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-   -   Get 'em both? (https://forum.officiating.com/basketball/39143-get-em-both.html)

Adam Thu Oct 25, 2007 06:35pm

Get 'em both?
 
Here's the sitch:

8th grade AAU. One team clearly outclassed by the other.

Losing team commits a turn-over and head coach and assistant coach both stand, at the same time, and scream "Jesus Chr!st!"

I gave the HC a technical foul, but wonder if I shouldn't have rung them both up.

Thoughts?

Jurassic Referee Thu Oct 25, 2007 06:52pm

Dumb question.:D

Did they both commit "T"-worthy acts? If both had told you to FO, would you only nail the head coach?

Nip it, nip it in the bud.

Btw, make sure that you give the head coach an indirect "T" for his assistants yapping also, to go along with his direct "T".

Mark Padgett Thu Oct 25, 2007 07:00pm

I agree. As the Immortal Dave would say, "It's T for two". :D

Brad Thu Oct 25, 2007 07:52pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snaqwells
Losing team commits a turn-over and head coach and assistant coach both stand, at the same time, and scream "Jesus Chr!st!"

I'm assuming that they wanted a foul call and weren't just screaming "Jesus Christ!" because their team was playing so horribly?

One whack is enough I think... Kills two birds with one stone. You can always go back and give the assistant one later! :)

zebraman Thu Oct 25, 2007 08:01pm

IMO, one T is plenty. It sends the message you want. There is also a case play (10.4.1 Sit D) where one T is called even though several coaches and subs are standing. I know that's a little different because "JC" is more unsportsmanlike, but it's still the same general idea.

Mark Dexter Thu Oct 25, 2007 08:04pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by zebraman
IMO, one T is plenty. It sends the message you want. There is also a case play (10.4.1 Sit D) where one T is called even though several coaches and subs are standing. I know that's a little different because "JC" is more unsportsmanlike, but it's still the same general idea.

I disagree.

Multiple players and coaches standing up minding their own business is one thing.

Multiple players and/or coaches standing up to yell (especially profanities) at me - each of them is getting T'ed up.

bigdog5142 Thu Oct 25, 2007 08:24pm

I am a bit confused here...if a coach gets on direct T and then gets an indirect T...is he/she ejected? Or is it two indirects and one direct? I know that two directs and three indirects equals ejection...but what about the combination?

Brad Thu Oct 25, 2007 08:26pm

A coach is ejected for two direct technicals or three direct OR indirect technicals.

Thus, the head coach could get a direct technical and an indirect tech because of the bench (i.e. assistant coach) and not yet be ejected. However, an additional technical on the bench would result in the second indirect technical on the head coach, giving him three total (one direct and two indirect) and would result in ejection.

Dan_ref Thu Oct 25, 2007 08:26pm

One T.

Idaho Thu Oct 25, 2007 08:28pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigdog5142
I am a bit confused here...if a coach gets on direct T and then gets an indirect T...is he/she ejected? Or is it two indirects and one direct? I know that two directs and three indirects equals ejection...but what about the combination?

Two directs is ejection.

Any combination of three is ejection.

So, this would not be an ejection. The coach would be one direct or one inderect away from ejection.

M&M Guy Thu Oct 25, 2007 08:54pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snaqwells
8th grade AAU.

That's why I would give 2.

tjones1 Thu Oct 25, 2007 09:01pm

I think I'm giving two here.

Although I see the two birds with one stone idea by just whacking the assistant.

26 Year Gap Thu Oct 25, 2007 09:08pm

Hey, did you put your pin on the map, JR?:D

TimTaylor Fri Oct 26, 2007 12:44am

Two T's.......

Mark Dexter Fri Oct 26, 2007 07:20am

Quote:

Originally Posted by grunewar
That's funny.

Question - what if one or two players also stood up at about the same time and mouthed off? Would you whack em all?

If it was T-worthy as an individual effort, it's T-worthy as a group. Coach is getting an early trip to the showers.

Jurassic Referee Fri Oct 26, 2007 07:42am

Quote:

Originally Posted by grunewar
Question - what if one or two players also stood up at about the same time and mouthed off? Would you whack em all?

I would personally. You do the crime, you do the time. That's only fair imo. Note that there are no hard and fast rules though. Sometimes a warning might be a better option. It's whatever feels right to do at that particular time in that particular game.

It's amazing how quickly they learn after they get whacked, "they" being everybody on the bench. Note though that I've never believed in bench watching. If I see it, I'll take care of it. If I hear it and it's exceptionally bad but I can't identify who said it, I'll get the person responsible for bench conduct----> the coach. Works for me. Other methods may work just as well for other officials. As long as the game is controlled, who cares?

Jmo.......

FrankHtown Fri Oct 26, 2007 08:03am

Wait a minute... If they had screamed "Bhudda"...or "Confuscious" or "Ghandi" would you have T'd them up??

In this age of PC, it behooves you to consider everyone's feelings.



Sorry, I was watching Hannity and Colmbes, and Colmbes was on last. Please disregard.

mbyron Fri Oct 26, 2007 08:08am

Quote:

Originally Posted by FrankHtown
Wait a minute... If they had screamed "Bhudda"...or "Confuscious" or "Ghandi" would you have T'd them up??

In this age of PC, it behooves you to consider everyone's feelings.

Sorry, I was watching Hannity and Colmbes, and Colmbes was on last. Please disregard.

