Q from a 1st year: Control?

ca_rumperee

I used the term 'batting' because the definition of dribble uses it:

4.15.1 A dribble is ball movement caused by a player in control who bats (intentionally strikes the ball with the hands(s)) or pushed the ball to the floor once or several times.

ca_rumperee

BktBallRef wrote
See? You're confusing your A's and B's. 🙂

I assume you mean A2 all of which would mean it's still a team control foul.

mea culpa. I B corrected.... and will edit.

grunewar

"Before A2 touches the ball again, B2 grabs A2 from behind (as you might to prevent a layup)."

While I didn't see the play, seems by your description you could have called an intentional foul here.

bob jenkins

ca_rumperee wrote
I used the term 'batting' because the definition of dribble uses it:

4.15.1 A dribble is ball movement caused by a player in control who bats (intentionally strikes the ball with the hands(s)) or pushed the ball to the floor once or several times.

Keep reading down to Note 2 (at least in last year's book). It seems like the note applies to your paly and, as you have surmised, it was not team control.

BktBallRef

ca_rumperee wrote
I used the term 'batting' because the definition of dribble uses it:

4.15.1 A dribble is ball movement caused by a player in control who bats (intentionally strikes the ball with the hands(s)) or pushed the ball to the floor once or several times.

You quote the rule and ignore it as the same time.

A dribble is ball movement caused by a player in control...

A defender is NOT in control of the ball, so when he bats it, it is not a dribble.

Mark Padgett

Kelvin green wrote
Team control happens when you are dribbling or holding a live ball...

Kelvin, just to be accurate, that's the definition of player control (and you have to add the word "inbounds" at the end). You are correct, however, that during a period of no team control, team control is established when a player gains player control. Remember, there is team control during a pass between teammates.

rainmaker

grunewar wrote
"Before A2 touches the ball again, B2 grabs A2 from behind (as you might to prevent a layup)."

While I didn't see the play, seems by your description you could have called an intentional foul here.

That's what I was thinking. Completely avoids the problem of player control.

Nevadaref

rainmaker wrote
That's what I was thinking. Completely avoids the problem of player control.

Yep. 🙂

ca_rumperee

Back in the day, Celtics are playing. Someone drives the lane, but Russell swats the ball out towards Satch Sanders. Russell's 'controlled' rejection toward a teammate was common.

In the play I described, our denying defender clearly 'controlled' the ball (in the Bill Russell sense), but did not 'control' the ball in the rule book sense.

Word.

BktBallRef

Exactly. He can't "control" it to a teamamte. He has to gain player control himself to end team control for the opponent.

Nevadaref

BktBallRef wrote
Exactly. He can't "control" it to a teamamte. He has to gain player control himself to end team control for the opponent.

He can "direct" it to a teammate. 😉 That's the word that I would pick.

cdaref

Nice to see first years thinking through this stuff.

Spend some time with player and team control--when they start and end. That will really help you. 4-12 is a good start.

Good luck with the rest of your first campaign!