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-   -   Massachusetts Handshake Update (https://forum.officiating.com/basketball/42238-massachusetts-handshake-update.html)

Scrapper1 Mon Feb 25, 2008 10:18pm

Massachusetts Handshake Update
 
Well, I worked a first round boys playoff game tonight. It ended up being about a 4 point game. Lots of fouls in the second half, and the losing team just went ice cold in the fourth quarter.

Because of the close score, we probably should've left the court right away, but the AD and a police officer were ready to come on the floor with us to observe the handshake. So we stayed. The game administration did their part, so my partners and I decided that we should stay.

After the handshake, we walk to the door, where a "fan" has left his seat and is waiting for us. He says to me, "How the he!! do you sleep at night?"

I turned to the AD and said "THAT is exactly why we shouldn't be out on the floor."

The "fan" then says, "Do you want to get f***in' laid out?"

We kept walking and I think the cop stopped the guy from following us. The game site administration did everything it was supposed to do, but this moron still gets to verbally assault us.

I am NEVER staying for another handshake as long as I live and if it means I never work another high school game, so be it. I will call the tournament assignor tomorrow morning to tell him exactly that. The only reason I haven't called yet is because I know I will end up yelling at him and it's not his fault.

NEVER AGAIN!! :mad:

Mark T. DeNucci, Sr. Mon Feb 25, 2008 11:44pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scrapper1
Well, I worked a first round boys playoff game tonight. It ended up being about a 4 point game. Lots of fouls in the second half, and the losing team just went ice cold in the fourth quarter.

Because of the close score, we probably should've left the court right away, but the AD and a police officer were ready to come on the floor with us to observe the handshake. So we stayed. The game administration did their part, so my partners and I decided that we should stay.

After the handshake, we walk to the door, where a "fan" has left his seat and is waiting for us. He says to me, "How the he!! do you sleep at night?"

I turned to the AD and said "THAT is exactly why we shouldn't be out on the floor."

The "fan" then says, "Do you want to get f***in' laid out?"

We kept walking and I think the cop stopped the guy from following us. The game site administration did everything it was supposed to do, but this moron still gets to verbally assault us.

I am NEVER staying for another handshake as long as I live and if it means I never work another high school game, so be it. I will call the tournament assignor tomorrow morning to tell him exactly that. The only reason I haven't called yet is because I know I will end up yelling at him and it's not his fault.

NEVER AGAIN!! :mad:


Scrapper:

I hope that you and your partners filed an official game report describing this incident to the MIAA.

MTD, Sr.

Back In The Saddle Tue Feb 26, 2008 12:05am

What a moron! But the cop didn't do any more than just keep him from following? That sounds like a threat to me. I'd want him cuffed and hauled out of there. :(

MadCityRef Tue Feb 26, 2008 01:05am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Back In The Saddle
What a moron! But the cop didn't do any more than just keep him from following? That sounds like a threat to me. I'd want him cuffed and hauled out of there. :(

Yup. See you in court!

mick Tue Feb 26, 2008 07:51am

Good luck with that, Scrapper1.
Hope everything works out.

Scrapper1 Tue Feb 26, 2008 10:00am

I just kissed off the rest of my tournament. I called the assignor and told him there was no way I was staying for any more handshakes. He said he couldn't use me. Fine by me. I wish the MIAA the worst of luck in their future lawsuit.

JugglingReferee Tue Feb 26, 2008 10:07am

Scrapper,

I commend you for sticking to your guns. I hope that more officials will see that this observing shaking hands is nonsense and the risk in which it places it's officials.

IMO, there is no room when threats are made towards an official.

BayStateRef Tue Feb 26, 2008 10:13am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scrapper1
I just kissed off the rest of my tournament. I called the assignor and told him there was no way I was staying for any more handshakes. He said he couldn't use me. Fine by me. I wish the MIAA the worst of luck in their future lawsuit.

I hope you sent a report to the MIAA. And you should ask the AD to do the same.

Indianaref Tue Feb 26, 2008 10:13am

Quote:

Originally Posted by JugglingReferee
Scrapper,

I commend you for sticking to your guns. I hope that more officials will see that this observing shaking hands is nonsense and the risk in which it places it's officials.

IMO, there is no room when threats are made towards an official.

It's complete nonsense! I too hope more officials stand by you...if this keep up, quality officials at this level would be rare, could mean more morons at the games.

mick Tue Feb 26, 2008 10:26am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scrapper1
... I wish the MIAA ....

