Tracking down a wayward ball
 

HS freshman game, A1 goes up for a shot and B2 blocks it out of bounds, no foul. Ball rolls, bounces along out of bounds and into corner of gym. Who is responsible to get the ball for the throw in to be administered? The officials? B2 or a member of his team? Someone from Team A?

Race
 

First one there wins!!!

:D

I'm not going to track it down. This is one of the things we address in the pre-game captains meeting...that they please chase down loose balls and get it to the officials.

What is the penalty and the rule if niether team seems interested in tracking it down?

I wait for about 3 seconds, then I'll get it.
If it comes back, I say, "Thank you."

I will <b>slowly</b>, very <b>slowly</b> walk over and get the ball. I will then <b>slowly</b>, very <b> slowly</b>, walk back. I may stop in the middle of my <b>slow</b> walk and re-tie my shoelace. When I get back, I may re-tie the other shoelace. I will then verbally check with <b>both</b> teams to make sure that they are ready for me to administer the throw-in.

Repeat as needed.

The message sent is usually taken.

No. Uh-uh. I don't believe that.
Yer a barker, not a biter.
...And your shoes don't come untied after your wife ties 'em for you.

So I take that there is no authority to administer any penalty (and I have been unable to find any) such as a technical foul, violation, etc.

I ask because my daughter plays and is usually happy to run down a ball for the official (especially if her team is getting the ball :cool: ), but gets frustrated when the ball is sitting 6-8 feet from an official and he tells the girls on the court "someone needs to get me the ball" :( . Obviously the officials shouldn't have to chase the ball all over the gym, but a few seem to take it to the extreme then indirectly threaten some penalty if the girls don't run it down for them every time. :confused:

It's true, it's true......

I've used that a few times in big gyms with a lot of room at an end. They usually get the message very quickly when they have to stand around waiting for me to go get the ball.

Yeah, in a multi-court team camp with a running clock....:)

Somewhere in one of the books, the referee talks to game administration (or table) about ball chasers. I couldn't find it.
If I recall correctly, there is no penalty.

This is too much trouble. Just stand there. It accomplishes the same thing. Everybody waits until they realize the ref's not gonna get it. Then somebody will get it.

Personally, I usually just ask the closest kid to "help me out". Rarely do I have a problem with that approach.

Well, I'll ask a player to get it, but they usually do without being asked. I used to cover this in my captain's meeting, but it raised my total captain's meeting time over a minute. :D

It's not that I don't want to chase loose balls, but I believe my time is better served keeping my eyes on the players.

I also think it looks somewhat undignified having an official chase down a ball while everyone else watches. Of course, I haven't worked anything but varsity games for quite a while, so this probably doesn't apply to the 3rd grade game at the Y on Saturday morning.

Yup, that works too.

This is how I was taught too.

I usually just say - "someone needs to go get the ball."....then I just wait. Never had a problem with it yet. Of course, I don't work too many cavernous gyms either.

I keep my eyes on the players until my partner/partners is/are back in position. Usually by that time a player has brought me the ball, if not, THEN I will go retrieve the ball myself--if it's a rec league game with a running clock then my pace towards the ball and back to the admin spot is, for some reason, very slow ;)

However, I do have a buddy of mine whom I happened to work with last night who refuses to track down any loose balls. He verbally solicits help from the players.

To each is own, but definitely not something that can be penalized.

So true!

#9 When the ball goes out of bounds, it shall be thrown into the field of play by the person first touching it. In case of a dispute, the umpire shall throw it straight into the field. The thrower-in is allowed five seconds; if he holds it longer, it shall go to the opponent. If any side persists in delaying the game, the umpire shall call a foul on that side.

Definitely not?

What if the official says "Please retrieve the ball" and the player refuses. Something in the rules about not complying with an official's directive, isn't there?

(Not that I'd ever do this, I'd just get the ball myself and call three straight cheapies on that player. :D :D :D :D :D )

And we have a winner in "The Oldest Basketball Official in the World" contest.

Lets all give three cheers to EyeZen!! :D

MTD, Sr.

Just b/c i'm intrigued by Satan, lawyers, and Al Pacino.

Ball-- 1) rolls under the bleachers or 2) all the way to the opposite sideline--at no fault of the player standing next to you. You say "Please retrieve the ball" and then...

1) Player re-emerges from under the bleachers with a bloody gash on his forehead.

2) Player decides to sprint across the court and entire gym watches as player puts on the brakes to stop in front of the ball and his right knee crumbles.

I never run after the ball. I ask one of the players to retreive it for me.

Never is a long time.

Ball goes outa bounds and ends up 30'-40' away. Team A requests time and is granted. Both teams head to bench.... ;)

Okay, let me rephrase my answer....I dont retreive the ball during my games. Plus, in the gyms around here, someone will intercept the ball before it rolls out into the parking lot, 40' or 50' feet away!!!!!

Question for blindzebra:

Would refusing to retrieve a loose ball put one in the same category as one who works without a lanyard? :p

Hey BadNews, give me a call at work.

Tracking down a wayward ball.
 

I normally do not have a problem with such. On those occasions when I have had it more than once or twice, I will politely mention it to the home team coach that it is his responsibility to have a game ball ready for play and that I cannot properly see the action on the court if I am chasing loose basketballs all over his gym. That usually gets the message across. On the one time it didn't, I had the scorekeeper annotate an official warning for delay of game in the books. He got the message; although, he wasn't very happy about it.

