Rule 9-1 art. 9

BigJoe · #1 (**permalink**) Mon Feb 18, 2002, 04:17pm

I have noticed this year that rule 9-1 Art. 9 which states "A player occupying a marked lane space may not have either foot beyond the vertical plane of any edge of the space(2 inches by 36 inches) designated by a lane-space mark or beyond the vertical plane of any edge of the space(12 inches by 36 inches) designated by a neutral zone.
isn't being enforced properly by most officials. I think the players (the ones I have call for a violation) think they have to actually step onto the floor in the lane prior to the ball hitting the rim or backboard. Also, the girls (for reasons unknown to me) want to stand on their tip-toe with their heel hanging over the lane divider. This call requires an expaination every time I call it.
Is it just me or do we need to make this a point of emphasis next season so all officials are calling the rule the same. Of course this may be the wrong forum to ask because all of us know the rules to the letter and would never misinterpret them.
Maybe you could ask some colleagues who don't read this forum what they think the rule is and how it should be called.

Keep 'em "straight-up"

Bart Tyson · #2 (**permalink**) Mon Feb 18, 2002, 04:27pm

Sorry, not my POE. I'm busy watching all the other stuff, illegal pushing, holding, etc.

bard · #3 (**permalink**) Mon Feb 18, 2002, 04:45pm

I called this once on a 5th or 6th grader who was doing the hokey-pokey. (Stick your left leg in...) He put his leg into the lane as far as he could without his foot touching the floor. It did look like the hokey-pokey! I had to explain the rule to the coach, but it was a no-brainer. I don't think I would call it unless it was really obvious and gave a clear advantage, like this case.

cmckenna · #4 (**permalink**) Mon Feb 18, 2002, 05:35pm

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"Also, the girls (for reasons unknown to me) want to stand on their tip-toe with their heel hanging over the lane divider. This call requires an expaination every time I call it."
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I see this in every girls game I have done as well... I don't know what it is with them. What I do is as I am getting ready to administer the FT I look at the feet and tell them to get them within the plane or it will be a violation. A little preventitive officiating....

mick · #5 (**permalink**) Mon Feb 18, 2002, 11:19pm

Quote:

Originally posted by cmckenna
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"Also, the girls (for reasons unknown to me) want to stand on their tip-toe with their heel hanging over the lane divider. This call requires an expaination every time I call it."
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I see this in every girls game I have done as well... I don't know what it is with them. What I do is as I am getting ready to administer the FT I look at the feet and tell them to get them within the plane or it will be a violation. A little preventitive officiating....

I gave U.P. explaining "the plane". I think the violators have all flunked Geometry. Their coach can handle that tripe.

mick

RX Ref · #6 (**permalink**) Mon Feb 18, 2002, 11:21pm

[ Also, the girls (for reasons unknown to me) want to stand on their tip-toe with their heel hanging over the lane divider. This call requires an expaination every time I call it.

and you go it was girls.

BigJoe · #7 (**permalink**) Tue Feb 19, 2002, 10:19am

Sorry, not my POE. I'm busy watching all the other stuff, illegal pushing, holding, etc.

So Bart, you are one of those trail officials on free throws positioned near half court who don't care if the thrower has his toes accross the line or the player "boxing out" the shooter puts a body on him as he releases the ball. Or you don't care if the person guarding an inbounds play reaches through the out of bounds plane. Or one of several rules that don't involve "illegal pushing, holding, etc" My point in posting this thread was that we as officials should be interpreting the rules that we are given with consistency. We don't have to like them and sometimes we certainly don't understand some of them but we have to enforce the ones that we are given. We also can't decide which ones we will choose to enforce.

Bart Tyson · #8 (**permalink**) Tue Feb 19, 2002, 10:43am

So BigJoe, you are one of those officials who is so concerned about a big toe touching the line that you don't care about the elbow to the face or the illegal pushing, holding, taunting, trash talking, ect. No we would not want to referee the game lets just make sure no one breaks a plane. I think i get a great look from half court. In fact i can referee the whole game standing at the division line. And if the coach says something, i'll change my call. God forbid someone would disagree with you about a POE.