Doesn't "sound" exactly like you, Scrapper1. http://www.clicksmilies.com/s1106/ve...smiley-052.gif

ma_ref Tue Feb 26, 2008 10:54am

At the risk of playing devil's advocate, do you really think that guy wouldn't have given you trouble if you left before the handshake? I'm thinking just about everybody here has been harassed by a fan at some point in their career as they left a gym, even before that foolish handshake rule was implemented this year. I'm guessing that dummy would've made a bee-line to the door a little quicker to greet you, rather than waiting for the handshake ceremony to end. Don't get me wrong, I'm no supporter of the MIAA - I never stuck around once for the handshake all season, but I think this is more of a security issue, rather than handshake issue. My biggest gripe with the PGHS was my personal liability should anything happen after the game was over. Now if that idiot had come onto the floor to talk to you while you were watching the kids shake hands, then that would be a different matter...

Based on what you describe this moron to be, handshake or no-handshake, I think he was going to give you a piece of his mind regardless. It's fortunate you had a cop there nearby, or it might've been uglier. What he said to you does sound like a threat, and I'm actually a little surprised that the cop didn't do something. I wonder if you asked him (the cop) to arrest the guy, if he would've, or if he would've played deaf and say that he didn't hear anything or that there was nothing he could do? On a slight side note, does anybody know if there is a law in MA (or better yet a federal law) that specifically protects sports officials from this kind of abuse?

Your best recourse at this point would probably be to fill out one of those MIAA forms and hope for the best. It's unfortunate that most people did not fill them out when they didn't stick around for the PGHS during the regular season (myself included). AD's didn't bother to request me to fill one out either, probably because it's just more paperwork for them to deal with. And as I understand it, MIAA had told MSBOA that they didn't see that big of an issue with the PGHS during the regular season, because they (MIAA) didn't receive many of those forms, so as far as they could tell officials were sticking around because they hadn't heard otherwise.

Again, I'm not defending that moron fan, or the MIAA, but I think this is an issue separate from the PGHS. Anyway, I'm sorry to hear about your conversation with your assignor. We all know there are plenty of problems with the way their assignors hand out games during the tournament, and I think this just highlights that issue.

Adam Tue Feb 26, 2008 11:00am

The fan wouldn't have been by the door if scrapper and friends had left the court immediately.

Scrapper shouldn't have had to ask the cop to arrest the moron, it should've been automatic.

Adam Tue Feb 26, 2008 11:01am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scrapper1
After the handshake, we walk to the door, where a "fan" has left his seat and is waiting for us. He says to me, "How the he!! do you sleep at night?"

"Naked, next to your girlfriend."

ace Tue Feb 26, 2008 11:05am

By waiting, for them to shake hands your giving the guy time to get up and get to the door. If the horn blew and your briskly walk off the court right then and there, chances are he's still clapping for his team and only notices you as he sees your backs clearing the doorway, and that point your not worth his trouble. BUT if sees you sittin out there on the court, he 's not got time to think about and then actually do what he's thinking about and give you a peice of his mind.

Sure some of the real nut jobs are still going to do what they want, but getting your butt of the floor quickly after the horn helps reduce the likely hood.

ace Tue Feb 26, 2008 11:05am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snaqwells
"Naked, next to your girlfriend."

OK, where can I send the bill for the new monitor I just ruined? LOL

ma_ref Tue Feb 26, 2008 11:19am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snaqwells
"Naked, next to your girlfriend."

That's a good one. Is it wrong now to wish some fan would provoke me so I can use that line?

Oh I feel like George Costanza waiting to hear the shrimp joke again...

rainmaker Tue Feb 26, 2008 12:45pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scrapper1
I just kissed off the rest of my tournament. I called the assignor and told him there was no way I was staying for any more handshakes. He said he couldn't use me. Fine by me. I wish the MIAA the worst of luck in their future lawsuit.

If every ref in every game gets abused, and reports it, maybe they'll see what you're talking about, but it's almost incomprehensible that they wouldn't "get it" after just this one. Quite simply, unbelievable.

Ron Pilo Tue Feb 26, 2008 12:46pm

Massachusetts Handshake Update
 
In Washington we get the heck off the floor while looking for the thumbs from the official scorer.......

sticking around is just foolish...

MajorCord Tue Feb 26, 2008 01:10pm

Question
 
Scrapper,

Does the MIAA require this of officials in other sports? Football, volleyball, baseball, etc. I realize the venue for those doesn't lead to confrontations like what can happen after a basketball game. I was just curious if this is something that they require for basketball only.

Scrapper1 Tue Feb 26, 2008 01:33pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by MajorCord
Scrapper,

Does the MIAA require this of officials in other sports? Football, volleyball, baseball, etc.

