer in my later years, then so be it.

Peace

bigwhistle Sun Mar 03, 2002 02:59pm

Quote:

Originally posted by Mark Padgett
Quote:

Originally posted by bigwhistle
Trust the official in the game utex. There is a reason he is there and you are not yet there. That reason is that he knows the rules.

Any intentional foul carries a 2 shot penalty, regardless of what happens on the shot.

Maybe under NCAA rules, but not under NF. An intentional foul on a shooter who misses a 3 point attempt is 3 shots and the ball.

You are totally correct MP. I was thinking along the lines of the drive to the hole where the player is intentionally fouled. But it is 3 shots for an intentional foul on a missed 3 point attempt.

mick Sun Mar 03, 2002 03:02pm

Quote:

Originally posted by utex
... and how do you handle coaches, players and fans criticism?

utex,
We need a baseline.
Let's first assume we have done our homework and we know the rules and the mechanics. This gives us a layer of security and self-confidence. This is most important.

Then we realize that we get yelled at for two reasons:
<li>1. We made a bad call <li>2. The complainers are ignorant.

For 1.> We go back study harder and work harder and take the abuse, then vow we will not make the same mistake.
For 2.> We realize that we cannot deal with ignorance and dismiss it... totally.

Good luck.

mick



utex Sun Mar 03, 2002 06:57pm

Thanks for the feedback. One reason I'm interested in officiating is that I grew up on the court, and want to stay in the game. Plus, its good exercise, and I'm not bothered by constructive criticism.
My main concern though is balancing time between officiating, work and my family.

BktBallRef Sun Mar 03, 2002 07:01pm

There's nothing constructive about most of the criticism we hear.

dblref Mon Mar 04, 2002 07:36am

Quote:

Originally posted by utex
Hey guys. I am interested in officiating, and I'm not sure why. Why did you guys choose to become officials? What do you like about your jobs, and how do you handle coaches, players and fans criticism?
Also, I was watching the Texas vs. Iowa St. game last night, and an Iowa St. player was intentionally fouled, but still made the shot. The officials counted the basket and gave him 2 FTs and the ball. It should have been one shot and the ball, correct?

Quite frankly, my wife got me into officiating. I have 2 sons that played soccer/basketball all through middle school and high school. I was one of those parents that "knew all the rules" and, to my embarrasement, was quite vocal about it. My wife did not even want to sit with me and told me to "put up or shut up!" and I did. I officiated soccer for 22 years (HS and D-3) and basketball for the past 7 years (HS). I simply enjoy it. It keeps me in touch with the game I love and the exercise is good (I am 58 years old). My only regret is that I did not start basketball when I started soccer. It never rains in the gym!

Dan_ref Mon Mar 04, 2002 10:42am

Quote:

Originally posted by utex
Thanks for the feedback. One reason I'm interested in officiating is that I grew up on the court, and want to stay in the game. Plus, its good exercise, and I'm not bothered by constructive criticism.
My main concern though is balancing time between officiating, work and my family.

It sounds to me that you are a prime candidate to at least
try reffing, go ahead and give it a shot. As for the
time involved, it's only as time consuming as you let it be, you can work 1 game a week and still be involved.
"Constructive criticism, well, you'll find out soon enough
if you've got the type of personality that can get beyond
that. But you've certainly hit on the top reasons why
officials quit, so you'll be going in knowing what to
expect. Which is good. Good luck.

Kelvin green Mon Mar 04, 2002 11:14am

In the NBA if this had been determined a "flagrant foul" (akin to the intentional foul) you would be partially right utex.... the shooter would have scored and would have gone to the line for 2 to make 1 and then get the ball.

Of course if I'm wrong with this one Drake will kick my butt.

Tim Roden Mon Mar 04, 2002 02:04pm

Why I officiate? Several reasons here they go. 1) money, 2) community, 3) friends, 4)basketball, 5)fun. Actually, even if I wasn't paid, there is no place I'd rather be then wearing a stripped shirt and on the floor when the ball goes up.

How I got into it, I wanted to officiate football but when the another season started and I forgot to make the contacts I needed to start officiating football, I made the contacts to do basketball and I have been doing it ever since. Now that I do basketball, I don't want to do football. One type shirt and more games in basketball.

RX Ref Mon Mar 04, 2002 03:39pm

Love youth sports
 
I officiate because I love youth sports. Because of my work schedule, I can't commit to coaching for x nights a week, or even the same nights each week. So I officiate, pick my nights, and I stay involved.

Mark Padgett Mon Mar 04, 2002 03:48pm

Quote:

Originally posted by Tim Roden
there is no place I'd rather be then wearing a stripped shirt and on the floor when the ball goes up.

In my state, if your shirt is stripped off you on the floor, it's probably grounds for an assault charge. :D

And no - before you ask - there's no such thing as an assault block. It's always a charge - that's because the assaulter never has legal position. ;)

OK, OK - I'll go back on my meds now.

williebfree Mon Mar 04, 2002 04:19pm

UTEX
 
I officiate because...