LarryS · #9 (**permalink**) Tue Feb 19, 2002, 11:07am

Quote:

Originally posted by Bart Tyson
In fact i can referee the whole game standing at the division line.

Hope for my sake this was tongue in cheek or you will fess up to calling a very bad game from that point

. If not, I am a lot worse off than I thought.

I agree that there are more important things to watch and I also remind them before I give the ball to the shooter. So far the only violations I have called are the shooter stepping on/over the line, someone stepping into the lane and someone moving to a different space while the shooter had the ball. I am leaving alone the plane violations.

However, I also agree that if the players don't heed the warning I give them I am going to call the violation. I just check them as the shooter gets the ball, then concentrate on the other stuff. If I don't see a violator move with my periphial(sp) vision I know I have a call to make.

Brian Watson · #10 (**permalink**) Tue Feb 19, 2002, 11:52am

In the grand scheme of things who cares about the plane? I agree with Bart, there is more crap to worry about on free throws than that. If enforcing the plane will clear up all the rough play, then make it a POE, but I don't think it will.

We have had some awful POE's, and this would be in the top 5.

tharbert · #11 (**permalink**) Tue Feb 19, 2002, 12:41pm

During a FT, I look around the feet to make sure everyone is behind the line (preventive...) I just won't put the ball at the disposal of the shooter until any potential violation is fixed. Most of us don't like to make calls that require explanations to a coach. IMO, the point of the rule is to make us take care of player positioning proir to the FT so we don't have a violation.

Bart Tyson · #12 (**permalink**) Tue Feb 19, 2002, 01:36pm

BigJoe, I'll make you a deal, I have a HS game tonight. One of the teams is known to violate the lane during FT's. I will make it POE in the 1st. quarter. If i do this will you never, ever, beyond a shadow of doubt, assume so many bad things about me, promise, cross you heart, hope to die? Come on BigJoe, cat got your tongue?

BigJoe · #13 (**permalink**) Wed Feb 20, 2002, 10:59am

I agree with you about this call. I had a game last night where the girls were on their tip-toes over the plane of the block and the dividing lines. I didn't say a thing because obviously no one has said anything to them this season. I also didn't have the energy to explain why they couldn't do this to the whole team and then the coach. I agree with you about the importance level of a foot breaking the plane of a line. But as I stated before I just want to see the rules interpreted the same by all officials. If it is not going to be called no one should call it and it should be changed. If the NFHS chooses to leave the rule in than it should be uniformly enforced. Nothing bothers me more than calling something on a player and having them look at you like it has never been called before. Had to dish out my first T last night to a coach. Been doing H.S. Varsity for 10 years, I guess I knew it would happen sooner or later. I was just posting something for discussion I made a mistake in questioning anyone as to how they officiate. Its just the inconsistencies in our profession that bother me.

ChuckElias · #14 (**permalink**) Wed Feb 20, 2002, 11:54am

Quote:

Originally posted by BigJoe
Had to dish out my first T last night to a coach. Been doing H.S. Varsity for 10 years, I guess I knew it would happen sooner or later.

You've been officiating Varsity basketball for 10 without ever giving a T to a coach? Where do you work? Sign me up! Are the coaches required to take valium before the games or what? More likely, you are taking too much crap during your games. I know, I know. . . I don't know you or the coaches where you work. But I think the chances are slim-to-none that no coach in 10 years has said something to you that was worthy of a T.

Anyway, more in line with the rest of this thread, why do you care if a kid looks at you screwy after you make a call? The kids don't know the rules. The fact that they don't remember ever seeing something called that way is in no way evidence of whether they actually have or not.

And how many times have you had a player with tape over an earring say to you "Well, last night's ref let me play with it"? Whether it's true or not (and hopefully, it's not) is irrelevant. (It's still frustrating, tho, isn't it?

)

Chuck

RX Ref · #15 (**permalink**) Wed Feb 20, 2002, 03:16pm

And how many times have you had a player with tape over an earring say to you "Well, last night's ref let me play with it"? Whether it's true or not (and hopefully, it's not) is irrelevant. (It's still frustrating, tho, isn't it?

)

Chuck [/B][/QUOTE]

Had a player with a cast on her arm who said "last game the ref let me play with it"- I looked in the scorebook and she was right.
unbelievable.