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[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by rainmaker

My suggestion is that you start letting a lot of these borderline travel go (equally for both teams)until another official gets critical.

My suggestion is that you ignore this suggestion.

There is NO such thing as a "borderline" travel. It's either a travel...or it's legal. Allowing players to score illegally is just wrong imo.

[jdw3018]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

There is NO such thing as a "borderline" travel. It's either a travel...or it's legal. Allowing players to score illegally is just wrong imo.

I happen to agree with Jurassic here. The play you described is not borderline at all - it is legal, and that's why you should let it go.

I'll also add that the only thing I think is worse than allowing a player to score illegally would be disallowing a legal play like has been described throughout this thread.

[rainmaker]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

My suggestion is that you ignore this suggestion.

There is NO such thing as a "borderline" travel. It's either a travel...or it's legal. Allowing players to score illegally is just wrong imo.

Okay, let me rephrase. My suggestion is that while kb is still learning to see when the ball was gathered, whether the pivot foot left the floor before the ball left the hand to start a dribble, how to determine which foot is the pivot foot, that he err on the side of only calling what he's 100% certain of, and not using 75% or 80% certain as his determiner. Focus on seeing fully rather than on calling everything. When he sees more clearly, he can call more consistently.

Does that sound more acceptable?

[jdw3018]

Originally Posted by rainmaker

Okay, let me rephrase. My suggestion is that while kb is still learning to see when the ball was gathered, whether the pivot foot left the floor before the ball left the hand to start a dribble, how to determine which foot is the pivot foot, that he err on the side of only calling what he's 100% certain of, and not using 75% or 80% certain as his determiner. Focus on seeing fully rather than on calling everything. When he sees more clearly, he can call more consistently.

Does that sound more acceptable?

Excellent rephrasing.

See the entire play and call traveling when it's there. If you know the rules and are still unsure, then you haven't seen the entire play and should pass even if you think it probably was a travel. Only call what you see.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by rainmaker

My suggestion is that while kb is still learning to see when the ball was gathered, whether the pivot foot left the floor before the ball left the hand to start a dribble, how to determine which foot is the pivot foot, that he err on the side of only calling what he's 100% certain of, and not using 75% or 80% certain as his determiner. Focus on seeing fully rather than on calling everything. When he sees more clearly, he can call more consistently.

Does that sound more acceptable?

What is highlighted in red above is not only acceptable imo but should also be the norm for all calls at all times.

The short version is "don't guess".

[kblehman]

Originally Posted by rainmaker

My suggestion is that while kb is still learning to see when the ball was gathered...

Simultaneously determining which is the pivot foot and when the ball is gathered is difficult for me when players employ the jump stop, especially if the ball handler is in traffic. Sometimes I can just tell by the look of the drive that he took one too many after he gathered the ball, but other times it's difficult to tell. (FWIW, if I don't know for sure I don't call it.)

Originally Posted by rainmaker

... whether the pivot foot left the floor before the ball left the hand to start a dribble, how to determine which foot is the pivot foot...

These I don't have a lot of trouble with. It's that pesky jump stop that's difficult for me to break down.

Originally Posted by rainmaker

...that he err on the side of only calling what he's 100% certain of, and not using 75% or 80% certain as his determiner.

I don't know if this is the correct overall philosophy to apply, but it's what I try and do for all calls. One of the things I mention to my partner just before the toss is: "Call what you see, but be sure to see what you call." IOW, if I don't see it, don't guess.