It is the best seat in the house.

I needed a fitness plan and I am too lazy to do it unless I am paid to get off my fat a$$.

I needed to test my ability "to work under pressure."

I look good in stripes. Foot locker wasn't hiring when I bought my shirts. :D

I love to "whistle while I work."

OK, so you don't like those "reasons"?

Seriously, I officiate because I enjoy the competitive atmosphere of the gym, the sportsmanship of most players and coaches, the challenge to learn the rules and wisely apply them to "manage a game" as fairly as humanly possible, the physical conditioning it requires to maintain good position on the court, etc...

Oh ya, the few $$$ I earn is nice too.

Give it a try and find out if it is "your call-ing"

rainmaker Tue Mar 05, 2002 11:15am

Like everyone else, I do it because I'm addicted. I started for the exercise, and the second income. I never expected to love it as much as I do. It has required more work of more different kinds than anything else I've ever done, but that work has paid off in every area of my life. I'm more self-confident, more organized, more open-minded, and a better parent. It's been the best New Year's resolution I ever made -- and the only one I ever actually fulfilled!

John Schaefferkoetter Tue Mar 05, 2002 05:36pm

utex:

That's great that you have interest. Keep in mind it takes a very special person to officiate. Create a goal, and that goal is what you shall strive for. First thing is first-Are you married? Do you have kids? That has to be your priority! If the wife doesn't mind you being gone many late evenings and does your kid(s) need your attention? Don't miss out on them growing up, as they're only young once. Is your job flexible enough to allow you to take off early? Now, here comes the fun part-How thick is your skin? You'll have good nights and bad nights, but your attitude and facial expression must remain consistent no matter the consequences. If there are problems, you have to take care of business. There is no room for ignorant coaches and abusive fans. You have to learn to handle each accordingly for the benefit of the players, not you, or the coaches/fans. That's why you are officiating, to enhance the educational values for the players. If the coach or fans step out of line, you have to whack him, or even have the fan removed. The kids will learn from it, trust me.

I had to retire, due to the demand at work, but it taught me lots of character and how to handle idiots, professionaly. I still prioritize kids and enjoy teaching younger officials and assisting them achieve their goals.

Good luck!!

JAdams Tue Mar 05, 2002 05:48pm

One Reason I Officiate
 
One of the key reasons why I officiate is the mental refreshment it gives me from my real job. I sit on my butt all day in front of a PC and a pile of paperwork. But when I get in the car headed for a game at night, the work light goes off and the officiating light comes on. I can have an absolutely rotten day at the office (you know... customers, bosses, etc.), but after running up and down the floor for an hour and a half, those frustrations are ancient history.

I come into the office the next morning mentally ready to go. This is an unexpected benefit from my avocation of basketball officiating, but it's real. Anyone else notice the same thing?

mick Tue Mar 05, 2002 05:57pm

me, too.
 
Quote:

Originally posted by JAdams
One of the key reasons why I officiate is the mental refreshment it gives me from my real job. I sit on my butt all day in front of a PC and a pile of paperwork. But when I get in the car headed for a game at night, the work light goes off and the officiating light comes on. I can have an absolutely rotten day at the office (you know... customers, bosses, etc.), but after running up and down the floor for an hour and a half, those frustrations are ancient history.

I come into the office the next morning mentally ready to go. This is an unexpected benefit from my avocation of basketball officiating, but it's real. Anyone else notice the same thing?

Yeah, I relieve stress by being on the court and behind the plate.
mick

bigwhistle Wed Mar 06, 2002 09:51am

Re: me, too.
 
Quote:

Originally posted by mick


Yeah, I relieve stress by being on the court and behind the plate.
mick [/B]
The dinner plate mick, or the AYCE buffet? :D


mick Wed Mar 06, 2002 10:44am

AYCE? Should I really ask?
 
Quote:

Originally posted by bigwhistle
Quote:

Originally posted by mick


Yeah, I relieve stress by being on the court and behind the plate.
mick
The dinner plate mick, or the AYCE buffet? :D

[/B]
bigwhistle,
Oh yeah.
The dinner plate too. If it weren't for late night snacks there are times that I would never get to sleep.
What is the AYCE buffet? (note: I ask this with cautious intrepidation. ;) )
mick

Mark Dexter Wed Mar 06, 2002 01:22pm

Re: AYCE? Should I really ask?
 
All You Can Eat?

mick Wed Mar 06, 2002 01:54pm

Re: Re: AYCE? Should I really ask?
 
Quote:

Originally posted by Mark Dexter
All You Can Eat?
<hr color = white>
All you can eat Buffet - Thanks, Mark.
<hr color = red>
Yo, bigwhistle,
Yeah, I'm very happy behind that plate.
mick




bigwhistle Wed Mar 06, 2002 01:55pm

AYCE = all you can eat :)

Mark, you act as if you were guessing.