The officials have one responsibility and one responsibility only: To observe the ten players on the court.

The game officials are not fix nets, or wipe water, sweat, blood, and vomit from the floor. Unless the game official is a medical doctor, registered nurse, or emergency medical technician he should not render medical assistance to an injured player. That means game officials do not go after loose balls.

Therefore, do not worry about (1) and (2) above. The game official was well within his rights to ask for anybody to retrieve the ball.

MTD, Sr.

My argument is not with the request. It's with the expectation that the player MUST retrieve the ball if so requested and with the possibility of a T if the request is not adhered to.

Bleachers? I'm not venturing underneath them nor do I expect a player to make that trip either. Something for game management to handle.

Ball across the court on far sideline? Me: "22, please go get that ball." 22: "No sir, coach says we don't have to chase down balls for refs unless it was our fault" So #22 gets a T for this?

The thrust of my original question, when push comes to shove, who is responsible and what is the penalty, if any? Is it the team responsible for the ball being "loose", or if no team is really responsible for the loose ball, is it the game administation? What if this is a tournament situation and niether team is affliated with game administration?

Our job is observing the players during a dead ball, not retrieving a ball.

Now if you stand there chest puffed out, gut sucked in, biceps flexed, holding your whistle in you hand while you wait for a player to get it...then yeah it's the same category.

We wait until SOMEONE retrieves the ball. Eventually, the kids will want to play and SOMEONE will get it. I don't chase basketballs if they aren't reasonably within reach.

Assignors pet peve...
 

I had let the players chase the ball down until one of my partners who is one of our top level officials told me that if I did that when our assignor was evaluating he would have chewed my *** out. His thinking is, the players are working hard (as are we) so we should go get the ball for them. Now if it gets to far away it usually finds it way back to me on its own, but the ones that are close, I try to snag myself, but the players usually get to those first anyway.

U.P. here, the players will get the ball 99.9% of the time. 0.07% will just not think and the remainder has a possibility of getting whacked.
I do not remember any partner asking a player to retrieve a ball. That just isn't a rule it's a an act of cooperation.

I've been under the bleachers, out in the hall and even outside when the doors are open. No, I don't like it, but I do it. But until there is a rule that tells someone to do it then I get the dang thing the 1 time out of a 1,000 that ball doesn't come back.

The thing that really bothers me is waiting on the sideline after a game while a partner retrieves the game ball that we don't need any longer ! Aaaaarrrrgh !! :cool:

Your assignor is an idiot. And your partner has no intestional fortitude.

MTD, Sr.

BNR:

I agree about the bleachers, neither the players nor the officials should retrieve it, that is game management's problem. But if a player says to me: "No sir, coach says we don't have to chase down balls for refs unless it was our fault." I am going to tell him very politely that he WILL retrieve the ball when my partner or I ask him too. If the player still refuses, I will remind him that when he is a player on the court he will follows all instructions that he is given by the game officials. Usually by this time the ball has come back to me, and the player's coach is complaining to me about talking to his player, at which time I will let the coach know his player had refused to follow my instructions to retreive the ball and that the player is to comply with all instructions that the game officials give him. If the coach tells you that he won't let his players retreive the ball, then I let the coach know that the next time a player refuses to retreive the ball after being instructed to do so, that he, the Head Coach will get WHACKED!!

MTD, Sr.

Why not whack the captain instead? :)

Can you provide a rule cite requiring the player to get the ball? Are you just going to pick someone out at random? Why isn't it the official's responsibility to get the ball? Is this just a "because I said so" situation?

"Just cuz" is often derived from common practice.
I know "the ball will come back", if we wait long enough. But I ain't gonna be standing there waiting, while my partner comes across the floor with the ball... for me.

Coincidence?
 

My partner and I pre-gaming tonight for JVG game. I told him about a few situations on the forum this week......and we discussed them a bit.

Two minutes into the game, A in forecourt, TWEET, foul on B1. Ball hits a foot and rolls the entire length of the court. I'm L, my partner is T. No one is there.....ball continues to roll......out of the stands comes a parent, who stops it and rolls it back to the division line to my partner.

We got a good chuckle! :)

So, you've seen Juulie ref? :D

Go track down the ball -- turn your back -- let something happen that your partner missed because sometimes covering 10 players isnt that easy.

AMEN!! For Brother DeeCee.

MTD, Sr.

It in the officials manual. I just read it this morning. Section 3.1 Pregame. It's one of the umpires' duties.

Rita

It's covered as one of the umpires' duties in the officials manual. Section 3.1 It is the umpires' duty to "Determine whether ball runners are available to retrieve the ball at each end if the court has wide out-of-bounds areas or is on a raised stage or similar platform."

Rita

Thanks, Rita. Glad you came along.

I will edit my post for clarity. It is the umpires' duty to "Determine whether ball runnrs are available to retrieve the ball at each end if the court has wide out-of-bounds areas or is on a raised stage or similar platform."

Rita

Good posture = cocky ref :confused:

Or good posture & no lanyard = cocky ref :confused:

There's a difference between good posture and looking like you are about to clap and say, " I'm here to pump you up!"

One is about being alert and professional the other about drawing attention to yourself.

You've obviously never seen my partner and me ref.

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