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  #1 (permalink)  
Old Thu Jan 31, 2002, 11:51pm
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Talking

Well, my first season is finally over! Now I'm back to simply pretending to be a ref on this message board.

Here are some interesting points that came up tonight/this past week (IM tourney week)/this season. There may be a question or two in here somewhere, but it's mostly just me writing to get basketball out of my system:

(1) When dealing with college intramurals, reffing doesn't get you many friends. Rather large crowd for my co-ed game tonight, many of whom knew me and walked away thinking that much less of me (not that I cared). Of course, the best teams and players are funny and polite with the refs whether they win or lose (although tempers may flare a little on the court), and I've gotten to know quite a few great guys and girls.

(2) I'm the worst ref ever. Of course, I don't give this much credence as this was from the captain/coach who thinks that NF rules are identical to NCAA rules and that I should call the NF games as such. He wanted my address to buy me a rule book (shoulda told him that I'd accept the gift of next year's - $20 less out of my pocket!)

(3) The net is not part of the basket, and touching the basket when the ball is in the basket is not offensive BI (see #2, above).

(4) There is no such thing as an offensive kick - this one has been driving me crazy all night. I blew a call - A1 comes down legally off of a rebound (no control), hits floor, ball bounces off of his leg while trying to gain control - I blow my whistle, freeze, then call a kick . I'm then blasted after the game by several refs from team A that there is no such thing as an offensive kick in NF/NCAA rules.

(5) Playing basketball makes you an expert in the rules (see #4).

(6) My favorite of the night. (I promise I'll stop after the next one!!) Captains' meeting before the co-rec championship. I give my usual line of "ALL jewlery must come off - I don't care if it's soddered on your body." The captain asks me about a girl who "just got her ears pierced but taped over them," and I explained that the earrings had to come out or the girl couldn't play. The kicker - the girl (who "just got" the earrings) came up to me and said that I had let her play with the earrings on before! Oy!

(7) A three-man system is a gift from God!!!
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Old Thu Jan 31, 2002, 11:58pm
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Quote:
Originally posted by Mark Dexter
(4) There is no such thing as an offensive kick -
You are just kidding, right?
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Old Fri Feb 01, 2002, 12:01am
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Quote:
Originally posted by BktBallRef
Quote:
Originally posted by Mark Dexter
(4) There is no such thing as an offensive kick -
You are just kidding, right?
Unfortunately, no. 95% of the people there were adamant that in NF rules, you cannot have a kick called on the offense. (Although that is technically one of our league rules which I happen to "forget" from time to time.)

BTW, if they think I'm a horrible ref, I'd hate for these guys to see a game you are officiating!
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Old Fri Feb 01, 2002, 01:40am
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Quote:
Originally posted by Mark Dexter
(4) There is no such thing as an offensive kick -
a kick is when a player intentionally kicks the ball whether offense or defense. then you said "the ball bounces off his leg" now i am confused to what you are reffering. please unconfuse me.
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Old Fri Feb 01, 2002, 05:31am
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Quote:
Originally posted by crew
Quote:
Originally posted by Mark Dexter
(4) There is no such thing as an offensive kick -
a kick is when a player intentionally kicks the ball whether offense or defense. then you said "the ball bounces off his leg" now i am confused to what you are reffering. please unconfuse me.
Crew,Mark is saying he called a "kicking the ball" violation when a player kicked it unintentionally-i.e.he screwed up the call and knew it.The players typically had no idea what the rule actually is,so they came up with the "offensive kick" doo-doo when they complained about his call.
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Old Fri Feb 01, 2002, 11:20am
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Quote:
Originally posted by crew
Quote:
Originally posted by Mark Dexter
(4) There is no such thing as an offensive kick -
a kick is when a player intentionally kicks the ball whether offense or defense. then you said "the ball bounces off his leg" now i am confused to what you are reffering. please unconfuse me.
Crew, trust me, I know what a kick violation is. In this case, A1 was on the ground (without posession, so it wasn't a travel on the rebound ) with his legs somewhat askew. While he was bobbling the ball, it accidentally hit one of his legs (which he had not moved into the ball), I blew the whistle, froze and called a kicking violation.

The main complaint from team A was not that A1 had not intentionally kicked the ball, but that there is no such thing as an offensive kick. When I checked our IM rules later, there is a note stating "There is no such thing as an offensive kick."

I then tried to explain to all of the parties who were complaining (who are, BTW, both IM officials) that under NFHS rules, you can have a kicked ball called against the offensive team. I agreed that it would be rare, but A1 might intentionally kick the ball (I used the example of a long pass about to be intercepted by B1 - A1 cannot steal the pass back, so he kicks the ball to avoid the turnover.)

Of course, even after e-mailing one of the guys the relevant rules, he denies that there are offensive kicks.

(This is the same league where my supervisor (without me present) told one of the team captains that I was wrong in my insistence that the FT shooter's opponents nearest the basket cannot stand on the blocks.)
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Old Fri Feb 01, 2002, 11:26am
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Had a game two weeks ago where the offensive player
lost the ball, then as the defender was reaching down to
try and make the steal, he stuck his foot out and kicked the ball to himself. "tweet" "Kick!" Saw it later on tape, and still liked the call.
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Old Fri Feb 01, 2002, 11:48am
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offensive kick

I had a varsity game last season where my partner called 2 or 3 kicked ball violations on the offensive team in the first half. At halftime I explained to him that a kick has to be intentional and that it is primarily a call on the defense. I suppose if a kid was a soccer player and tried to save the ball from going OOB(with his feet) you could call it on the offense. I have never seen or called a legitimate kicked ball violation on the offense.
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Old Fri Feb 01, 2002, 01:34pm
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Quote:
Originally posted by Mark Dexter
Crew, trust me, I know what a kick violation is. In this case, A1 was on the ground (without posession, so it wasn't a travel on the rebound ) with his legs somewhat askew. While he was bobbling the ball, it accidentally hit one of his legs (which he had not moved into the ball), I blew the whistle, froze and called a kicking violation.
Am I missing something; you apparently recognized your error at that moment, why did you go ahead and call kicked ball?

[Edited by Slider on Feb 1st, 2002 at 12:40 PM]
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Old Fri Feb 01, 2002, 01:42pm
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Quote:
Originally posted by Slider
Am I missing something; you apparently recognized your error at that moment, why did you go ahead and call kicked ball?
With all that was going on, I knew something wasn't right, but couldn't quite tell what I was missing (my partner was no help). It was only later on mental "instant replay" that I recognized my mistake.
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