Larks Thu Mar 07, 2002 12:34am

The Rookie's Take
 
I first got into it because of the work out that comes with it and the extra cash. Now, I am addicted and am staying with it because I am driven to get to Varsity.

What we do is not an easy job and 99.95% of the people out there dont have the Kahooney's to even try it. Even my wife thinks I need my head examined for actually wanting to be in sitch's where people can...and often do...yell at me. But the rewards are there depending on what your goals are. If its purely money, I'd say deliver Pizza. You can make $15-$20 an hour Friday and Saturday nights. If it's because you love the game and like the rush from successfully doing something few people can....this is your gig.

If it's because you want to meet old guys and hear their war stories....call Jurrassic....he'll tell you about shoe puking and pant staring and you'll leave this board wondering what the heck we are talking about.

Larks - Veteran In Training

Mark Dexter Thu Mar 07, 2002 01:20am

Why I started
 
Although I have no intention whatsoever of going to law school, I have always been a legalistic person - I read rules, analyze them, and quickly have a pretty good grasp of them, if not partially memorized. I have also always loved technology, gadgets, and gizmos.

One day before a JV/V game at my HS, I showed up early to play in the band (of 3 people). I asked the JV coach (also my history teacher - small school) if he needed any help setting up, and he said to sit at the scorer's table. From that game, I started learning the clock. I got a rule/casebook/mechanics manual from a friend over that summer, and went to work on the rules.

Then I started watching the game and actually understanding it. :D

Oz Referee Thu Mar 07, 2002 01:33am

No one else has mentioned this...
 
Lets face it - it's fun to be in power!

That's not the only reason I referee, nor does it explain how I got involved, but it sure does contribute. It's nice to know that while you are on the court you, along with your partner, have ABSOLUTE power.

Being a good referee is understanding how to use, and not abuse, that power.

Like everyone else here has said, refereeing keeps me fit(ish), gives me some extra money, keeps me in touch with the game and is damn good fun. I'll be honest, the confrontation, the adrenaline when you make a "big" call, the noise of the fans, they are all things that make me keep refereeing. But just as much of a buzz is the look on a 6 or 7 year old kids face when (s)he makes their first basket in a game, or runs the wrong way and scores for the opposition - those moments make refereeing fantastic.

Finally, I'm a much better referee that I ever was a player. I have the possibility to become a pro or Olympic standard referee - something I could never have done as a player. Also it is kind of cool for me to be able to go to pro basketball games and say to my friend "See number 15 for Sydney? I refereed his first ever basketball game". That's cool :)

JRutledge Thu Mar 07, 2002 01:39am

Re: Wow!!!!
 
Quote:

Originally posted by Oz Referee
Lets face it - it's fun to be in power!

That's not the only reason I referee, nor does it explain how I got involved, but it sure does contribute. It's nice to know that while you are on the court you, along with your partner, have ABSOLUTE power.

Being a good referee is understanding how to use, and not abuse, that power.

Like everyone else here has said, refereeing keeps me fit(ish), gives me some extra money, keeps me in touch with the game and is damn good fun. I'll be honest, the confrontation, the adrenaline when you make a "big" call, the noise of the fans, they are all things that make me keep refereeing. But just as much of a buzz is the look on a 6 or 7 year old kids face when (s)he makes their first basket in a game, or runs the wrong way and scores for the opposition - those moments make refereeing fantastic.

Finally, I'm a much better referee that I ever was a player. I have the possibility to become a pro or Olympic standard referee - something I could never have done as a player. Also it is kind of cool for me to be able to go to pro basketball games and say to my friend "See number 15 for Sydney? I refereed his first ever basketball game". That's cool :)

You and I usually do not agree, but I so much agree with everything you said. :)

Peace

Gochron Thu Mar 07, 2002 02:45am

I got into officiating because I love basketball and it keeps me fit, both mentally and physically. As far as handling the coaches and fans, no matter what you call you will have 50% of the people mad at you. So be it, don't take anything personal, and just have fun with it.

rainmaker Thu Mar 07, 2002 10:53am

Re: No one else has mentioned this...
 
Quote:

Originally posted by Oz Referee
Also it is kind of cool for me to be able to go to pro basketball games and say to my friend "See number 15 for Sydney? I refereed his first ever basketball game". That's cool :)
I'm looking forward to this, too.

Mark Padgett Thu Mar 07, 2002 02:00pm

Re: No one else has mentioned this...
 
Quote:

Originally posted by Oz Referee
Lets face it - it's fun to be in power!

That's not the only reason I referee, nor does it explain how I got involved, but it sure does contribute. It's nice to know that while you are on the court you, along with your partner, have ABSOLUTE power.

Being a good referee is understanding how to use, and not abuse, that power.


Whenever I feel a partner is getting "whistle heavy" (power hungry), I just remember the words of Ed Hightower. Ed said, "Be in control of the game without controlling the game."

If you can learn that distinction, you will have mastered one of the basic principles of officiating.

You notice I said that I think of it whenever I see a problem with a partner, not that I would ever get that way. ;)


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