Wasn't very funny to begin with, but then you screwed up every name in here except Hannity's. That might send a message.

mbyron Fri Oct 26, 2007 08:34am

You go girl! I agree!

tomegun Fri Oct 26, 2007 10:32am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee
I would personally. You do the crime, you do the time. That's only fair imo. Note that there are no hard and fast rules though. Sometimes a warning might be a better option. It's whatever feels right to do at that particular time in that particular game.

It's amazing how quickly they learn after they get whacked, "they" being everybody on the bench. Note though that I've never believed in bench watching. If I see it, I'll take care of it. If I hear it and it's exceptionally bad but I can't identify who said it, I'll get the person responsible for bench conduct----> the coach. Works for me. Other methods may work just as well for other officials. As long as the game is controlled, who cares?

Jmo.......

Control, especially for high school and below is the key and where I think we are failing. A lot of these things happen because one official, then a crew, then an association let them happen. Start handing out Ts like it is next Wednesday and I bet they would stop all the BS. As much of it at least.

Adam Fri Oct 26, 2007 10:57am

Quote:

Originally Posted by tomegun
Control, especially for high school and below is the key and where I think we are failing. A lot of these things happen because one official, then a crew, then an association let them happen. Start handing out Ts like it is next Wednesday and I bet they would stop all the BS. As much of it at least.

Last year was my first year in this association, and my first year doing the boys AAU league this happened in. I had a coach T in three straight games. One ran right through a warning. The "JC" scream. And an AC coach stood up to complain along with his HC when I called their star athlete for a travel right before he got fouled.
Things went much more smoothly after that.

Junker Fri Oct 26, 2007 11:21am

Just the head coach is enough to me. I'd make sure sometime soon after that he got a message from me or my partners that he better maintain control of his bench.

jer166 Fri Oct 26, 2007 11:37am

IMO the head coach call was a good one. If there is a problem with the message getting through & the AC continues then he gets one. Game management & control are the desirable outcomes so I believe initially one is better than two.

Adam Fri Oct 26, 2007 11:44am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Junker
Just the head coach is enough to me. I'd make sure sometime soon after that he got a message from me or my partners that he better maintain control of his bench.

They were perfect angels the rest of the game. They got the message. :)

Mark Padgett Fri Oct 26, 2007 12:03pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by FrankHtown
Wait a minute... If they had screamed "Bhudda"...or "Confuscious" or "Ghandi" would you have T'd them up??
In this age of PC, it behooves you to consider everyone's feelings.

Does that include worshipers at the Church of Elvis and/or the Church of Monday Night Football? :confused:

I think that if a coach yelled "Monday Night Football" at a call, it might be OK. :)

Dan_ref Fri Oct 26, 2007 12:46pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by FrankHtown
Wait a minute... If they had screamed "Bhudda"...or "Confuscious" or "Ghandi" would you have T'd them up??

Here's a good question...if they scream "God is great!" while putting on a large vest do you T them before you dive under the bleachers?

http://www.ahajokes.com/cartoon/training.jpg

Jurassic Referee Fri Oct 26, 2007 03:44pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dan_ref
Here's a good question...if they scream "God is great!" while putting on a large vest do you T them before you dive under the bleachers?

http://www.ahajokes.com/cartoon/training.jpg

I demand that this post be deleted. It's offensive to Afghanistan suicide bombers.

M&M Guy Fri Oct 26, 2007 03:47pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee
I demand that this post be deleted. It's offensive to Afghanistan suicide bombers.

How many are left to complain?

(Oops, now I've done it.)

Adam Fri Oct 26, 2007 03:55pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by FrankHtown
Wait a minute... If they had screamed "Bhudda"...or "Confuscious" or "Ghandi" would you have T'd them up??

;)
Long answer?

No.

Adam Fri Oct 26, 2007 03:56pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by M&M Guy
How many are left to complain?

(Oops, now I've done it.)

Whom do I complain to about all this off-topic discussion in my thread?

M&M Guy Fri Oct 26, 2007 03:59pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snaqwells
Whom do I complain to about all this off-topic discussion in my thread?

Michelle and Kim?

Adam Fri Oct 26, 2007 04:09pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by M&M Guy
Michelle and Kim?

I was really hoping for someone with some empathy.

Jurassic Referee Fri Oct 26, 2007 04:30pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by M&M Guy
How many are left to complain?

(Oops, now I've done it.)

Well, the ones waiting for their exam, silly.:rolleyes:

M&M Guy Fri Oct 26, 2007 04:33pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee
Well, the ones waiting for their exam, silly.:rolleyes:

Figures.

Shows my lack of understanding of other cultures.

M&M Guy Fri Oct 26, 2007 04:34pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snaqwells
I was really hoping for someone with some empathy.

Like you're gonna find that around here?... :rolleyes:

Adam Fri Oct 26, 2007 04:46pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by M&M Guy
Like you're gonna find that around here?... :rolleyes:

Hey, I'm the skeptic around here. Back off.

Dan_ref Fri Oct 26, 2007 04:46pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by M&M Guy
Like you're gonna find that around here?... :rolleyes:

Shut up.

jer166 Fri Oct 26, 2007 04:55pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by M&M Guy
Michelle and Kim?

http://www.winnetkabullets.com/complaint.jpg

Adam Sat Oct 27, 2007 04:58pm

Leave Michelle and Kim out of this. They're good people.

mick Sat Oct 27, 2007 05:40pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by M&M Guy
Like you're gonna find that around here?... :rolleyes:

Hey! Watch it!
I feel badly that no one feels badly.

mbyron Sat Oct 27, 2007 07:40pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snaqwells
Leave Michelle and Kim out of this. They're good people.

For those of you who don't know Michelle and Kim, you can see them here:
YouTube


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