Block/Charge out of primary

[hbioteach]

I'm the R and the T on the play.
Jump ball. A1 passes to A2. A2 driving down towards the basket on the opposite side in front of the lead. I'm the T trailing the play. A2 dribbler contacts B1 at lane line and B1 falls to the ground right in front of the lead who has a good angle on the play. No call. A2 is then fouled by B2 called by the lead.

Would you as the trail come in and make the charge call? I thought a whistle was needed because of the contact and displacement but passed because it was right in front of the lead.

[rockyroad]

If it was one of those situations where you said "OH MY GOD, THAT'S A FOUL!!" then you should have had a whistle.

If it was more of "Oh, that looked like it might have been PC/block" then leave it alone and trust your partner.

[Nevadaref]

Let your partner live and die with it. You are not responsible for the whole court. That's why you have a partner.

[fullor30]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

Let your partner live and die with it. You are not responsible for the whole court. That's why you have a partner.

I disagree, If an egregious foul happens out of my area and I happen to catch it, I'm waiting for whistle, if it's not there, I'm grabbing it.

I also think I am responsible to some extent for the whole court. I'm trail and ball goes OB on endline and my lead is looking somewhere else for any reason and no whistle, are you going to let him live and die with it?

Semantics yes, but live and die might be a little harsh.

That's why you have a partner as you say.

[FrankHtown]

Maybe Lead thought B1 flopped.

You're maybe 40 feet away...partner is maybe 10 feet away. I think I'd trust my partner on that one.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by fullor30

I disagree, If an egregious foul happens out of my area and I happen to catch it, I'm waiting for whistle, if it's not there, I'm grabbing it.

I also think I am responsible to some extent for the whole court. I'm trail and ball goes OB on endline and my lead is looking somewhere else for any reason and no whistle, are you going to let him live and die with it?

Semantics yes, but live and die might be a little harsh.

That's why you have a partner as you say.

I am going to have to disagree with you on this. If a play is right in front of my partner and they had a good look, I am going to pass on that "foul" or contact as well. Sometimes we need to let our partner make calls that they are on top of. If they screw up, then that is their issue. If I am watching my partner's area and making calls, who is watching my area?

Peace

[Junker]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

I am going to have to disagree with you on this. If a play is right in front of my partner and they had a good look, I am going to pass on that "foul" or contact as well. Sometimes we need to let our partner make calls that they are on top of. If they screw up, then that is their issue. If I am watching my partner's area and making calls, who is watching my area?

Peace

I'm with Rut here.

[kbilla]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

I am going to have to disagree with you on this. If a play is right in front of my partner and they had a good look, I am going to pass on that "foul" or contact as well. Sometimes we need to let our partner make calls that they are on top of. If they screw up, then that is their issue. If I am watching my partner's area and making calls, who is watching my area?

Peace

I generally agree with this and subscribe to it, but don't you think there is an inherent flaw with this line of thinking? You aren't going to know if your partner had a "good look" until the next opportunity to talk to your partner...maybe he/she got straightlined, maybe another player or players crossed between him/her at the point of impact, maybe a bug flew in his/her eye...from the L for instance, you aren't necessarily going to know what kind of look your partner is getting at the play from C, they could be in textbook position and still not get the best look...I usually make the point in pregame that if you are 100% certain of a foul in my primary get it...don't guess, but if you are sure that it was a foul I am not getting into a pissing contest about it...just my opinion, but I think it makes us all look better...your point about "who is watching my area" is valid as well though, but I guess it comes down to the lesser of the evils?

[JugglingReferee]

Who's call is it, the popcorn guy's?

If it is a major contact, I have no problem with you stepping in. I like rockyroad's take - if it makes you say "Oh My God!", then take it.

[TheOracle]

Originally Posted by JugglingReferee

Who's call is it, the popcorn guy's?

If it is a major contact, I have no problem with you stepping in. I like rockyroad's take - if it makes you say "Oh My God!", then take it.

Exactly. That's being a great partner and keeping you BOTH out of trouble. It's also good for the game.

[Junker]

Originally Posted by TheOracle

Exactly. That's being a great partner and keeping you BOTH out of trouble. It's also good for the game.

I disagree. I had a game earlier this year with a very good official that I had never worked with. Early in the game I'm L. There's a one on one play on the C side of the lane. The defender goes down with a huge bang and I thought, "Geez, that looked bad from here." I talked to my partner soon afterwards and he had the kid taking a dive. I'm glad I didn't hit the whistle. Yes, there are times when you have to go out of your area, but if your partner has a good look, let them call their area. The reason we have coverage areas is because that is the area where we have sight lines and angles. When we go out of that area, the chances that we are wrong increase greatly.

[fullor30]

Originally Posted by Junker

I disagree. I had a game earlier this year with a very good official that I had never worked with. Early in the game I'm L. There's a one on one play on the C side of the lane. The defender goes down with a huge bang and I thought, "Geez, that looked bad from here." I talked to my partner soon afterwards and he had the kid taking a dive. I'm glad I didn't hit the whistle. Yes, there are times when you have to go out of your area, but if your partner has a good look, let them call their area. The reason we have coverage areas is because that is the area where we have sight lines and angles. When we go out of that area, the chances that we are wrong increase greatly.

You used the operative words "thought" "looked" ...not real positve. IMO you done good holding whistle. There has to be no doubt, which includes a good sight line.

[Junker]

[QUOTE=hbioteach] A2 dribbler contacts B1 at lane line and B1 falls to the ground right in front of the lead who has a good angle on the play. QUOTE]

You say it all right there. Lead has a good angle, why go in there? In a case like this, when I have a chance I'll ask my partner what they saw just to get an idea of their thinking. I would not phone this one in from trail unless you are sure they didn't see the whole play or if they happen to be straight lined for some reason.

[JugglingReferee]

Originally Posted by hbioteach

A2 dribbler contacts B1

Originally Posted by Junker

I thought, "Geez, that looked bad from here."

You thought? When you think you see a travel, do you call it? Just sayin' we gotta know there is contact. Seems like the OP knew there was contact.

I've picked up that PC call before and have had others pick it up for me. In either case, they're rare cases. We're a team and let's get the play right.

[Junker]

Originally Posted by JugglingReferee

You thought? When you think you see a travel, do you call it? Just sayin' we gotta know there is contact. Seems like the OP knew there was contact.

I've picked up that PC call before and have had others pick it up for me. In either case, they're rare cases. We're a team and let's get the play right.

I agree, but the OP also says that the L had a great angle. If my partner has a great angle they must have a better look than I do as T. I'm not going in on that one as there must have been more to the play than I saw.