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Old Tue Feb 12, 2008, 11:36pm
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Ball!ball!ball!

I'm new to the forum and will appreciate any feedback on this topic: At the yearly state rules meeting, we (refs and coaches alike) are told about disconcertion. Specifically, not allowing players to yell "BALL!BALL!BALL!DEAD!DEAD!DEAD!" repeatedly at an offensive player. We are told that this is not basketball related and we should stop the game, tell the violating team not to do this and put the ball back in play at the POI.

Here's the problem: Every time I do this the players immediately look at their coach, whom has obviously taught this tactic, followed by brief argument from said coach who probably was sitting right next to me at said meeting. Coach tells me that no other ref is enforcing this. Are they lying? Should I let it go on?
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Old Tue Feb 12, 2008, 11:55pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blbrown71
I'm new to the forum and will appreciate any feedback on this topic: At the yearly state rules meeting, we (refs and coaches alike) are told about disconcertion. Specifically, not allowing players to yell "BALL!BALL!BALL!DEAD!DEAD!DEAD!" repeatedly at an offensive player. We are told that this is not basketball related and we should stop the game, tell the violating team not to do this and put the ball back in play at the POI.

Here's the problem: Every time I do this the players immediately look at their coach, whom has obviously taught this tactic, followed by brief argument from said coach who probably was sitting right next to me at said meeting. Coach tells me that no other ref is enforcing this. Are they lying? Should I let it go on?

blbrown71:

Welcome to the Basketball Forum.

First, disconcertion is a free throw violation and only applies to free throws. Second, who is tellling you that players can't yell "BALL!BALL!BALL!DEAD!DEAD!DEAD!" repeatedly at an offensive player? As annoying as it is, it is not a violation or a technical foul for unsportsmanlike conduct. What state is telling you this at its state rules meetings. I hope it isn't Ohio or Michigan.

MTD, Sr.
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Old Wed Feb 13, 2008, 02:44am
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Yes, they are lying to you.
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Old Wed Feb 13, 2008, 03:10am
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I swear I was told the samething by the vets too but it goes on in the games and no one stops it so I guess its ok. I always used to yell out weird things during pickup games and I still do. random words, butterflies, *****. stuff like that.

Last edited by mick; Wed Feb 13, 2008 at 08:14am.
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Old Wed Feb 13, 2008, 03:15am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lpbreeze
I........ *****.

Depending on the particular player's keyboard, this one might be illegal.
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Last edited by mick; Wed Feb 13, 2008 at 08:15am.
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Old Wed Feb 13, 2008, 06:47am
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Check the Links at the bottom of the page for more threads on the topic or do a Search, as this subject comes up often.

As has been stated previously, annoying = yes, a violation = no.

As a coach and referee, I can't stand it.......
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Old Wed Feb 13, 2008, 08:54am
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Regardless of whether it's a violation or not (it's not according to the Rules, but if your state wants it enforced that way then you should do so), the real question here is the coach saying it hasn't been enforced before.

IMO, this is no different than telling a player she can't wear illegal headwear, or an illegal brace on her hand, or any other "administrative" enforcement. You will almost always hear "nobody else has made me do that."

The only response you can give is that you have been directed to enforce that rule and that in your games it is going to be enforced.
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Old Wed Feb 13, 2008, 01:00pm
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Clarification

Nate Hampton from the Michigan High School Athletic Association has repeatedly told us to do as I mentioned in my post; stop game, warn offending team, put ball in play.
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Old Wed Feb 13, 2008, 01:48pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blbrown71
Nate Hampton from the Michigan High School Athletic Association has repeatedly told us to do as I mentioned in my post; stop game, warn offending team, put ball in play.

blbrown71:

Why am I not suprised about this incorrect interpretation from the MichiganHSAA. When the NFHS adopted the NCAA rule not allowing substitutes to enter the game until just before the last free throw of a multiple free throw penalty of a personal foul, Nate tried to tell everybody at a MichiganHSAA state meeting that the rule applied to technical foul free throws also. He stated that even though the rule book stated personal fouls only it really meant technical fouls also. It took an email to the NFHS Rules Editor to clarify the sitiuation.

I am sorry to hear the Nate is trying to impose a rule that does not exist. My next question to you is what penalty did Nate want you to impose for a rule that did not exist?

MTD, Sr.
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Old Wed Feb 13, 2008, 09:33pm
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This used just to be a jr. high "chickball" thing. Then it seemed to creep into high school girls games. Now I see it more and more in HS boys games. I hate it.
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Old Wed Feb 13, 2008, 11:37pm
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This past week....we had the BALLBALLBALLBALL!!!!!!!!
Girl who was holding the ball, didn't scream but said it loud enough for everyone to hear.....SHUUUUUTUP!

It was priceless, the girl screaming had no idea what to say back, she just stopped.
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Old Thu Feb 14, 2008, 08:29am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.
blbrown71:

Why am I not suprised about this incorrect interpretation from the MichiganHSAA.

I am sorry to hear the Nate is trying to impose a rule that does not exist.
What makes this an incorrect interpretation? Do you have an NFHS case play that contradicts it? The fact is that this guy says it's unsporting. I personally disagree, as does recent "tradition", but if Michigan wants to eliminate a HUGE annoyance from the game, there's nothing that I know of in print to contradict them.

And he's not imposing a non-existent rule. He's saying that this action falls under the rules for unsporting conduct.
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Old Thu Feb 14, 2008, 09:09am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by refnrev
This used just to be a jr. high "chickball" thing. Then it seemed to creep into high school girls games. Now I see it more and more in HS boys games. I hate it.
A lot of volleyball refs wear earplugs while they're working. If this becomes more prevalent, perhaps we'll need to start wearing them too.
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Old Thu Feb 14, 2008, 09:36am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scrapper1
What makes this an incorrect interpretation? Do you have an NFHS case play that contradicts it? The fact is that this guy says it's unsporting. I personally disagree, as does recent "tradition", but if Michigan wants to eliminate a HUGE annoyance from the game, there's nothing that I know of in print to contradict them.

And he's not imposing a non-existent rule. He's saying that this action falls under the rules for unsporting conduct.

Then they should be assessing a technical foul, not a warning.
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Old Thu Feb 14, 2008, 10:13am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stosh
Then they should be assessing a technical foul, not a warning.
Excellent point.

Don't confuse Scrappy by using logic.
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