I believe that beginning next year, it will be required for the officials to observe the handshake in all team sports.

mick Tue Feb 26, 2008 01:46pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scrapper1
I believe that beginning next year, it will be required for the officials to observe the handshake in all team sports.

Good idea, ...for a game at a singular church picnic.

BayStateRef Tue Feb 26, 2008 02:42pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by MajorCord
Does the MIAA require this of officials in other sports? Football, volleyball, baseball, etc. I realize the venue for those doesn't lead to confrontations like what can happen after a basketball game. I was just curious if this is something that they require for basketball only.

It has been required in three sports: soccer, hockey and wrestling. The MIAA said it has worked so well in those sports to improve sportsmanship that it now will be required in all team sports.

It was supposed to be only "recommended" for this year's basketball season and a requiremetn next season. But the MIAA moved up the timeline and made it a requirement for this year's post-season tournament. Officials had to agree to stay for the handshake as a condition of receiving post-season assignments.

MajorCord Tue Feb 26, 2008 02:43pm

What about you guys that officiate other sports? How do you presently handle it? After baseball, do you guys high-tail it off the field? Or what about football? I didn't know what the modus operandi was in other sports. Here in NC, they have told us not to run off the court like we had something to hide. By the same token, they have not told us to observe any handshaking either.

Scrapper1 Tue Feb 26, 2008 02:45pm

There was also a second incident at a high school in the Berkshire region last night, also involving fans who left the stands to verbally abuse the officials.

mick Tue Feb 26, 2008 02:53pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scrapper1
There was also a second incident at a high school in the Berkshire region last night, also involving fans who left the stands to verbally abuse the officials.

gloat: to observe or think about something with triumphant and often malicious satisfaction, gratification, or delight <gloat over an enemy's misfortune>

fullor30 Tue Feb 26, 2008 02:53pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snaqwells
"Naked, next to your girlfriend."

I just soiled myself!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Scrapper1 Tue Feb 26, 2008 02:58pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by mick
gloat: to observe or think about something with triumphant and often malicious satisfaction, gratification, or delight <gloat over an enemy's misfortune>

Update: to present newly discovered information in a timely manner. As in "Massachusetts Handshake Update".

ma_ref Tue Feb 26, 2008 03:00pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scrapper1
There was also a second incident at a high school in the Berkshire region last night, also involving fans who left the stands to verbally abuse the officials.

Any details of the incident?

BayStateRef Tue Feb 26, 2008 03:35pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by ma_ref
Any details of the incident?

I haven't heard yet.

But I did find this report in the Berkshire Eagle (http://www.berkshireeagle.com/sports/ci_8365016) of the South Hadley-Wahconah Regional game that included this potshot at an official:
Both teams burned a time out and then with 8.5 seconds left, Lennon and Santiago battled for a loose ball on the inbounds pass. Lennon deflected the ball, the two collided and inexplicably, referee Tom Zukonski whistled Lennon for the foul. Santiago made one of two to tie the game, and Wahconah didn't get off a shot, sending the game into overtime.
The home team lost. I figure if the sports writer can take such a public shot, it would not be hard to figure a fan at the game might do the same.

mick Tue Feb 26, 2008 03:39pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scrapper1
Update: to present newly discovered information in a timely manner. As in "Massachusetts Handshake Update".

I gloatingly enjoy the U.P.dates.
Please be assured that I would like to see the officials' presence absent. :)

Scrapper1 Tue Feb 26, 2008 04:06pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by mick
I gloatingly enjoy the U.P.dates.

My bad. I thought the gloating referred to me, rather than you. Should've known better. Sorry.

Scrapper1 Tue Feb 26, 2008 04:08pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by ma_ref
Any details of the incident?

All I heard was that fans were on the floor yelling lots of f-bombs at the officials before they could leave the court. I don't know much more than that.

Adam Tue Feb 26, 2008 04:17pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scrapper1
All I heard was that fans were on the floor yelling lots of f-bombs at the officials before they could leave the court. I don't know much more than that.

Yeah, the playoffs was a good time to crack down on this policy. :sarcasm:

BillyMac Tue Feb 26, 2008 07:28pm

Wow !!!
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Scrapper1
I just kissed off the rest of my tournament. I called the assignor and told him there was no way I was staying for any more handshakes. He said he couldn't use me. Fine by me. I wish the MIAA the worst of luck in their future lawsuit.

Wow! You've got spunk. I have a lot of respect for someone who stand ups for what he, or she, believes in, even it it means a great sacrifice.

Our Connecticut state hero is Nathan Hale. With apologies to Hale, who was hanged during the Revolutionary War as a spy:

Scrapper1 regrets that he has but one tournament to give up for his colleagues.


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