Double Personal Foul

[bigdog5142]

Team A has possession of the ball. A1 & B1 foul each other simultaneously creating a double foul situation. Team A had 5 team fouls, Team B had 6...giving each team 6 and 7, respectively. It the ball put in play with POI, or does Team A get their bonus throws. This is totaly hypothetical...but I was thinking about this today and didn't know what to do! I'm thinking it's still POI. Would your opinion change if Team A had the ball creating a Team control foul as part of the double foul?

[Splute]

You do not shoot on double personal fouls. Go with POI.

[Jurassic Referee]

Go to the POI in all cases. It doesn't matter what makes up the double fouls as long as they are double fouls.

[Splute]

Here is a case play from '06-07

4.19.8 Situation B:	A1 and B1 are engaged in extremely rough play in the low post area and the covering official calls a double personal foul. After the whistle, A1 and B1 use profanity directed at each other and the covering official calls a double technical foul.
Ruling:	The double personal foul during the live ball results in no free throws. The dead-ball profanity results in a double technical foul, again with no free throws. A1 and B1 have each accumulated two fouls toward their five for disqualification. Play is resumed at the point of interruption. (4-36)
	[See corresponding Rule Article for Situation 4.19.8]

Would your opinion change if Team A had the ball creating a Team control foul as part of the double foul?

Nope. But my opinion would change if neither team had possesion when the double foul occured. Go to the AP arrow.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by Ch1town

Would your opinion change if Team A had the ball creating a Team control foul as part of the double foul?

Nope. But my opinion would change if neither team had possesion when the double foul occured. Go to the AP arrow.

Yes, but only because POI here is AP.

[bigdog5142]

Yeah...that's why I included it. When there's no team control...there's no POI! It has to go to the AP.

(EDIT: Not that there's no POI...there's no team control, so you have to go to the AP...)

[Nevadaref]

Penalty Summary (Rule 10) 1 c. No free throws for double personal or technical fouls (point of interruption).

An additional point:
A double foul is not a common foul. A team-control foul must be a common foul. Therefore, there is no way that a double foul can be considered a team-control foul.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by bigdog5142

Yeah...that's why I included it. When there's no team control...there's no POI! It has to go to the AP.

(EDIT: Not that there's no POI...there's no team control, so you have to go to the AP...)

POI might result in an AP Procedure, but you still apply this to POI.

You cannot have a Team Control foul on a double foul. A double foul is only a double foul. Look at the definition. A team control foul only involves one foul.

Peace

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Ch1town

Would your opinion change if Team A had the ball creating a Team control foul as part of the double foul?

Nope. But my opinion would change if neither team had possesion when the double foul occured. Go to the AP arrow.

Your opinion is wrong. Nothing changes. It still goes to the POI. The POI is an AP. NFHS rule 4-36-2(c).

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

Your opinion is wrong. Nothing changes. It still goes to the POI. The POI is an AP. NFHS rule 4-36-2(c).

I stand corrected (once again). Thanks JR

[ScifiREF]

What's the procedure?

B1 fouls A1 doing an unsuccessful shot. While heading to table to report A1 and B1 push each other partner call double technical foul. How do you handle this.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by ScifiREF

What's the procedure?

B1 fouls A1 doing an unsuccessful shot. While heading to table to report A1 and B1 push each other partner call double technical foul. How do you handle this.

You always penalize everything in the order that they occur.
- A1 will get 2 FT's for the foul on his shot.
- now penalize the double foul. No FT's and the ball goes to the POI. The POI was the 2 FT's by A1, so you just line 'em up and let A1 shoot his 2 FT's.

[sfd]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

You always penalize everything in the order that they occur.
- A1 will get 2 FT's for the foul on his shot.
- now penalize the double foul. No FT's and the ball goes to the POI. The POI was the 2 FT's by A1, so you just line 'em up and let A1 shoot his 2 FT's.

Wouldn't A1 shoot 2 FT for the foul, then penalize the Double T with POI which would be AP?

[jdw3018]

Originally Posted by sfd

Wouldn't A1 shoot 2 FT for the foul, then penalize the Double T with POI which would be AP?

The POI was where the course of the game was interrupted. It was interrupted prior to the administration of the FTs. So, you report the original foul, then report the double foul, then go back and resume the game at the POI - which was the FTs.

So, you shoot FTs just like you would have anyway. The only change is that the two players involved in the double foul were each charged with a technical foul, adding to their count for player disqualification and to each team's foul count. Right back to it at the POI, which is the FTs.